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The BNP's Nick Griffin on Question Time, what are your thoughts?

973 replies

overmydeadbody · 19/10/2009 08:17

link here

OP posts:
VulpusinaWilfsuit · 22/10/2009 17:46

The tactic of tokenistically and tactically mentioning the one or two black, jewish or asian members of ones racist political organisation is irrelevant in the face of what they actually believe and how they act on the ground. Whoopee doo, they have a jewish organiser. Hurrah, a far right organisation has a black/gay member or two.

What difference does that make? Does that mean their policies DON'T suddenly include race hatred or homophobia? It's just as bad as black people saying 'well I don't experience racism therefore it doesn't exist' or 'I've lived there, I know what it's REALLY like'.

More nonsense and disingenuity from far right apologists.

bb99 · 22/10/2009 17:46

I truly believe that he SHOULD be on the telly because, clearly there are a lot of very mis-informed, disenfrachised, alienated and scared people in the country if the BNP are gaining the votes that they are at the mo. Possibly like TM's dad?

I whole heartedly believe in the freedom of speech and that you should always try and open a dialogue with EXTREEMISTS of any form. Unless we all begin to understand why some people feel compelled to turn to an extreemist organisation, we will fail to achieve harmony within this country.

We need to understand why people are voting for the BNP so we can tackle their fears and support them in their re-integration in society, just as we need to understand Islamic extreemists, or capitalist extreemists (thinking about the Shock Doctrine and Maggie's followers of the 80's)or ANY extreemists.

The peace process in Ireland only really started to crawl along when people began to talk, for whatever reason. We need to get the BNP followers talking, not so we can learn to agree with them, but so we can help them to join what is and will always be (thank goodness) a multi-cultural and multi-racial society, for a whole raft of reason.

All people should be, IMHO, allowed to be proud of who they are. There are racists all over the world, in all races and ethnic groups. We need to talk with them to tackle them.

twirlymum · 22/10/2009 17:53

I hope he gets asked some really pointed questions that really put him on the spot, and shows them for the abhorrent lot they are.
I just hope it actually gets to happen and that the protestors don't stop the recording.

electra · 22/10/2009 17:58

Why should one feel alienated just because they live somewhere multicultural? I genuinely have difficulty understanding how anyone can feel that way. I don't feel threatened by communities of people who speak languages other than English.

I also fail to see what one's class has to do with objecting to the idea of a fascist government - as class has been discussed quite a bit on this thread in relation to views about the BNP.

I do not think there is any point in boycotting the program. I don't like censorship and believe in free speech, and I do think this will provide the opportunity for NG's policies to be challenged in a sensible way.

stuffitllllama · 22/10/2009 17:58

The BNP are getting a lot of their supporters from the Labour party I think. It's possibly a misdirection to presume they are right-wingers moving further that way. Isn't there quite a lot of evidence they are disaffected Labour?

AliGrylls · 22/10/2009 18:07

The thing about Nick Griffin is that a lot of what he says (in public, to a general audience) does make sense. He is far from stupid, he went to Cambridge Uni after all. Beneath the intelligent arguments, though, lies a nasty little racist.

His arguments about a disenfranchised white working class do have some merit. When I was a child, cleaning ladies were working class english (mostly white, some caribbean), as were waiters, labourers etc. These jobs commanded reasonable money and allowed these people a sense of pride and contributing to society. These jobs are now done by immigrants, sometimes on the minimum wage and more frequently illegally employed on far smaller wages. The effect of this has to keep inflation down and allow the middle (and dwindling upper) classes cheap servants and (relatively) cheap restaurant meals. The other corollary, however, has been a disenfranchised white working class, on benefit, with no incentive to come off it (as jobs they are capable of pay so little).

Immigration is a wonderful thing but it cannot be uncontrolled either in terms of speed or composition. A society with no immigration is like Japan, rapidly ageing and without the zeal and drive of new immigrants trying to build a new life. On the other hand, completely uncontrolled immigration (coupled with benefits skewed by positive discrimination) is a disaster for a cohesive society. The vast majority of Anglo Saxon countries (U.S, Canada, Australia) have strict controls on immigration. With English as the global language, this is necessary.

Until the mainstream parties address the above issues and we all consider the cost of our "wonderful" Russian/Polish/Filipino cleaning woman who is paid marginally above the minimum wage in cash, there will be a place for nasty racist far right parties.

moondog · 22/10/2009 18:09

Re the holocaust and NG's alleged denial of it, wonder what you lot think of David Cameron's jolly to South Africa in 1989 when mention of SA brought a reflexive 'boo hiss' from anyone with a brain.

He's openly admitted Conservative got it horribly wrong over the whole sanctions/apartheid issue.

Is he allowed to make mistakes and/or say and do ill advised things but NG is not?

Mamazonabroomstick · 22/10/2009 18:12

just watching this on the news now.
Im sorry but i held this coutries freedom of speech and democracy very dear and i personally think that those people trying to break through into the BBC are just as bad as the BNP and NG.

poshsinglemum · 22/10/2009 18:12

Hmmmmmmmm.

Was watching a discussion on this on Loose women today.Someone made the valid point that that as he is such a clever oritor then more gullible members of the public could be swayed.

I think that people just have too accept that multiculturalism is here to stay and is bloody GOOD for the gene pool and cultural scape actually! DD is multi cultural so I feel quite strongly about this.

moondog · 22/10/2009 18:14

Oh right.
Lets start censoring clever oritors (sic) in case the proletariat are taken in by what they have to say.

daftpunk · 22/10/2009 18:14

the anti-fascists are fascists themselves....they're just too thick to see it...

poshsinglemum · 22/10/2009 18:14

Immigration is an inevitable consequence of globalisation and capitalism. Get over it.

moondog · 22/10/2009 18:15

Quite DP.
Too busier being holier than thou y'see.

poshsinglemum · 22/10/2009 18:17

moondog and co- I'm not saying that there should be censorship. I think that he should be on Question time actually but this is my FEAR of what effect it could have. We are right to be cautious with this man.

People are gullible and narrow minded unfortunately.

moondog · 22/10/2009 18:19

'People are gullible and narrow minded unfortunately'

Aren't they just!

VulpusinaWilfsuit · 22/10/2009 18:26

Do you mean the violent anti-fascist protestors? Or everyone opposed to fascism?

I'm not thick. And I would never say the same about you, either of you.

VulpusinaWilfsuit · 22/10/2009 18:27

What is your position here, moondog? Because all politicians dissemble somewhat, therefore it is outrageous to object to fascist ideas?

It doesn't seem a very sound argument to me. Or is there more to it?

stuffitllllama · 22/10/2009 18:28

He should be allowed to speak. There are necessary and sufficient laws controlling freedom of speech and so long as he stays within those bounds he should be allowed. He has not been given his platform by the BBC but by the voters.

stuffitllllama · 22/10/2009 18:30

I do not like him but the idea that he is too good an orator to be allowed a platform is evidence of weak thinking, defensiveness and pique.

MacaroonIncident · 22/10/2009 18:30

i htink if everyone stopped fussing
hed go on
make a tit of himself

job done

mrsruffallo · 22/10/2009 18:31

I think trying to stunt any debate on immigration by calling anyone with concerns racist actually draws people to the BNP, who talk of little else

stuffitllllama · 22/10/2009 18:31

He should be allowed, and the demonstrators should be allowed to demonstrate.

daftpunk · 22/10/2009 18:32

VW....i meant the protestors who try and stop NG speaking....they follow the BNP everywhere....they're just idiots..

you know i didn't mean you..

mrsruffallo · 22/10/2009 18:34

These protesters are idiots. They are trying to break into the BBC now.

2shoescreepingthroughblood · 22/10/2009 18:34

idiots DP?
why cos you don't aggree with them?