The poor 17 month old -died of broken back

[skydancer1]

I just find these kind of stories of extreme abuse so very upsetting and wish we had better safeguards in place to stop such hideous harm happening or at least continuing (when it's pretty obvious!) to helpless children. Why on earth did the doctor not examine a child because he was already on an at risk register and was 'cranky and miserable' at an appointment and hence he/she failed to notice broken back and ribs? It beggars belief. I'm not a punitive 'hang them flog them' type (in fact I'm strongly against corporal punishment) but in this instance I think the mother should be forcibly sterilised to prevent her ever hurting or 'allowing' such hurt to any other child.

God it makes me sick - if this were a dog we were talking about it would have been removed by the RSPCA and the owners prosecuted at the first signs of abuse - whether the parents were educated or struggling or not!

SS needs to relaise that is is there for the child and not to pander to the parents whether they are struggling or not.
I hope they are beaten to a pulp regularly during their incarceration.

The poor poor child.

Would it make you feel like justice had been done if they were to be killed?

(That's not directed to anyone in particular, just anyone who believes that the dealth penalty should be brought back)

I do in a way I'd be happy to know their lives were over and that they will never have the chance to ahrm another child,and weren't living the high life in jail as if they had done nothing worng and probably being better off than they would be if they were free.

I knwo the death penalty was abused badly but I do think it would deter people from doing such sick things. Just my Opinion I'm not saying this is how it should be and thats that I just think in certain cases I'd rather they were dead.

It wouldn't for me. Some kind of Justice if they were imprisoned for life/hard labour and the SW involved were sacked.

\As an aside it's always worth remembering that the unlucky ones are not just those children the system misses.
There are 60 000 children being 'looked after' by the state in the uk. They are failed spectacularly and shamefully.
I wish with all my heart that Baby P had been removed but sadly accept that that would, in all liklihhod , not have been an end to his troubles.

I agree with life imprisonment / hard labour. I also wish someone would take responsibility for allowing it to continue instead of just insisting that 'lessons will be learned'.

I can't understand how it all went unnoticed. Every healthcare proffesional who's ever examined my daughter has commented about the 'sore mark' on her bottom. It's a bloody birthmark!

They correctly noticed that he was 'at risk of harm' but failed to do anything to stop that harm.

Veronica - they cant prove who caused the injuries or fatal blow. They just know that all of them partook. So, to ensure conviction CPS had no choice but to opt for that charge.

Mercy - I didnt realise you lived close-ish to me?

I dont envy the job of the SWs in Haringey. Especially when you consider that part of the borough is the Knife Murder Capital of the country.

I think in cases where they can not prove who caused the final death then both/all should be charged with murder unless they speak up against the murderer.

oh god not the "hang the bastards" talk again. For the likes of Sally Clarke, Tripti Patel etc, it just wouldnt be viable to bring back such sentences. In any case, I wouldnt want to live in a society that condones taking another person's life.

Was no-one alarmed by the post earlier where a thirteen year old had said "they should bring back hanging for bastards like that" or whatever???? Why would a thirteen year old say such a thing? Where did he hear that from?

But how could they prove it? If they all said "it wasnt me" how could you eliminate reasonable doubt? CPS have to follow the letter of the law to ensure conviction and conviction they have got.

poor baby.

i creid and cried over this.

my little girl who is 5 has dyspraxia. every night, i thank God she is ours, someone else might abuse her or not understand her or even try, much less to help her.

makes you want to cuddle your children.

and as for david cameron going on about the mother only being 17 and not having a clue.

well, bullshit.

PLENTY of teen mums, including on this board, are terrific mothers who would never stand for a partner beating their child.

this mother covered it up, too.

makes me want to throw up if i didn't have to keep the sertraline in my system.

If it is true that the police formal requests for the child to be taken in to LA care, but the council blocked them - maybe this suggests that the police should have the final say rather than SS? They are not working to support such families in the same way and may be able to make more objective assessments of a situation. Unlike the SS the police have admitted errors in their handling of this case.

Also, I can't really imagine the police being so ready to get caught up in witchhunting fads like MSbP or Satanism.

I do wonder if we have become so PC now that social workers are frightened about removing a child from a single mother, with a live in boyfriend who probably lives in a pig sty of a house and who lives on benefits in case they were accused of discrimation. So they leave that poor baby there but justify it to themselves by saying she is 'cooperating'.

I hope these three people rot in hell. Of course once they are released they will have all the help they need to settle into their new lives. In fact they might get new identities because of the risk of people 'picking' on them. They will never work again (would you employ scum like that) and will be a complete drain.

I hope the other prisoners sort them out in the appropriate way.....

This is so very, very sad.

For those who are condemning the "hang 'em all" brigade, show some understanding. It is a gut reaction, as a mother or a father listening to the utterly horrific life that this poor, poor baby led the first thing you want is for those who could do this to suffer greatly.

It is an emotional response and one I feel at the moment especially after seeing the images of what injuries this baby had. God, it doesn't bear thinking about. The justice system in this country is seen by a lot of people, whether rightly or wrongly, to be soft on criminals - there is no percieved punishment. Therefore the initial hit out, wanting to see those beasts who could break a child's back, the mother who could allow it hurt is instinct.

Mother Tiger syndrome.

I'm no fan of David Cameron, but I must say I agree with him that an independent inquiry into the failure of Haringey's social services should be carried out.

Apparently, it's up to Sharon Shoesmith to carry out the investigation on her own department at Haringey. But she's already said that there will be no resignations over this - so it seems like a foregone conclusion that no one will be held to account.

This cannot be allowed to happen. I for one will be writing to Beverly Hughes, the children's minister, to demand that an independent investigation of Haringey's failures be carried out.

MissM - an independent inquiry would be a good idea with results reported. It is a political issue.

I think part of the problem has arisen from the current practice of keeping families together.

Lord Laming said the child is the client of SS, not the family.

VVVQ - I live in Haringey.

I know someone whose dc had to go to A&E twice in the space of a few months. After the 2nd visit they were contacted by Haringey SS for a discussion re the child's injuries (genuine accidents both times)

I don't know what to do, I am just so upset by this story. I have to rant and don't know who else to rant to, so here goes...

Everyone, from the social workers to the health visitors to the police and the doctors, dropped the ball, over and over and over again. I am a GP. I, and every other professional, have a duty to protect children we see. Everyone is making excuses, nobody is taking responsibility (at least officially). I spent last night imagining how that little baby must have felt, fearing everybody that came near him, anticipating the next punch or kick. How he must have spent every day in pain, trying to grow and develop but being constantly brutalized by those who were supposed to care for him. I am sure that all of the people involved are unable to sleep, as well at least I hope so. I can only hope that I would have seen what was going on, and pursued it doggedly. The excuses from ss are unbelievable they were taken in by the deception?? Isn't their job to properly investigate and see through the deception they must anticipate from child abusers?? And to hear that the mother kept telling them that Baby P had fallen down the stairs, etc., their response being to give her stair gates...what??? A child is on the protection register and this doesn't raise a red flag? They need to sort themselves out.

As for the perpetrators, I can only agree with previous posters that one can hope they are all at the receiving end of appropriate prison justice. I am not an advocate of violence, but this case makes me see red. I worked on a child abuse team in my medical school training and in various A&E departments, and have never seen anything like the injuries described that Baby P endured. I am having a really hard time getting past the images from the media and what my mind has conjured up -- I feel like a need a debriefing and a support group...

All I can do is to try to be the best mum I can be to my little boy, and to remember Baby P. His suffering is over now. Let's all work to make sure no more babies are suffering like he did.

There has already been a report on the council, they were looked at as part of the Victoria Climbie inquiry.

Surly a child with that many bruises should not have been left with it's parents. Poor thing.

That's what I can't understand, the pitiful professionals. There are lots of low lifes who shouldn't be allowed within spitting distance of a child, fine, can't control them breeding unfortunately, but children who are in danger should be taken away - permenantly.

I don't get the "we thought it was neglect, not abuse" pitiful line of excuses.

Neglect is abuse.

Our council is constantly trying to recruit child and family social workers. I am sure that is not an unusual situation. However it says alot about how difficult the role must be.

It must be so stressful. I know they have a high turn over because of this and what they have to deal with.

You are right georgimama, neglect is abuse however they are delt with differently. The aim is, and has been for many years, to keep the child in the home whenever possible and to offer support to the family. It's cases like this that highlight how this doesn't work.

Social workers are often the 'whipping boys' in situations like this - the poor media image must make it very difficult to recruit in the Child and Family sector. How many of us who care about children REALLY want to stick our necks on the line day in day out in such a job. I don't.