Conservative proposals to freeze public sector pay-what do we think??

[MavisEnderby]

Good idea or not?

Frogety,pensions are already taking a bashing for new starters post April 2008 IN nhs.

if its higher earners pay - fair enough i say

does that include polititions?

As a teacher I have better holidays than most, my pension is a very good one. I have a degree and my PGCE. I have been teaching for about 7 years, earn in excess of 30K but could easily earn more if I wanted to. I don't think my job is particularly stressful, no real risks.

For me the fact that I adore my job counts for more than a wage, pension or holiday. I would happily work for less.

'Private sector is taking massive pay cuts, working short time or redundancy and pension custs. The public sector has to take te same pain.

In the heavily unionised days of the 1970s the unionised public sector and nationalised industry workers kept their jobs and pay and benefits and the private sector took the majority of the pain. It must not happen that way again.'

But in the good times the public sector continues to take the minimum pay rises, poor salaries etc while the private sector rake it in. Surely it evens out. Believe it or not, the public sector is already taking cuts - freezes on recruitment, work being picked up by existing staff working longer hours (and no, we dont get overtime as there is a no overtime policy in place). Its just not publicised.

" i am sick of listening to david cameron go on and on and constantly hiding his priveledged background.

He doesn't hide his background in fact he speaks quite openly about it.

Unlike Harriet Harman (the saint) of course, born with a silver spoon in her mouth and up her butt ( poor little champagne socialist).

Same here jelly - I worked in the private sector 9 years ago.

I still earn less per hour now than I did then.
I pay a bigger % of my pay into my pension now than I did then.
I get less paid holidays now than I did then.
I don't get any sort of Christmas bonus or performance bonus - I did then.
I don't get a subsidised Christmas outing, share option scheme, subsidised private health insurance.....

Agreed Hocus, me too.

I work in the public sector and I got my annual payrise this month. It's massive - a whole £35 a month. If my nursery fees go up agin next year that will more than swallow that increase so no I'm not too thrilled at the prospect of a pay freeze.

The majority of public sector employees are paid below the level that their skills would be worth in the private sector and yes we have a final salary pension - but that's only as good as our blinking final salary!

I work in the NHS and the personal rewards of a job well done are huge BUT I am paid below the level at which I would be paid in the private sector and the temptation is there to say 'sod it' and move on.

Morosky I think you've summed up what most non-teachers on here think of the job of a teacher

Morosky - you are lucky then. Unfortunately most public service jobs are not vote winners and have therefore not been given the increases or protection awarded to some positions. Certainly from what you say, you as a teacher get paid a lot more and get more annual leave then somebody in local government with equivalent or even higher qualifications, cpd requirements to practice etc etc. I think it is wrong therefore to lump all public sector workers in together to pay freeze.

Yup.

pt nhs bod ,would go ft but (due to family circs impossible)

Earn a lot less than £30K

Educated to postgrad level and doing continual post reg courses.

Oh and those long holidays?Do some shifts usually during these due to chronic short staffing.

Though I do realise one cannot have it all during a recession it still galls me to see that the people who got us into this mess in the first place are still getting huge bonuses.

Hocus - agreed. The number of Labour MPs who either went to fee paying school themselves and or sent their kids to one is staggering hypocricy when they constantly talk about Dave Cameron going Eton.

Even those that did not go down the privae school route either mostly went to very nice state schools at the top of the league tables in London or good local grammar schools.

I dont think I am on a cushy number, I work very hard and I think the tax payer gets good value from me. But lets face it most teachers coul do something else and earn more money, we choose not to.

I earn less than most of my friends but you earn money to buy stuff to make you happy. I am happy, I dont need to buy lots of stuff. As long as there is food ont the table and a roof over our heads I don't really care.

I do teach in a nice school where behaviour is good. But I have taught in schools where that is not the case and been more stressed and thought the job was not worth it. But as a good teacher I have a choice of where I work

I don't disagree frogety, I can only speak from experience. Maybe the 18K threshold should be raised, but then it would raise less money I suppose.

I spoke to my sister before about this, nurse living in london and she feels the same way as me.

I also have continual CPD requirements, as well as teaching full time I am about to complete my second degree so my subject knowledge is up to date. But tbh as I love my subject it is not a hardship.

yep I work in public sector and would earn over £18k if I was full time but I'm guessing it would still be my salary frozen. dh in same boat - except his supposed agreed wage increase has never actually been implemented - bet the pay freeze will be though.

I'd be happy to accept pay freeze if it saved mine or colleagues jobs and am also happy to suffer alongside everyone else in private sector

what I'm suspicious of is what else cameron has in store - cuts in health /education/investment in northern cities so he can fund tax cuts for the rich

Morosky - Im not disputing that teachers have to have good qualifications, cpd requirements etc. Its just that you appear to be rewarded for it, whereas an awful lot of public sector workers are not and are on lowish wages, with poor promotional prospects, 20 days hol (or 25 after 5 years) and none of the bonus's, christmas meals, free parking, health care etc that some private sector employees get in the good times. And yet there are lots of areas of work within local government requiring a specific qualification, post grad and cpd etc etc. It just doesnt add up that the general public assume that all public sector workers are on to a good thing.

Of course Morosky nobody sensible doubts that you work very hard for 38 weeks of the year. Rather less hard one feels for the remaining 14 though?

Why does everyone presume that the public sector isn't being hit?

I am in the public sector and we have just been through job evaluation and my salary has dropped. It is only £500 a year but I'm also only on the lowest clerical grade (NOT £18,000 a year) so it would be enough to make a difference.

This is the Tories we're talking about. They'll freeze the pay for the lower-paid workers and pose no freezes on high-paid management or MPs.

No surprises with them, they do what they say on the tin.

Dh & I public sector workers (teachers)
Salary: above nat average wage
Experience: 15yrs
Level of Qualifications: Post grad quals
Levels of risk and stress faced: Variable & differing (one is a v high achieving school, other has extremely challenging pupils (the sort that end up doing life))

Yes, I'd go along with the idea of freezing pay as long as it's fair and equitable. But having done so a Tory govt would have to offer something like no more sodding initiatives for 5 minutes.

feed they assume it because the gov tells them it is the case

look how much stuff recently has come out from central gov about how public sector pensions must change how public sector must accept pay cuts etc etc

I'm obviously a really selfish person I 'met' someone today who does very little useful work and personally I'd rather he lost his job than I took a pay cut

I agree frogetyfrog , I do think people have an image of public sector workers and they tend to be teachers, doctors etc.

I am not going to pretend that I work hard in the holidays , I don't particularly. I do the odd bit of lesson planning, mainly reading for my own subject knowledge. But during term time I do work insanely long hours. Other teachers probably do more during the holidays and achieve more balance in term time. But I am not going to pretend that my life is really hard because it isn't. Although I did have a girly cry earlier because I am so tired this evening and just canot bring myself to mark the essays I have taken home.

i'm an average wage public sector worker, i haven't had an above-inflation rise ever.

a freeze would be fine to me if inflation stayed super-low.

but if inflation goes up then i would be stuffed if my wages freeze... and my pension and 25 days holdiay a year are not going to pay the mortgage next year are they?

i want to know who all these 'high earning' public sector workers are - nobody in my business earns more than equivalent jobs in private sector, we work in the public sector because it is fulfilling because we believe it to be a contribution to the greater good of society, but i for one wont let my family starve for my principles.

expat - they are going to reduce the pay at the top not just freeze it. That is what Osborne said today. An initial 5 per cent cut in ministers' pay which would then be frozen for the rest of the first Parliament and I think doctors and judges pay will be cut too. He said no civil servant would get paid more than the Prime Minister.

Only the armed forces and low paid public sector workers woudl escape.

'expat - they are going to reduce the pay at the top not just freeze it. That is what Osborne said today. An initial 5 per cent cut in ministers' pay which would then be frozen for the rest of the first Parliament and I think doctors and judges pay will be cut too. He said no civil servant would get paid more than the Prime Minister.'

Yes, I know that, ABeta.

And you believe them?

Because I sure as hell don't.

Thing is, I was actually considering voting for them.

Until DC started opening his mouth.

Now?

No chance in HELL.