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Assisted conception after recurrent miscarriage part 7

301 replies

brownstag · 08/10/2014 14:38

Here's the new thread, ladies.

OP posts:

suemays · 13/10/2014 13:42

I had a cut off point of using my own eggs at the age of 43 which would be April 2015. At that point I was looking at doing donor eggs because I didn't want to spend forever putting my life on hold. Ivf using my own eggs wasn't an option as I never responded to drugs but if I were a good responder I would have tried a tandem cycle using de and my own eggs. I think if you don't have any children and the journey has been a long one that is something to consider.
If I didn't have dd i probably would have gone down the donor route a long time ago. There is always success stories but then you could live your life in false hope where there are other routes to take. A friend of mine has two de kids and she spent 10 years deliberating on whether to do it but now says its the best thing she ever did as stopped all the heartache and upset from not trying with her own eggs.


VillageMum · 13/10/2014 13:48

I've a very banal question for anyone (nanny?) who has done the Greek infections test... and that is: how long did your sample take to arrive at Serum? Royal mail tracked said four days, but it's been a week now and so far nothing. I'm wondering whether to resend... Thanks!


Pebbles73 · 13/10/2014 13:49

Sue also made me feel ancient, I have declined Xmas at my sisters as they are not the most sensitive and can't bear to sit and watch them all fuss over my heavily pregnant neice! Means my dh & I get a lovely relaxed Xmas.

Duggs don't think it sounds cold at all, not sure that donor eggs would be the answer though as the problem seems to be my uterus. I have pcos, adenomyosis and then the immune issues and Penny said my uterus is not in great condition only as best as it can be. Really didn't want to go down the adoption route but looks like it might be the only way to get a family...

Hope everyone is doing ok.


swlondonnanny · 13/10/2014 14:00

Village can't remember exactly but it was around easter and think 10 or 11 days.


VillageMum · 13/10/2014 14:05

nanny thanks! Gosh, that long...


brownstag · 13/10/2014 14:11

Mine took a while too, Village. A week or two.

OP posts:

swlondonnanny · 13/10/2014 14:22

Brown I never realised you had yours done as well. Did you have to do the antibiotics as well?


brownstag · 13/10/2014 16:09

Yes, I tested positive for chlamydia on it. But I went to my local GUM clinic armed with my results, discussed it with the doctor there who didnt believe it for a minute, but to humour me, and despite testing negative on her 'normal' chlamydia test, she gave me the standard treatment of a single tablet. So I've never had the full course they recommend. Penny said I should have them at Serum if I come for a hysteroscopy. My DH would refuse to take his though. Did you test postiive for anything?, Nanny, sorry, I've got a mental block.

OP posts:

brownstag · 13/10/2014 16:35

Mmm. I need some expert advice please ladies.
A few weeks ago I went to the doctor because I have a painless bony lump on my elbow. It's been there for a couple of years maybe but it took a long time to go to the doctors about it - mainly because I can't easily see it myself so I kept forgetting.
I had a blood test, which happened to be in early pregnancy (about 3 days after I'd found out) including a full blood count and looking for rheumatoid factors. Everything was normal except my anti-nuclear antibody test which was weakly positive. My doctor wasn't particularly interested in that as far as my arm is concerned but I'm wondering whether that has any significance as far as the pregnancy and miscarriage were concerned. Any ideas?

OP posts:

VillageMum · 13/10/2014 18:11

brown sorry, I don't know a thing about anti-nuclear antibodies! Did you ask Mr S this question?

Could I ask you or nanny how long Penny's antibiotics course is? If she prescribes it for us we'll take it, but I expect you can't ttc while on it - and I'm just trying to look ahead and get realistic about possibly having yet another month's enforced reproductive rest when I'm desperate to crack on with things... sigh.

sue I found your friend's comments about her DE pregnancies really encouraging. Not sure if this is a route for us, but it's always good to hear about others' experiences.


VillageMum · 13/10/2014 18:17

Oh and sue by the way I love to hear about women in their late 40s having unplanned babies! If any other ladies know of mums who gave birth at 45+, please send those anecdotes my way!! Could do with some encouragement right now as I'm feeling positively geriatric Sad


swlondonnanny · 13/10/2014 19:28

Village it was 25 days for me and 40 days for my DH (Penny's sperm improving protocol). I tested positive for ureaplasma and hidden C.
Brown how high were your ANA's? 1:40? 1:80? I suppose Dr S tested that as well. Mine are positive as well. I wouldn't worry about it. It can be weak positive when you are a bit ill. Or when you have autoimmune illness. My sister has lupus but her ANA's are in 1000s. What I am trying to say is it can go up and down a bit but unless it is really high like my sister's they won't investigate any further as it generally doesn't mean that much (when weak positive). Have no idea though how the pred you were taking would influence the result , if it would bring them down a bit or not.
I also have to say that I felt realy good on those antibiotics I took. There are loads of Dr who don't believe in the hidden infections tests but to me it made loads of sense. Also in USA loads of IVF clinic use antibiotics as part of their protocols with good results. Not that it brought me a baby . But at least I tried and won't regret not giving it a go....


brownstag · 13/10/2014 19:52

I really ought to take the antibiotics. How did you go about getting and fulfilling your prescription?
I didn't ask how high my levels were. I've now found lots of stuff about low-level positive ANAs being associated with miscarriage. The treatment being pred, of course, but I'm wondering whether 2 separate immune issues mean I need something more than 25mg of pred. I've got to have it restested in 3 months. Mr S would have tested it but I'm sure it wasn't positive 6 years ago.

OP posts:

swlondonnanny · 13/10/2014 20:28

Brown the antibiotics were easy - I just forwarded the email with prescription in it to a pharmacy in east london and went to pick it next day - cost around £50 for both mine and my DH. Will look for number if you want.
Can you ask for print out of your ANAs results at your GP? Did it say anything about the pattern? Mine are speckled pattern - according to Dr Beers book those are associated with recurrent miscarriage.
I don't think they would top up your pred based on this but if you had money to have your immunes rechecked you might be put on higher protocol? If needed?
When I saw Dr Ndukwe he saw my weak positive ANAs result but didn't seem to be interested. My really high thyroid antibodies on the other hand he found really important and said they are one of mine main issues.
What I am trying to say is I wouldn't worry about it but have it rechecked, get the printout so you have it on your file and mention it to dr S when you see him next.


brownstag · 13/10/2014 20:36

Thanks. I found I had the prescription already but it's from 2012 so no longer valid presumably. I'll ask tomorrow about the ANAs. And I'll email Serum to ask them to send me another prescription.

OP posts:

swlondonnanny · 13/10/2014 20:44

Oh when they send you the prescription please ask for more omeprazole you might need it. That's how I coped with doxycycline - 1 omeprazole an hour before doxy. My stomach gets upset really easily though


Arianrhod · 14/10/2014 09:21

Wow, when this thread moves it moves! :)

pebbles So damn sorry to hear of your negative. Just a thought - has your DH ever had his sperm tested - are you sure it's all you? And have you ever had the DQa testing done? forgive me if I've asked this before, I don't remember! It's just that if either your DH's sperm isn't brilliant, or if you have a DQa issue, then no matter if you use DEs or not, it may not work. Just a thought, I'm sure Penny has many more!

Greek infection testing - I did this too, my sample took just about a week to get there. But I understand things may be a bit slower internationally at the moment due to Customs, because of the terrorist alert in place at the moment. The antibiotics, it was a 25 day course I think for both myself and OH, hard-hitting stuff, and no, no TTC (no unprotected sex at all) during this time. Apparently guys clear these infections quicker than we do, and you may just end up re-infecting your OH if you have unprotected sex before the full course is done. Having said that, I understand that Penny is of the firm opinion 'hidden' chlamydia rarely if ever fully clears up anyway, which is why she puts her IVF ladies on antibiotics during a cycle. Doxycycline I found best tolerated for me with food (just avoid dairy).

brown I too got my anti-bs from Rigcharm I think it was; it's in Agate's FAQ where best to get these from. ANAs being weakly positive I'm not sure about; one for a search on Dr B's site perhaps?

/waves to everyone


Arianrhod · 14/10/2014 09:23

brown I meant to say, prescriptions are only valid for 6 months so yes, you'll need a new one. But your OH will need to take them as well or else will likely just reinfect you. That's a toughie, as they're supposed to avoid alcohol while taking them too, which my OH wouldn't do as we were on holiday when we did the full course. After much research it seems you can have a little bit; alcohol just weakens the effect of the anti-bs but doesn't completely kill it off.


VillageMum · 14/10/2014 09:25

nanny I've been reading all this antibiotics info with great interest too, thanks! My sample arrived at Serum today, hallelujah. Just out of curiosity: has anyone ever had the infections testing done and got a negative result?


brownstag · 14/10/2014 09:31

Thanks all. Katie at Serum said that if I take the antibiotics it's better than nothing, even if DH doesn't. And Louise said the ANAs are relevant to recurrent miscarriage and I should have all the tests again. The treatment may change. Yet in the past when I've asked if I needed the testing done again, Mr S didn't push it at all, knowing I was poverty-stricken. Yet things obviously do change. I've also found research showing that low-level positive ANAs are strongly correlated with recurrent miscarriage with both unknown and known fertility problems (including uterine septum, Pebbles).

OP posts:

VillageMum · 14/10/2014 09:35

ari just saw your post! Thanks for the antibiotics info, really useful... DH and I have been off alcohol for years now while ttc, so one hardship less! Though he gets stomach upsets really easily so I think a good dose of omeprazole is going to be on the cards for him...


VillageMum · 14/10/2014 09:46

brown I keep playing hopscotch with your posts. Just saying hi! Why didn't your DH take the antibiotics, if you don't mind me asking? I'd be pretty cross with mine if he refused...


swlondonnanny · 14/10/2014 09:51

Village I think Pebbles had her done at the same time as I did and hers was negative. Also I was wandering about the same thing so before I sent mine I read about it on many forums and not everyone tested positive. I actually wasn't surprised with my results as my DH was diagnosed with ureaplasma a few years ago. Also I have recurrent BV ant the test picked on it as well. Hidden C I couldn't figure out for a while as it came back negative for C on one test but positive on other. It looks like the other test checks for any C DNA. Some of C can cause lung infections which I actually had for a long time and GP refused to treat it with AB so I put it down to that.


VillageMum · 14/10/2014 10:15

nanny thanks! This is all fascinating as I've never thought to test for infections before. Hope you are doing ok - not long now till your next intralipid transfusion.


swlondonnanny · 14/10/2014 10:29

Brown Sorry my post wasn't clear, my brain doesn't work well in the evenings. Yes I meant it the way louise said it - have a retest of immunes if you can, if not just forget it for a while as it generally at low levels doesn't affect your general health much. If you decide to recheck the immunes and also take antibiotics try to recheck immunes after you finished with antibiotics as they can lower NKcell activity/TNFa .
Also maybe I don't find weak positive ANAs so worrying as everyone in my /my mums family has them positive - it is really a question of how high not if with us.
I didn't want to be insensitive as for you this can bring the solution to miscarrying ( as you might need stronger immune protocol).
This kind of brings me back to yesterdays discussion about DE IVF and when it is time to consider it. I was thinking so much about it and still can't decide. My gut feeling is that most of my miscarriages were caused by immunes. And can't see how DE IVF would sort this out (or any IVF really if I can get pregnant naturaly). But kind of decided to give this immune plan I am on till august (will turn 40 than) and see.

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