Assisted conception after recurrent miscarriage part 7

[brownstag]

Here's the new thread, ladies.

You're never insensitive, Nanny. I understand what you're saying about the ANAs. I supose the whole thing is a bit of paradigm shift for me; I've been so used to thinking of myself as dried-up hag with disintegrating eggs that the thought that my miscarriages could be primarily immunological is quite mind-blowing. Previously I've thought of the steroids as a necessary but not sufficient condition for pregnancy; now they've assumed much greater importance in my mind.
As to DE, in an ideal world, with unlimited cash, surrogacy would be the ultimate test for both you and Pebbles. Neither of you have any reason to think there's something wrong with your eggs, but there is something going on in your bodies to prevent full-term pregnancies. Unfortunately willing surrogates don't grow on trees. I'd do it for you, Nanny, but I don't think you'd find me of much use. :) It's funny that, isn't that? I've always been a blood donor, on the Anthony Nolan register, etc and if I could I would be a surrogate (once I'd completed my own family). I would love to be able to do that for someone. But sadly I'm the least qualified for the job!

nanny is right I tested negative for all hidden infections. I was slightly dubious village as everyone seemed to test positive and was amazed to actually test negative for a problem!
I did take anti b's for a few weeks before ivf and didn't get on too badly wit them.

Ari dh had died fragmentation test in Serum and he was all fine, Penny was really happy with his results. We discussed dqa testing and Penny thought it wasn't worth testing at the time but maybe it's something we should revisit before wasting anymore money and going down donor egg route. I would really love to try donor eggs but if my womb is in to poor condition I don't want to throw more money at it.

pebbles would you try surrogacy seeing as you can harvest lots of eggs? Do you think your niece would do it for you once she has had her baby? A friend of mine offered to do it for me but was pointless seeing as they wouldn't get enough eggs from my rubbish supply. I know there are websites that can put you in touch with donors. I know you wouldn't experience pregnancy but at least it would result in your own baby.

village one of the mums at dds school was 46 when she fell pregnant with her son. They had years of infertility with failed ivf and had given up when conceived naturally. My friends sister in law also conceived naturally at 45 with her first again after trying ivf etc for years so it can happen.

Hi Everyone

Sorry to have gone a bit awol. I have been lurking, but I like to post properly, especially when everyone is going through such turmoil. Also, we are having a building project at home which starts next Monday and involves us moving out, so I am frantically packing. Luckily DH held on to his flat when we got married, so we are moving there for 6 months she says optimistically.

Pebbles I am so very, very sorry the FET didn't work. I was so hoping that this would be your turn - god knows you deserve it. You seem to be amazingly brave, especially given the situation with your niece. What did Penny have to say?

Brown very sorry for your loss too - it must be encouraging to know that you can still get pregnant, and like Duggs that elusive egg must be in there somewhere. I, too, also have a positive ANA, in fact I went to see a Rheumatologist about it years ago (during my miscarriage journey). He seemed fairly unconcerned about it to be honest, but it probably adds to the whole recurrent miscarriage recipe by the sound of things.

Village hope you are doing ok and that your sample turns up soon. Fingers crossed it will be clear and that will be one less thing to worry about.

Duggs I can't believe you are so nearly there. How exciting/nerve-wracking for you. Enjoy your last couple of weeks as much as you can It is so wonderful to have a success story on this thread, along with Ari and Sue, it still fills me, and I am sure the others, with the hope needed to continue.

I went for a follow up saline scan last week after my hysteroscopy last week. Without going in to too much detail it was really painful and a total waste of time and money. I was sooo cross with myself for not insisting on going back to see Bill Smith who originally picked up my septum. So as a result, I am waiting for AF to show up so that I can go back and see him to see whether I have healed properly before we cycle again. It is frustrating to have to wait even longer (our last cycle was in April), but I can't go through it all again, emotionally, physically and financially without knowing we are giving ourselves the best chance.

Waves to everyone else xx

That sounds nasty, Belly. Do you mean they had to abort the whole thing? Very frustrating and disappointing. There just seems to be so much variation in standards of care, as Nanny's experience shows too.
I really must be obsessed ... I had a dream last night that a new technique had been discovered for people who tend to produce only one egg despite maximum stims. They were copying the egg, like a computer file, and then fertilising them and putting back 3 instead of one. When I woke up, I thought that was quite a good idea! How feasible, who knows?

Sorry, Ari, where is it I would find the list of pharmacies who are able to do the prescriptions from Greece? Where do I find Agate's FAQs? I emailed the prescription to my local chemist and they were really helpful, spending ages looking up everything, checking the price, etc, but then at the end telling me I would need to get the original as they need a hand-written signature, not a copy. Also, it seems the prescription says tablets, but only capsules are licensed in the UK, which are made of gelatine ... but that's another matter!

sue thanks for the encouraging stories about older mums... they give me hope!

belly that sounds so frustrating. But better to have covered everything to your satisfaction before cycling again, as you say...

pebbles it's good to know that the infections test does sometimes give negative results!

brown the Agate FAQ link is
www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=274114.0

Ladies, I remember John Bowen's supplements being mentioned on here some time ago. I've just read about them again on Agate's thread. Has anyone tried them? He recommends cordyceps for implantation failure, a special "vitality herbs" blend for egg quality, and sairei-to for immune issues. I'm wondering if it's possible to overdo the immune suppressants - has anyone ever taken the latter alongside conventional meds?

Thank you, Village. I think Mel is on cordyceps. And Ari has taken John Bowen's supplements. They aint cheap, I recall. I would take them too if it weren't for that.

Brown I've contacted him and he says his supplements are compatible with conventional meds. Not cheap, no, but I reckon I don't have many months left in which to do this so the drain on my finances will be finite! Ari would love to hear about your shroom experiences if you have a moment...

village I have indeed taken sairei-to (alongside dexamethasone & prednisolone, as well as everything else I was taking!), as did my DD for her immune issues, and while I can't know whether it did the trick for me, I can definitely state it helped suppress DD's immune system. They definitely aren't cheap - you'd need to take 9 of them a day. I have found John to be a veritable font of knowledge and really very helpful; if he recommends something, I'd take it. I have a lot of respect for him, he was really helpful with DD's condition when he didn't need to be.

belly Ouch! Hope you get good news when you can go back to see the doctor you trust. It's a bloomin' minefield out there.

pebbles Well I can't say DQa is your issue, but if it were me I would certainly want to rule it out. It's not an expensive test, as these things go, and it certainly told me what our problem was!

Belly so sorry to hear that - I was thinking about you, hoping all went well. Hope your next scan next cycle will show everything fine and healed.
Village I am taking only sairei-to not others - DH is taking vitality herbs for sperm quality. I decided not to take that one beacuse it has ginseng in it which I find great and used it in past but I had to closely monitor my thyroid when on it and as at the moment my thyroid results are where they shoud be I dont want to mess that one up. I cant remember why I decided against cordyceps. You are fine to take sairei-to alongside intralipids/prednisolone etc. I am not worried about over suppressing of mu immunes.
Mel is taking them all.
Brown what a dream Are we ever thinking about anything else than getting/staying pregnant? Hmm I think all the antibiotics I took were capsules not tablets....
I was thinking about surrogacy but anyone I would trust to do it for me I wouldnt ask, really. I know peple have children through surrogacy but I can't even imagine how we would go about it and definitely couldn't afford it... I don't even remember if I talked with DH about it.... Another thing which makes me a bit -well, not that keen- is that ages ago I looked after a little baby who was born to a surrogate very early and was quite poorly. Can't remember what exactly went wrong but think she developed pre eclampsia. The parents were completely devastated. And weren't coping at all.
Sue when you were having your intralipids at ZW did you ever have issues/saw any ladies having problems with having their infusion? I am dreading Friday already...

Poor you, Nanny. It would be enough to develop a needle phobia if you didn't already have one.
Yes, re. the surrogacy, part of me wants to put a big ad on Facebook, asking for volunteers! I never mention my fertility problems on facebook, only privately to close friends, and otherwise how would anyone know? You never know, someone might be thinking they'd like to experience pregnancy but not have a baby. Or experience it again as they love being pregnant. Sometimes you want to tell people, do you know how I live? Do you know what I'm thinking about all day every day? But I come on here and do my ranting instead.
Small problem with the facebook ad idea: it's illegal, I think.
Also, I was thinking, with surrogacy, theoretically age shouldn't matter, should it? A womb is a womb. I think my sister might do it for me if it weren't that she can't stand my husband ...

Belly I know how hard all the waiting is so I hope the time passes quickly for you and all is good at the scan.

Penny us going to phone me Tuesdsy evening so r can have a chat about everything.

I seemed to have mussed all the surrogacy chat somehow. Unfortunately it is something that would just be too expensive for us, you have to pay for ivf and then all the surrogates expenses. It's aldo meSnt to be very hard to find a surrogate and can take a couple years!!

Yes I'm on them all... Mad!! Been reassured they don't affect uterine cells taking them with pred, neupogen, clexane.
Belly where did you have saline scan? I need one before ivf x

Good luck today, Nanny.

Nanny hope all goes well!

Thank you ladies It worked , hurray Same nurse as the first time 3 weeks ago, didn't get into first vein but calmly got it in next one. I drank so much before and during the infusion I has to go for a wee - with the intralipids bag still attached to my hand (was weird but managed). Hope she'll be there in 2 weeks time again.
Brown am not sure if the age of surrogate doesn't matter. Are not all the risk during pregnancy higher when older?

Great news, Nanny. I've done that before when I had my appendix out, walking round with a drip still attached.
Yes, sorry, from that point of view it does matter; I was just thinking of the success of implantation, etc, it's still my knackered old eggs that is the limiting factor. And the surrogate I was thinking of is still younger than me!
I edited a book a few years back about surrogacy in India. Amazing and so much cheaper than anywhere else, but still well out of our budget, which just about runs to supplements and the occasional scan.

Another chemical for me Am really pissed off with the nurse who messed up my intralipids a week ago.... Hope there will be another egg which will meet a sperm and create an embryo which will start implanting under better immune support.... hopefully very soon.

Oh Nanny, I'm so sorry. No wonder you're pissed off. I didn't realise you'd had a BFP. How long was it positive?

... When you said 'it worked, hurray', did you mean you had a BFP then?

Brown it was a weird cycle for me. Started to test quite early with FRER and BFN but weird evap/grey lines within the time frame. The intralipids I was supposed to have a week ago were 7DPO so was happy knowing if there was anything trying to implant intralipids would beautifully sort out immune issues. But the nurse messed it up , sadly. Than I started spotting 11 and 12DPO and proper red quite heavy bleed 13DPO in the afternoon ( which I couldn't understand as my luteal phase is 14/15 even 16days) . Thought my next cycle started and had intralipids on what would be my 14DPO/CD1.
But felt quite dizzy, and there were no clots/pain as with my normal AF so I tested last night and got feint BFP on CB+ (not digital) and IC as well. I know that nothing will come out of this one as was bleeding quite heavily for 48 hours but believe that if those intralipids got into me a week ago that line would be quite strong.
What I meant by hurray on fri was that the intralipids went where they should have - inside of my vein.
If by any miracle there is a stronger line tomorrow am (didn't test today) I will start pred/fragmin etc.
How about you Brown? How do you feel? Did you start inositol? And did you manage to get your antibiotics?

Nanny so sorry to hear this . Hope you get to talk to someone at ZW tomorrow about what's happened.

That is all very odd - but hopeful. So has the bleeding now stopped? How did you manage not to test today? :)

Yes, I started inositol and have been feeling stuff going on my ovaries. It's an inexact science as it's powder and I just guess what the right amount is each time.

They are going to post me the prescription; this month would be a good month for taking the antibiotics, as it might be a long cycle and I'm not supposed to be trying this month. But now I wouldn't be surprised if ovulation does occur on time. Does everyone obey that principle about not trying the cycle after a miscarriage? I thought I had read research saying it doesn't make any difference to your chances of having another.