Infertility Rant!

[loopylou1984]

Thread two moving on from infertility meltdown!
Feel free to join us to rant about any part of the infertility journey

Shell - I can't remember if I've said this before as I don't go on MN that often at the moment, but in case not, congratulations!!! When is your DD? Look forward to hearing all about what's going on!

Sammy, good luck with the ET, I hope all goes well. I know how frustrating it is to have to wait but it will have improved your chances now you're feeling better

How are you chops, any sickness still? I'm 30 weeks now and have been started on iron tablets, which aren't very nice - worth it though, I guess. The house is being painted at the moment so is upside down, we still have no kitchen, the lodger won't go - I'm hoping that the babies hang on for a good few weeks!!

Hope everyone else is doing well too!

ruby! 30 weeks! Wow! Hope you get the house sorted soon! Twins usually come early don't they? Why on earth can't you kick your lodger out? I've not been sick for a whole week, touch wood. I've been on iron for 3 weeks already and finding them a pain to remember. 3 a day! And not meant to take them with certain foodstuffs and antacids etc. Which reminds me... Need to take my lunch time dose! Do keep in touch when you can!

sammy time will fly. Is it a good thing to have ET on your anniversary or not? Might give you higher expectations if it's a special day.

Hope you're OK Aussie and shell x

Hi ladies, hope you all are well

unfortunately, bad news! I had my preg test date last Wednesday and it was 'inconclusive'. since then i have been going in literally every day for blood tests and it seems as if its a early miscarriage! and my levels keeps on dropping slowly.

the thing i dont seem to understand is they transferred 2 top grade embryos and for the miscarriage to take place shows it cant be a implantation issue so then why? i was under the impression that i had 70% chance so how can this happen?

as sad as this news has been to take in (cried loads and loads) but its out of my control and now im just trying to think of what next xxx

I am in the U.S. and wondering if anyone else is, and how the experience of women in other countries compares. Here there is so much money involved it's impossible to trust the doctors. I am wondering how much of a difference socialized medicine makes. Also, the pro-life brigade has such a strangle hold on women's medicine that it is difficult to get proper treatment. I have repeated missed miscarriages. I suffered with a lingering fetus that held on for weeks with a nonviable heart rate (less than 80 at 6, 7, and 8 weeks), but the doctors wouldn't give me any medicine to end it because as long as there is a heart beat it is considered life and would be an abortion. It was awful. I kept thinking they were monsters, because if the fetus could feel it was suffering terrible, as well as myself. The situation culminated in a major bleed that almost killed me when I finally ruptured. Now I am in the process of getting a passport. I am only two hours from Canada. If this happens again I am going to try to cross the border for help. Any thoughts or insight on U.S. vs Canadian healthcare?

Chops, no not a good thing. I can think of far better ways to spend my anniversary! Maybe we'll celebrate a week early! It also puts test date rather close to my birthday .

Notrust - I'm not sure anyone is in the US, but I'm sure everyone will sympathise, your experience sounds awful! You poor thing.
Canada can't be worse surely can it?
Anyway, this is a lovely supportive thread, so feel free to rant/ask question etc. xx

Thanks Ruby

Aussie - so sorry about your results, I hope you're being looked after.
I think you were just unlucky, and once you're over the shock you can sort out the next step. Do you have any frosties? Or will it be another fresh cycle. Xx

Sorry to read your news Aussie its not fair

ET on your anniversary eh sammy! I had ET around my birthday. Of course, since it worked, it was the best birthday present of all and I hope the same applies to you.

I've been where you are and feel your pain aussie. My second last IVF resulted in a day 3 transfer of 2 top quality embryos at 11 & 13 cells. Embryos are normally 6-10 cells at day 3. I read that embryos which are faster to divide have a higher chance of not making it, but if they do, they are the strongest embryo of all. So once I was pregnant with my fast dividing embryos, I wasn't expecting an early m/c. Knowing it wasn't an embryo issue based on this information, I did research and found one study that showed women who took 2mg estrogen post EC had a 20% m/c rate, while women who took 4mg had a 2% m/c rate. It certainly shows that hormones play a part and are responsible for m/c as well as genetic issues. It's just so frustrating not being able to know exactly what it is in your circumstances and what to change for next time. Personally I took 4mg estrogen after last EC and this time the embryo stuck around, so it could be fluke but that study certainly seems to indicate it could have helped.

Thanks for your congrats ruby. Can't believe your house renovations are still going on!

welcome notrust. I am in Australia so have no experience with USA to Canada. I do email a girl in USA who had IVF there and can't believe how much they charge! I noticed that with USA, the Drs and clinics love having great success statistics, which I think is not really an indicator of their expertise. In Australia, I had 7 IVF egg retrievals before I finally got a golden embryo because I only produce 3-4 eggs at a time. In the USA, I would have been cancelled because I would be told their is limited chance of success, when really I would just be a hindrance to their statistics and would never have got my dream baby. Repeated miscarriages must be emotionally draining. Have you been given any insight as to why this is happening?

Woohoo on not being sick for a whole week chops! The nausea is awful isn't it. Wish I could apply to somewhere to get credit for time served - after our emotional infertility paths to get to this point, don't we just deserve glowing nausea-free pregnancies?!

shell I spoke too soon! I was sick the same day as posting that! I've also had a hell of a time today. I had severe pains this morning and had to have an ambulance called. Luckily me and baby chops are fine and now resting at home but with no real explanation. Gave me quite a scare though!!

I got my bfp on my birthday too guys :-)

Chops - that must have been scary. Really glad you're ok. X

Thanks for answering! I hope you're doing well. The whole fertility thing is such a mess. I'm 44 and started trying at 42. In two years I have had, in the listed order, a blighted ovum that required a D and C, a missed miscarriage at 6 1/2 weeks, 2 chemical pregnancies, a regular miscarriage at nine weeks that required a D and C, and another missed miscarriage at 7 1/2 weeks, which was just a couple of weeks ago. The doctors are just now starting to take notice with this last miscarriage. They were chalking everything up to age, also they said a blighted ovum doesn't count as a miscarriage because there was never an embryo, and my chemical pregnancies don't count because I never got to a doctor to prove I was pregnant before I got my period, so undocumented means 'the crazy middle aged woman made it up'. They don't believe a woman my age could still get pregnant so many times. I'm not on any type of treatment, and I think that's the problem. It's like you said about American doctors and statistics, according to their statistics I am too old to still get pregnant like this, and so they have no interest in trying to figure out why I miscarry.

That pain sounds scary chops - when is your actual due date again? Although from memory I am sure it is too early to be anything like braxton hicks. Where was the pain? Glad you're both okay... albeit still nauseous.

Having done repeated IVF notrust, I have read all the statistics and how they have tested eggs from 40+ women and found that 9 out of 10 eggs are genetically abnormal. So I can imagine that the doctors are quick to assume that this is your issue without any need to test to figure out why. What sort of testing is it that you are interested in? Are you wanting to have bloods done on yourself to see if you have any issues, or are you referring to testing the actual miscarried embryo. Even if the Drs are right and the embryos are genetically abnormal due to 'maternal age', at least by them testing it for you, it would enable you to confirm this and understand and accept the reason so surely they would be willing to do it on that basis. Although I know with IVF I had the option of doing genetic testing on the embryos to ensure they were genetically normal before being transferred, but it costs many thousands and I could not afford it so I just kept repeating IVF again and again until finally my 32nd egg was normal and got matched with a normal sperm and stuck.

TO SHELLSTER52 I just got a new Doctor who thinks I might have a clotting disorder, so she is finally going to run some tests. Interestingly, she is a gynecologist, not an obstetrician or a fertility specialist. It all goes back to money. She does not deal with pregnant women, so she has no interest in trying to push expensive treatments on me, so she's just looking for obvious causes that would affect women of any age. It's crazy here in the USA. I'm reading about all the low cost treatments women get in the UK and it makes me so jealous. I know all the stats on older women and abnormal eggs. If my miscarriages are due to old eggs and not something in my health I am willing to keep going, and if it is something in my health that can be treated I will also keep going. Statistically speaking, even if 80% of my eggs are bad I should eventually get a good one. I'm willing to keep trying until I'm 49, then go for donor eggs. Fifty is the cut off for IVF donor eggs, but what would be the point of trying donor eggs if my body is the problem?

shell the only thing they came up with was a bad reaction to my iron tablets. There was nothing going on with baby or my womb thank God. The pain seemed everywhere at the time but I guess it was really belly button up? It was so bad I was unable to get up off the floor and i was dizzy and drenched in sweat. That's when I called the emergency number. I'm still on the iron tablets as I'm still anaemic and probably will be for the rest of the duration. Hope you are well x

Sorry I've not said hi notrust I'm sorry about your issues and I hope you can get some answers soon. I know nothing about the American system I'm afraid x

I have no trust in the professionals and feel thoroughly let down by a series of doctors and consultants.

I'm 42 and since we started trying 3 years ago I have had what a i (wrongly?) call 4 mc's but really it is 1 blighted ovum, 2 miscarriages and 1 chemical.

Last year I did 6 months on clomid and that resulted in one of the miscarriages.

I did private IVF in October last year and got two good embryos but they didn't stick. I had one FET in February which resulted in the chemical.

Ive had all the blood clotting tests available and nothing has come up.

I got pregnant naturally in April and miscarriage in June. After a D&C I was discharged from the gynae clinic and I'm out on my own now.

There is nothing I can do and I feel utterly hopeless and alone with no help from anyone.

I am so desperate and very tearful.

I have bought some Clomid online months ago from a US company and I'm considering taking it tonight as I have no access to professionals anymore. I can't afford to go private and see a consultant again.

I will make an appointment to see my GP as i think i have depression.

calmed down now. Went for a walk with the dog on the beach and phoned GP to make an appointment : )

Oh Annie, you sound so down. I'm glad you have a doggy distraction, pets are amazing at helping us cope with the bad times. We've just got a puppy, and she's certainly taking my mind off our ttc worries.

I'm glad you've made a doctors appointment, I think it would do you good to talk to someone. Did your clinic offer counselling?

Of you can't afford the private IVF here would you consider going abroad?
Or would adoption be a consideration? X

hi Anniehoo, your situation sounds a lot like mine, lots of miscarriages and no good doctors. Accept that I haven't had any tests yet, and I haven't done any fertility treatments or donor eggs. But I just had a meeting with a doctor who is finally taking me seriously and that I trust. No tests have ever been done because they keep saying it's age, even when I tell them my great grandmother and grandmother had chronic miscarriages and they were young. There is a book, The impatient woman's guide to getting pregnant, by Twenge. She talks about the statistics on IVF fertility treatments and basically says it's all a scam. The success rate is better if you just let your own body do the work, because the harvesting process damages eggs, and eggs that are borderline (which is what women our age have) that might still be viable if left to ovulate the natural way are actually ruined, it's all about money. I believe the reason my previous doctor was so rude and unwilling to help is because I told him that. Twenge says if you are willing to tolerate multiple miscarriages your chances of success are still better the natural way. I believe it. I intend to keep going until I'm at the maximum age for donor eggs and then try that route, unless these tests I'm finally getting reveal some disorder that would rule that out. I highly recommend the book, talks about nutrition and things you wouldn't even think about that can damage fertility.

It must be nice to have a Dr who is finally doing something practical and going to run some tests for you instead of you just wondering what is going on. Yes, I too am jealous of women having IVF 100% funded on the UK NHS system that I read about on here - although I had 11 attempts at IVF before I was successful so the NHS wouldn't have funded all that anyway! Let us know how you get on with your testing. Would you consider taking the actual uterine material for testing if you did have another miscarriage (although I hope you don't)? Just to help give you answers for what is causing this? Or is that too expensive in USA? And has any Dr ever tested your FSH /AMH levels or would this new Dr be willing to test this so you can get an idea of your fertility levels if she is sending you for other blood tests anyway?

Chops, that sounds awful. It seems like they are grasping at straws thinking the iron tablets could have caused it. But glad everything is okay. A slight insight into what childbirth will be like eh! That pain might seem like a walk in the park after you've given birth!!

Annie, I have thought about you from time to time since we used to chat on the other IVF thread. Lovely to hear from you here - although obviously would be nicer if the circumstances were different. I wish there was something I could say to fix everything for you as I just feel your pain so well knowing what I went through. I too have bought Clomid online in the past, desperate to try anything and everything. It's so emotionally draining and impossible to take a break because we don't want to waste a month of trying so there is just no end. I feel for you. xox.

It's all very quiet! Is everyone having intermittent log in issues like me? Xx

I'm just keeping quiet as I have no advice to give our newcomers :-( I'm feeling more and more out of the world of infertility ... Hope you are OK sammy and your transfer won't be too delayed x

Chops - that's a good thing!
Please don't leave us completely though, I want to hear when your boy arrives :). Xx

Is anyone left on here??
I miss you all, come back!
Cd7 (i think, trying to take enough temps to ensure FF can confirm ov so I know when to expect baseline scan etc! Xx

Hi Sammy, I'm still here, not much news though! Had my 32 week scan today, it's looking like a c section at 38 weeks for me.

When is your next clinic appointment? Good luck with the temping, I was rubbish at it but have heard it's great when you get the knack!

Wow Ruby, nearly there!!!

We have our nhs appointment on the 21st, but will have already paid for the private drugs by then, so will most likely do a fully private frozen round anyway.
It depends when AF arrives, but cd 8 now, so likely another 20 days, and baseline scan in just over three weeks. Xx