Stranger tried to punch me while holding my little girl!

[SomebodysSome1]

Hey guys, ok this is really difficult for me to process. I am so traumatised I literally am struggling with the idea of leaving my home.

First of all, I am a professional, I have a hella lot of confidence, stand in front of classes of kids (who are the worst critics) and have worked in Pupil referral units which basically are for students who have been kicked out of mainstream- none of the behaviour management Stuff phases me.

What happened to me on Tuesday has shook me to the core.
I have two small babies, one that is 19 months old, one that is 3.5 years old, potty training. I was with my husband in a Pizza Express in a known area of Town that is usually quite nice. A place I visit, I am local to, and a place I frequent with my children and other mums from school at least once a month.

I took my little girl to the little girls room in between starters and mains. I got to the loo, took her to an open cubicle and let her do her very quick wee. Was super happy she was having a dry day and told her so. got her gear on and walked out of the cubicle and bent down to pull her sleeves up. I put on the tap and a lady who was in the bathroom having just washed her hands and dried them came back to the sink, stood in front and started playing with her hair.
By this time I have picked up my 3 year old with sleeves up, tap still running from when I have turned it on and lady still standing in front (didn't even think anything of it, waited patiently and praised my childs effort for communicating with me for her need to go to the loo- we were having a full dry day!)
Now what happened next just plays over and over in my mind...

This lady, caucasian, relatively well dressed, looking at me intermittently through the mirror while playing with her hair and sighing a lot makes eye contact with me and says "Stop smiling at me you condescending B*", now I am totally taken a back, a little in denial and still holding an increasing heavy little girl I happened to respond right back with "Excuse me, what was that? What did you say" To which she.... turned completely and repeated herself louder and emphasised the swear word to my face... She has moved out the way of the sink, is clearly mega angry with me and I move over to wash my daughters hands while responding " Could you please not swear in front of my child"....

NOW THIS, this is what I cannot get my head around, kid in right hand wrapped around right hand side of my body as I am using left hand to bend down and wash her, glancing over at the woman intermittently.... this was her unbelievable response to a reasonable request....

"F off, You Fking shut your mouth" and then leaping for me, now my child is on my right hand side and she is standing by the door to the right of me, ergo, my fear is my child as she lunges over. briefly by a hair misses my face which she had a fist ready for!!! I must have gone into fight or flight, I was yelling at her to get away from me as I made a b-line for the door, ran out the corridor to my husband and was yelling "Theres a woman in the toilet who tried to punch me while I have a child in hand, for smiling!!" I must have yelled it over and over and begged the working personnel to raise the alarm and call the police.

Thing is... police eventually came when my husband rang them and the staff were good to keep her away from us. I was scared and shaking!
I don't know if it was adrenaline! I just don't know. the staff asked the lady to leave- she didn't. The staff refused to serve her and the whole while I just wanted the police to come asap. I was literally in shock.

Now police came and split up and one came to take my story and one hers. Now when they both came back to me, it seemed that the other lady has no priors (my husband, a surgeon was sure she must be on the mental health spectrum, was expecting the police to manage the situation). Turned out according to officers she has no priors so theres not much they can do. Erm.... what? My husband asked she be escorted to leave and they were making a case that its a waste of police time to log anything. WHAT?

Then after more confusion and conversation between officers, the officer who spoke to her seemed more empathetic to her as "she is quite emotional and has said she's sorry" Erm..... what?

At the time I just couldn't think straight but at that time my officer asked me what I wanted the options being they could ask her to leave or just relay she's had a word with and won't be bothering me again.... My husband pushed for her to be asked to leave to which my response and understandably was, if she gets asked to leave and is disgruntled she will wait outside for us and with two babies she could follow us to the car or something. I was still scared, of a middle aged woman who attacked me with child in hand- for SMILING!!!!!!

Now sitting at home and gathering myself! I just can't get over the way everything happened, how it was dealt with.
in the end the lady was escorted home and I was to receive a crime report number via text message later in the evening, although I should expect that nothing would happen or be taken further...

Text message never arrived. I am not sure what exactly is the response to the fact she can do that in a public place with someone she doesn't know and is carrying a child. It doesn't bring me much comfort and I want advice on how to a) chase this up and b) to pursue a result from this. I literally keep reliving it and it is keeping me up, I just am struggling with the idea of grocery shopping now.

I have tried to find advice. Where is the legal standpoint here? I am a woman of light brown/olive colour and I cannot help but think that had it been the other way around I would have left in handcuffs. I am so scared to take my kids out now and I just cannot look at middle aged 'nice' ladies the same. I never thought a middle aged woman could be such a threat. I am really struggling with it all to be honest.

Please help! any advice please.
SG
Londoner in Birmingham

I'm sorry this happened to you. I think most people have had encounters with these types of people before, and it will happen to you again at some point and it's horrible.

You asked specifically 'What did I do? What could I have done differently to have that happen to us?' You need to be tuned in to the people around you in order to keep safe. You were performance parenting, getting in someone's personal space (all three of you around one sink), have acknowledged you were trying to get eye contact to make her do what you wanted, in your timescales (you wanted her to move, she hadn't finished) and by the language you use I suspect you ooze privilege. Those are all triggers to these types of people.

It's one of the things I'm actively trying to teach my teens; notice these people, no eye contact and move on quickly and inconspicuously. Technically you shouldn't need to, in practice it prevents these nasty situations.

you sound a bit unhinged to me

There we are. I was just thinking that this MN thread will not be complete without a "you sound a bit unhinged" comment. Well done.

This woman nearly got punched by an actually unhinged stranger while holding her child, which must be a very frightening experience, and she is getting pulled apart for being overly descriptive...

You were performance parenting, getting in someone's personal space (all three of you around one sink), have acknowledged you were trying to get eye contact to make her do what you wanted, in your timescales (you wanted her to move, she hadn't finished) and by the language you use I suspect you ooze privilege

Yes, this is the impression I had, as well.

OP, I'm a white person who has seen my white family members be subject to straightforward racism (irish). I understand exactly why you would tell people that you are professional people. When you encounter prejudice, particularly from public services that you expect to be entirely even handed, it's human nature to try to protect yourself and your family from being treated as less than. And it works. I have seen the revelation that one of us was at Oxford change the attitude of the police who wrongly arrested one of my siblings. And usher him out of the cells. (And my mother had a senior officer come to her house much later to apologise because she is the bomb.)

The first thing I thought was 'I bet she's black'. What is wrong with all you mumsnet freaks? Black woman gets punched in the toilets and she's in the wrong for telling you her colour? Why do we monitor race and disability and sex and outcomes, if not to check for prejudice?

OP, it sounds awful. Horrendous. And I think not having the support you expected from the police can make that much worse. You initially feel utterly thrown that people can be so crazily awful, but you expect normal people to be shocked and on the side of the victim. It doesn't feel like that happened at all. And then that undermines your sense of security in a broader sense.

My understanding of allowing kids to process this is that it's good to create a narrative that says bad thing happened but then good people helped. Not sure how convincingly you can pull that one off!

No advice OP, just

My closest experience was being chased up the High Street by a random stranger, an older woman, shouting that she remembered what I'd done. I was able to assess quickly that she was no physical danger to me, and I threatened to call the police, at which point she backed off.

Still, the incident left me shaken, and I didn't even have children with me. What I do remember is afterwards going over every little detail, of me and my actions, to work out what I had done wrong.

Of course, I had done nothing wrong, and neither have you.

And while I agree that the police will only be able to work with very solid facts it seems perfectly natural to me that you would catch at details which seem irrelevant to others. You are processing a traumatising incident. Others have given good advice on how to be around your daughter, but you should be able to say what you like here.

While it sounds scary, the Police can't do anything for harsh words spoken.

Making threats is a criminal offence.

@MargeryB
Your post is spot on,
OP tells of her gilded life suggesting things like this shouldn’t happen to middle class wonders like herself.
The detail of a small childs toilet trip are ridiculous and precious as is the running out screaming, it was unpleasant but there’s no need for the wee girl to be affected in the way OP is describing, parents need to show DC how to be resilient not making unneccessary dramas linger on.

Blimey what a drama
Stay factual
Follow up with the police by all means but don’t expect anything to come if it

I am so sorry this happened to you and just wanted to add my voice to the sympathetic posters here. I am (probably naively) shocked by the lack of police action and by the unsympathetic posts on here!

You poor thing. I would also be scarred and furious if it were me and I really hope you find a way to take it further, either with criminal charges or a civil action. People should not get away with things like this, it just emboldens them.

I say this as someone who has been attacked. I was battered with a truncheon by a security guard on holiday, for no reason whatsoever. I've also been followed by a guy with a knife. I've been attacked twice by an Ex. I have never frothed over those attacks or re-lived them, or lost sleep...yada yada yada. You just have to get on with stuff. The Police have far more serious stuff to deal with, than 2 women playing handbags at dawn, in Pizza Express

You sound extremely damaged and that explains your very odd response. Normal people don't list the things that you claim have happened to you and follow it up with "I just got on with it, no sleep lost".... it's not normal to be so accepting of violence against you so I hope the OP will ignore your post

I am struggling to believe what I am reading on some of these replies. Pp has basically said as you were interacting with you lo and you ooze privilege,( what the fuck) you deserve a smack in the face, seriously!!!!
Op that was a horrible situation you were in and i would push until it is at least logged. Two many incidents these days where the perpetrator gets away with their actions and excuses made. Meanwhile the victim is meant to just take it and move on.

@HuskyloverI

It isn't the OP who sounds unhinged. That would be you minimising an assault. I wonder why. Has OP annoyed you in some way?

@HuskyloverI You're saying that perhaps the OP did something to deserve the assault? Then perhaps you did something each time you got attacked?
Did the security guard really attacked you with his truncheon for no reason whatsoever? Or did you give him a funny look?
When your ex assaulted you twice, perhaps you also gave him a funny look that triggered him?

Someone did this to me

1000’s of people on a Saturday afternoon. Some guy beating his wife up. Reflexes made me run up whilst carrying my child to stop him. He ran after me. Turns out he knifed some boys straight after. I had my 1 yr old on my arms

No one did a thing. Not when he was openly beating up his wife. Or when he tried to attack me

I’ve energy even thought of suing. I wanted him arrested. And he was. Only because of the knifing incident. Not because of what he did to his wife or me.

@1forsorrow “contact your local station” 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

@iem0128 @Itsonlywords @gingersausage @Straycatstrut @FieldOfFlameAndHeather @Handsoffisback @Fourtights @HuskyloverI

When I read the OP all I got was fear and anxiety pouring out of it. I live my the mantra of 'people are generally good' but I do despair at how others could read the OP and then decide to take the time to reply and give her a little kick while she's obviously so down. I don't go in for the whole jump-on-the-lastest-bandwagon-meme so I'll just stick with the good old 'If you've got nothing nice to say, don't say anything'. All you had to do was press the back button and move on.

All I thought when OP put in all the detail about her life if that (in her distress) she's clearly trying to process the fact that she is usually very confident and capable with the fact that she felt so powerless in that situation.

OP - you've had some great advice from others above (especially about how to help your daughter cope with this). All I'll add is that it's good to talk about it: on here, to your husband, to a professional- whatever works for you. You're coming to terms with the fact that you can't always protect your children. We've all driven past bad car crashes or seen them in the news, but we still take our children out. We put in all the possible precautions we can, but ultimately we could be involved in an accident through absolutely no fault of our own.

It is very very unlikely that this will ever happen again. Surround yourself with people if you need to at first when you go out; get a friend to accompany you to the toilet if you feel the need, but ultimately try not to let this incident impact on you indefinitely.

That must have been utterly terrifying, I'm so sorry. I'm shocked that isn't going to be taken further.

gingersausage, have you ever worked in a police station when a complaint comes in? I doubt it.

@HuskyloverI you know all those things that have happened to you? They are not normal. You don’t need to take such events in your stride and go about your day. There’s no shame in needing to process things and feeling trauma. If the violent incidents you describe have been like water off a duck’s back to you then that suggests a level of desensitisation which is, in itself, a result of trauma.

You were performance parenting, getting in someone's personal space (all three of you around one sink), have acknowledged you were trying to get eye contact to make her do what you wanted, in your timescales (you wanted her to move, she hadn't finished) and by the language you use I suspect you ooze privilege

None of this ^ even if it happened this way means she should have been assaulted. What is wrong with some people? Op is obviously trying to process something which she found scary. Gobsmacking how heartless some of you actually are.

This is a very depressing thread. Full of victim-blaming and some posts with so little empathy it saddens me.

I don't want to detract from the situation, which sounds to me as though you were the victim of a racially motivated assault by someone who is not only racist, but also violent and mentally unstable. It doesn't have to be documented with "priors" - next time she does this, it'll come up as "no priors" as the police have brushed off this incident. I don't know what to say about this, other than that this country is totally fucked up and people get away with allsorts. The police don't have enough money or officers and this situation is the result. Unfortunately, the majority of us law abiding people have to live in this situation and need to protect ourselves because the police cannot.

Anyway, having lived with someone nasty and violent, there are things that you can do to protect yourself and your children. The moment she said, "Stop smiling at me you condescending B*", that was the moment (in my opinion) that you should have grabbed both kids and got the hell out of there: no hand washing, nothing, just run. I don't want this to sound victim blaming, the fault is always with the perpetrator. But that perpetrator is going to perpetrate so you need to get away from them. She showed you by saying that one line that she violated social norms and was unstable and unreasonable. You cannot reason with unreasonble people so you needed to get away. She was already aggravated by the time you asked her not to swear in front of your child. Whilst this request is reasonable when put to a reasonable person, to an angry abusive person, it's like a red rag to a bull. And so she then went for you physically beacuse she is unstable.

I am really sorry that this happened to you OP.
The woman indeed sounds like she has mental health issues but that is in no way a valid or any excuse at all for her behavior.

I hope some day soon she’ll do the same thing to a female professional MMA fighter and then karma will present her the bill for what she has done to you and quite likely, to others as well.

I agree with pp to take it further and not letting the police to just brush it off. For your own mental wellbeing and to protect a potential next victim.
Also, get some counseling, get some professional advice as well on how to help your DD.

All the best to you and your family

Gadgnkk

I completely agree.

Pick your battles op. It wasn't your fault, at all, but that's cold comfort now after the altercation. In future just ignore and get yourself away. You shouldn't have to but you cannot reason with some people and you don't know how they will react.

I can't believe the amount of victim blaming that's going on. OP have us enough details to be able to picture the scene accurately. She didn't say that she believed she was assaulted by a mad woman because of the colour of her skin. She merely wondered if the police's response would have been different of she had been the one committing the crime. How is she playing the race card? Those making comments like 'I'm offended as a black woman don't make this a race thing' are the real drama queens in my eyes. Yes OP does sound middle class and so what... She's worked undoubtedly very hard to provide a safe environment for her child only for a stranger to burst that safety zone. They will all have to learn from this experience as a family and find a way to move on. But first this needs to be followed up on. Even if the vile criminal woman only gets sent a letter warning her about her behaviour it will be something; a consequence to her actions. How very dare she?!