Venables - one of the James Bulger killers - back in jail

[LadyBlaBlah]

here

Not a good advertisement for the rehabilitation programme they went on. I did hear that it was in Ireland and he tried to strangle a girlfriend..........but obviously that is not based on any factual evidence, just internet gossip.

Anyhow, difficult difficult difficult

Human rights are for humans. Nuff said

blijenuts 'Nuff said'

Nope sorry you'll have to explain to me how they aren't entitled to human rights. I don't follow.

They dont deserve human rights, are we missing the point here they murdered a little innocent boy.

They didn't behave like humans they didn't treat James like a human being. Keep them in prison,by all means treat them fair but to release them is wrong in my eyes.

I can't agree with that laughalot. Anymore than I can agree with the posters who seem determined to paint RT and JV as "poor blokes who deserve to get on with their lives"

There must be a middle ground which I can stand on, surely to God?

Denying people their Human rights is a very slippery path laughalot.

Stewie - they are not allowed any direct contact that is true. That's normal for any court case. But part of any rehab programme is getting them to admit guilt and apologise. Whilst an apology may not have been used in court, their lawyers would have seized upon it anyway.

These big news cases always get maximum publicity. As did Hindley when she apologised and Brady's lack of.

I'm not assuming they haven't. I am saying it would appear unlikely.

WhoIsAsking, I think you have summed up how I feel about it too.

But I can't even look at their pictures without shuddering (DS is nearing in age to that of Jamie when they killed him) and I wish they had never been released - I don't see how that is denying them their human rights, tbh. They would still be fed and clothed and "housed" - but they wouldn't be able to interfere with people's lives.

Ah, but their identities would still be safe. In this case as in the Moors case, any apology would be written and would be edited by lawyers before it ever reached the victim who could then respond through their lawyers.

It is encouraged in most rehabilitation cases. I should imagine they would have been asked.

I just think human rights have alot to answer for, I am not asking for anyone to agree with me.

What I don't understand is that there is a world wide injunction protecting their identity. Someone must have breached it, or are injunctions now redundant given the domain of the internet?

thumbwitch - I think part of the problem is that I know too much about what they did to him.

I just had to go and have a little bit of a cry in the loo at work because...it's just so, so fucking awful.

8 years in prison didn't feel like justice to me IYKWIM? I understand people banging on about their age and I understand also that to have moved them into an adult prison would have been fraught with problems, and yet, I still think "8 years?"

IMHO, incarceration isn't just about rehabilitation, it is also about punishment and justice being SEEN to be done, and I don't feel that this was the case in this situation. The victim's mum said when they were released that she would have found it easier to cope if they'd been given even 15 years, and I can understand where she's coming from.

WhoIsAsking - I had a little cry too. I can deal with better now, but only by blocking all the details from my mind.

"banging on" sorry, that came across in a way I didn't intend.

oh Rhubs.

I might leave this thread in a minute - I don't know why I put myself through it.

I wasn't going to post - I can't even read the basics of what they did again without having a complete meltdown - and I agree, 8y is no time considering what they did. I can't get past the "malice aforethought" thing - that they actually abducted him effectively to do what they did.

No they are not "poor blokes". They might have been rehabilitated but they did a terrible, terrible thing and they SHOULD pay for it for the rest of their lives.

whois isn't the middle grpund requiring them to serve sentence then pulling them yupb sharply if they breech licence?

ie what is happening?

the extremes being A) poor boys, say soory and go home to mummy, forget all about it you're only ten; or B) shoot the fuckers

Agree thumbwitch.

The human rights in this case specifically refer to the minimum sentence and the accused right to know how long their tariff will be, at least a minimum.

Previously, it was an indeterminate sentence.

and whilst 8 yeras doesn't seem like much, I dp think 8 years at ten (ie almost your whole life span so far and costing the teen years) is more significant than 15 years at 35 tbh.

Peachy, I'm afraid that whilst I would never want harm to come to them, I would want them locked away for life.

I'm sorry but I just don't think rehab will work for those two boys. I've been told that I am making lots of assumptions, but so are the people who think they are now decent citizens. The truth is that we don't know and that is dangerous and enough for me to want them locked up, so we know exactly where they are.

We don't know what kind of men they now are. One of them is pretty stupid to have got himself banged up again, he's been out for how many years? He must have a routine, he knows the score, and yet he's breached the rules. It might be something petty, but he's been playing the game long enough now to know how it all works.

I don't think it's fair on their future girlfriends, friends or anyone involved with them.

Or us. They are taken away, hidden away, new identities so that we, the public, have no idea if the rehab did work. We and Denise are denied information or peace of mind. Those boys will spend their lifetimes looking over their shoulders, they are being asked to live a lie - is that not also against their human rights? And what about the human rights of any girlfriend to know the truth about her partner so she can make her own mind up?

I think because of all of that and not just what they did, they should remain in a secure institution.

My personal belief is that what they did was so horrific that such warped minds can never be fully trusted again. It sickens me still and I cannot for one minute imagine what Denise is going through knowing that her sons killers are out there, somewhere, possibly never giving Jamie a thought, possibly never having shown remorse, living the kind of life they denied Jamie.

I am not a revengeful person, but for the safety of society, for the boys safety and possibly also for their human rights and the rights of those around them, they should never have been released.