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NIck Griffin tells BBC that boats carrying immigrants should be sunk

506 replies

spokette · 09/07/2009 19:53

I think his victory in the EU elections makes him think that he can reveal more of his true true heinous side.

How long before he starts extolling the virtue of gas chambers?

OP posts:
policywonk · 11/07/2009 22:39

Jesus MT, you are incredibly obtuse sometimes. You said that the left was to blame ('people on the left won't engage with them... that's the left's failing'). If you don't like the laying of the blame, don't start with the laying of the blame!

daftpunk · 11/07/2009 22:39

PW...you don't have to listen with weary politeness to me....the BNP are now in europe....perhaps if politicians were more like me and less like you, they wouldn't be there...

policywonk · 11/07/2009 22:42

I'll carry on extending the weary politeness dp, thanks all the same.

The only people who are to blame for the BNP's MEPs are the people who voted for them. Don't even attempt to lay that one on me.

AitchTwoOh · 11/07/2009 22:45

but what ARE you like, dp? andwhy won't you answer my question? you either agree with me or you don't.

daftpunk · 11/07/2009 22:46

PW...big mistake taking people for granted....after a while they take action...

monkeytrousers · 11/07/2009 22:46

I object to the BNP for the same reasons PW. But that's not the same as refusing them intellegence and political savvy.

I think it might be handy to contextualise what racism is. It is the extreme expression of zenophobia - thats a fear, not a hatred of 'the other'. The pepole who exploit these fears and turn them to hatreds that are the clever ones.

Humans have a natural conservatism when it comes to strangers per se, for very good reason. We are also pro-social animals, but not indiscriminatley so. If you deny people the expression of theri empotions, even negative ones, they can't work through them. Bloody hell, thats the basic rule of parenting. Permissive with emotions, strict on their negativce expression. People want to hear possible solutions to problems, not be told to shut up becasue they are ignorant.

Night all.

AitchTwoOh · 11/07/2009 22:51

nobody's been told to shut up cos they're ignorant on here, mt. no one on here supports the bnp, do they? do they?

policywonk · 11/07/2009 22:51

dp, for every anti-immigration argument you have made, you have been provided with a well-reasoned response. You have completely ignored every single one. So either you have a vast fund of immigration knowledge that you're not sharing with the rest of us, or you prefer to remain ignorant.

This goes for people who vote BNP. They're doing it out of ignorance. The only thing everyone else can do is tell them the facts. If they refuse to engage with the facts, what the fuck else are we supposed to do? Pretend that we agree with them so that we don't upset them?

As Aitch said below, of course there are 'humiliated communities' (great phrase), and more should be done to lift them back in to the mainstream, economically and socially. It's just that this has bugger all to do with immigration.

monkeytrousers · 11/07/2009 22:52

I admit, I have no idea what the argument is anymore. Other than the titanic clash of MN civilisations.

AitchTwoOh · 11/07/2009 22:54

and no-one is saying that the bnp isn't savvy or intelligent. they can't be that daft if they're playing this country like a lute at the moment...

monkeytrousers · 11/07/2009 22:55

"On here" Aitch? Did I say "on here"?

FWIW, I see most people on this thread not listening to each other or even botheing to try and understand before they attept to refute.

I really am going to bed now.

Tortington · 11/07/2009 22:58

i dont think she has been provided with a well resaoned response to be fair - a blanket statement that the bnp are ignorant - or statements much the same.

whilst dp hasn't given much of an argument - rather tantalising knicker flashes here and there, she hasn't been given any concrete counter argument either - i don't know whether one is becuase of the other - but what i do think is that MT has a point - you can't just pronounce BNP = ignorant

daftpunk · 11/07/2009 23:01

PW....no, BNP voters are not voting out of ignorance...alot of them have voted far right to shake up politics in this country...they know exactly what they're doing...they don't want to vote for the fascists.. ( some do obviously)..they just want the two main parties to listen to them...

FAQinglovely · 11/07/2009 23:03

have you read the whole thread

I believe I did once or twice (or maybe 3 or 4 times?) called the BNP ignorant - however I've also given plenty of "numbers" and other information.

daftpunk · 11/07/2009 23:06

need to go for my run..

night all

AitchTwoOh · 11/07/2009 23:08

i feel i am trying desperately to listen but am being repeatedly ignored, tbh.

AitchTwoOh · 11/07/2009 23:09

but if they want the two main parties to listen to them WHAT IS IT THAT THEY ACTUALLY WANT TO SAY?

FAQinglovely · 11/07/2009 23:11

that all them immigrants are causing them problems with getting a job and all that you know. Not sure which immigrants it is but asylum seekers sounds like a good group to pick on

policywonk · 11/07/2009 23:27

Custardo, look at my post below/above of 19.18. Plenty of well-reasoned arguments have been made. There are people refusing to listen on this thread, but they're not the pro-immigration posters.

policywonk · 11/07/2009 23:31

In fact, I can't recall a thread in which so many posters have made so many reasonable and difficult-to-refute arguments, and then been told that they're refusing to engage with the debate.

Tis very irritating, and not a little disorientating.

JesuslovesHangovers · 12/07/2009 07:38

you don't vote for facists DP because you want the other main parties to listen to you. thats bullshit. you vote for them becuase they have something to say that strikes a chord with you.

PW at 19.18 i was getting drunk down the pub!

i disagree on both points - there are threads with well reasons arguments quite frequently and posters on both sides are not listening.

that is not to say that your post of 19.18 and the posters who made the comments that you summarised - are wrong. but rather to say that the pro -immigration side of the debate has a share of blanket statements too.

personally i am impressed my post was even legible.

monkeytrousers · 12/07/2009 07:44

"you don't vote for facists DP because you want the other main parties to listen to you. thats bullshit"

It is bullshit, but that doesn't make it any less true.

That is all DP is trying to say (I think)

policywonk · 12/07/2009 11:11

Fair enough - I just wanted to point out that the pro-immigration arguments had consisted of a great deal more than calling people 'ignorant'.

Also, I didn't mean to imply that this thread is unique in having well-reasoned arguments. What distinguishes it is that pro-immigration posters are making well-reasoned arguments, which are then ignored in favour of telling us that we're not engaging with the debate.

It's a small point, but it was bugging me greatly last night. I would have been better off down the pub, obviously

daftpunk · 12/07/2009 12:44

pw;

i know you know your stuff....but you don't know everything (nobody does)... and where you come unstuck is with the BNP....your comment;

"DP i've listened with weary politeness to you"....(i can tell that's all you ever do) if you were my labour candidate i would see straight through you...i would know you didn't give a toss, so i'd turn to a party who understood me...who would listen..the BNP!

that's what's happening PW..normal people are turning to them.....you have to understand that.

FAQinglovely · 12/07/2009 12:48

yes I gave lots of blanket statements - "blanket" because I can't change the facts and figures I've posted and linked to.