The BNP's Nick Griffin on Question Time, what are your thoughts?

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An EU citizen has to work here for 12 months to be able to claim the full range of benefits. They can however claim child benefit on arrival, claiming child benefit for children in other countries is legal, but you can only claim in one country at a time.

I don't think that they can request a Council House in that first 12 month period but when they can they'll be put on the same list as everybody else.

So the image of Poles coming over claiming lots of benefits and being given a Council house straight away simply isn't true.

Lady lush you would be wrong there, I am actually from Glasgow but moved to a smaller place when I found out I was pg to give my son a better life.

And yes I do realise the irony

mamadiva - "I don't agree with Brits swamping other countries either for no more than financial gain." - you are still talking about the Empire, right? Please explain.

So how much immigration is okay then?
BBC report saying 71m people in the UK by 2033
I am playing devils advocate but it has to be an issue at somepoint? In the main most immigrants bring an economic benefit to the Uk but as I said earlier it does alienate the poor working class who have always been threatened by immigration since year dot. So what can we do about it, because if you leave it you allow for the rise of parties like BNP as they play on the fears.

Maybe some of the Poles I know are liars too then

One was here a month on his own is now in a council house (took me 7 and a LOT of arguing with local housing) and he signed on as well as works on the side.

I know this because he ahs told me so, he has since shipped his (lovely) wife and kids over and they live 3 doors down from me.

As I said I have now decided I am anti-immiration to any part of the world by any nationality

Half my family have done it but still....

Maybe a new thread should be started as this is starting to drift off topic.

There is a legitimate conversation about immigration that both should and can be had.

However that's not connected with the BNP.

Yes they do speak out loudly on this issue but they are still a bunch of lying, holocaust denying, thuggish idiots.

What about the people on Jeremy Kyle? Most of them are English, so that means that you can judge all English people based on them. Correct?

Are you talking to me Someguy?

Don't watch JK (thankfully) I may be poor working class but I ain't that low

I judge the Poles based on a value which I ahve stated does not actually have anytthing to do with their 'scrounging' I have my own personal reasons for despising certain values which are held in their country!

Well if we shipped all those of that ilk as far away as possible (Jeremy Kyle-ites)ie. somewhere uninhabited, we'd have more room for immigrants who want to make a contribution.

Mamadiva

Are you really outnumbered? ie are there more than 5,000 Poles in your town of 10,000? Or does it just feel like it? We all need to beware of mixing up fact with perception on this one because that is what the BNP want us to do.

Also, point of fact - "I do agree that there are lots of lazy buggers who are born into this country (infact I think I mentioned it too) but I think they should be forced out to work before we start relying on other nationalities to cover our arses!" The sad truth is that a lot of them do not have the skills for the existing jobs which is why the poles are laying all our bricks and plumbing all our tanks these days. The fault of the Brits, maybe; the fault of successive governments, almost certainly; the fault of the Poles, not at all.

Also, we are short of labour in absolute terms because of falling birth rates and rising life expectancy. Even if every single Brit was at wrok we would still be short. The immigrants are doing us a favour, be nice to them.

I think we British should be the last people to criticise others for economic migration.....

mamadiva: "One was here a month on his own is now in a council house (took me 7 and a LOT of arguing with local housing) and he signed on as well as works on the side." It sounds to me like you're angry about the way the government responds to immigration, rather than immigration itself being the problem.

Also there was a recent study showing that people who thought immigrants were moving into council housing were almost always wrong - the housing was shown to be private rental. Are you absolutely sure about your facts about the man you wrote about?

I quite agree small orange

I will try and put it over the only way I can describe without me sounding a right bitch and racist...

In my mind if there was such an ideal world there would be some sort of ratio IYKWIM, I do think that nationality and race mixes are vital to a healthy community but I do think when it comes to the point that a country is on it's knees economically the doors should be closed to those coming in OR going out.

I am not the smartest of people and I am admittedly probably in the 'poor working class' band of things but I do not believe for a second this is why I think this way.

Hope that made sense.

Henry I would swear on my life as the street I live on is completely housing association and they cannot under any circumstances be bought over.

With regards to the benefits I will admit I am going on his say so for that one.

Okay, fair enough. The thing is, we're living in a non-ideal world and so have to deal with the reality of immigration. Immigration is a fact of life. Without it no Western country would exist in its current state - i.e. without having raped and pillaged dozens of countries of their riches and their people (to work as slaves here, there and everywhere, actually building the country with their bare hands) we today would be a lot poorer than we are.

As well as that, without immigration, the entire world population outside Africa would simply not exist. Not at all. You would not be here. I would - well, I might, depending on what's in my family tree, but you certainly wouldn't.

So immigration is a hugely complex issue, and if we ignore the wider context we cannot find a realistic or workable solution.

I do agree with you that there are many examples of immigrants claiming benefits, etc, and not working - even an immigrant friend told me about this. I don't know enough detail to be able to give specifics about the way the system works, but I agree that at the moment it is seriously flawed with regard to immigrants.

I am poor, white working class. I object to being used by the BNP and others to make a point.

I am not alienated by immigration. I was poorly educated but that does not make me an idiot.

I live in an area which is diverse and most of my neighbours are immigrants. It doesnt bother me or upset me. I am not jealous of their fabulous, state funded lifestyles, I do not resent them taking up all the available NHS beds or school places or any of the things the BNP would have you believe.

The BNP could not and would not make my life better. They are not capable of making anyone's life better. Their policies are ludicrous and unworkable. When challenged they resort to name calling and talk of conspiricy theories.
I wish wankers like Griffin would stop pretendind to speak for me.

we need lotsof healthy young immigrants to support our ageing population - especially in scotland where people are ...er...economically migrating all the time.

i quite like our multicultural society.

Like I said I know we do not live in an ideal world that was just how I wanted to put my point across.

I also know that I would'nt be here without immigration given that half my family is Maltese and half is Irish so I kind of figured that out.

''why can't people see things for what they are...it's good for democracy that the BNP have some support...it might make the main parties do something....an effective political system needs a good mix...fascists..communists....the lot.''

erm you reckon daftpunk? Like Italy for example? Known for it's effective policital system is it?

I'd rather have a few insipid parties that will not push us into extremism and start fingerprinting certain minority groups thanks.