23 year old has assisted suicide in Switzerland

[Evenstar]

Here news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/hereford/worcs/7676812.stm

This is terribly sad, I wonder how much help and support this family were given in the wake of their son's accident.

I support assisted suicide in cases of terminally ill/degenerative diseases but I think opening it up creates a dangerous situation - where does it stop? Should someone who is suicidal because of depression be assisted to end their life even if a few months/years down the line they have the potential to be very happy?

This is so, so sad .

I'm not quite sure what I think about assisted suicide, although I think that in some cases where someone is terminally ill and has no quality of life, they can be forgiven for choosing how and when they want their life to end.

Just in this case, as others have said, the accident was so recent, and he still had mobility in his arms, head and voice, you can't help thinking that it was too soon to know whether he could have come to terms with his new life. If this were my son, I would have done everything in my power to try to stop him coming to this decision so soon.

Very sad.

I don't know what level his paralysis was, and how much function he had, but I have worked in a spinal injuries unit, and know that in general, patients with paralysis do get a massive amount of support (compared to patients with degenerative conditions that have the same effect). I also know many people who have lived with no function in arms or legs, and so very dependent who have fathered/ born children and live a very fulfilled life.

I agree that this was MUCH too early to make this decision.

It is so sad.
poor poor man that he felt this was the only way. hope he rests in peace.

It is a very sad story. A great pity that he couldn't have come to terms with his disability, and seen that he could have had a happy and positive life. But probably better that he could arrange for his suicide in a dignified and controlled manner, rather than attempted to do it himself. I always feel rather angry (I know this is not reasonable) at those people who throw themselves off bridges and in front of trucks or trains, because of the anguish their method may cause to other people. His family will be devastated I am sure. I am sure that the clinic will have made sure it was absolutely what he wanted to do for legal reasons, and from the reactions of the family it sounds as if he was very sure.

He had attempted several times.

A big difference from a cry from help suicide attempt.

www.notdeadyet.org

cry for

Actually I need to clear something up I've heard on the radio and just a little on here. There was a huge article on Dignitas in the Observer a year ago. Yes, they are asked if they are sure they want to end their life but this is not done in a clinic, it is done in a flat in the centre of town. They sign a paper confirming they wish to do this.

They are then poured the liquid into a glass. They decide to take it. Within 30 seconds they fall into a coma and then pronounced dead after a few minutes.

So not in a clinic surrounded by docs, just in a flat.

'so if one of your kids said they were depressed and wanted to die you'd say 'ok then''

If I knew they'd struggled with it for years and years (I have myself) and done what they could and they wanted to move on, then yes, I would do what I could to help them.

well I wouldn't. I'd try and get them help. Unless someone proved there was some wondrous heaven waiting for them that theyw ere eaager to get too. I'd think the were selfish to be honest.

'He is the one that made the decision and good on him - how can anyone judge him and how he felt unless they have lived through that situation?'

I 100% agree.

There are some people, needmore, for whom there is NO help.

Ever seen 'The Bridge'? One of the people featured was a woman who had battled paranoid schizophrenia for 20 years.

No medications, drugs, counselling, etc. had been able to help her live what she felt was any quality of a life.

She spent her final year in terrible health, the drugs had caused so many side effects she was miserable both mentally and physically and yet if she stopped taking her drugs she was locked up in a mental hospital for her own safety.

So she jumped from Golden Gate Bridge.

Her life. Her decision.

I think he had misinformation thinking that being disabled was 'second best'. After all, he didn't want to kill himself when he wasn't disabled. So the only change was becoming paraplegic.
Maybe a few more positive messages and this young man would be alive and with his family.

A life isn't an island though. It has effects on family and society.
And this news story adds to the whole 'better dead than disabled' thought that permeates society.

Misinformation? He had better information about his own life as a tetraplegic man than anyone else could have had. And he made a decision. I'm sure he didn't make it lightly and I'm sure his family didn't just say 'Righty ho' without much thought.

To keep him alive without his free and certain consent (for beneficial effects on family and society??) would be an appalling tyranny.

I can only respond as the wife of a man who uses a wheelchair outside the home, although increasingly it is looking likely he will need to use it inside as well. It is not the same thing and I would not attempt to draw conclusions from it.

What I can say is that even in 2008 it is immensely difficult 'only' to be a wheelchair user, never mind everything else this poor guy has gone through. It is soul-destroyingly awful. That's just a fact. But. I know my dh would never choose to end his life because he 'only' had his arms and brain because we need him, and I'm sorry this poor man didn't feel the same compulsion to live. It's a hard thing but you deal with it - you have to.

I also feel it was too soon after his accident for him to have made a considered decision about it and he should have been better supported before making his choice. All of his potential for life has been lost now - yes, his choice but in two or five years' time, would he have made the same one?

All thoughts to his family at this dreadful time.

needmorecoffee you make a good point.
sadly as long as people see disabled people as second best. this won't be the only sad story like this.

I don't actually think that my life is mine to end, but then I'll probably get flamed for that view as a Sarah Palin voting, mad neo-con (MN does seem to delight in these pigeon holes). I think that story is horrific in every way, and feel desperately sorry for all concerned, but no, I don't think it is right that that clinic can end the life of a 23 year old man, even if he is disabled.

I thought it was far too soon after his accident to make this sort of decision. He didn't allow himself any time for adjustment. Sad, because he could probably have had a very fulfilling life after adjustment. No need for it to be a second class at all. God knows what he would make of ds1- who is able to access far less than he is able to, but I would say has a first class life.

Why would anyone expect to adjust to being severely disabled in such a short time? It took me longer to adjust to being back in the UK after a year in Japan.

I agree with expat, very sad, but his decision to make. I too have an agreement with Dh that if i fall off my horse and break my neck so i can't move arms or legs and need ventilating, then he is to go out at the first power cut. My poor (now long deceased ) grandmother begged me to help her kill herself several times over the last 2-3 years of her life. This amazing woman, who went to medical school in the middle of the first world war could not cope with her granddoughter wiping sh* off her ar*, she genuinely would rather have been dead, I didn't have the courage to assist her , adn tbh it's nothing to do with viewing disabled people as second class citizens, it's just about making ones own personal decisions.

This has really made me think, as my standard position is that of course euthanasia should be legal, as apart from anything else I sure as hell would want the option were I facing a slow horrible distressing death. I feel that quality of life -for the person who has to live it- is hugely important.

But but but.

He was so young. It was so soon. He wasnt terminal. He must have had movement and physicality and adrenalin and joy of exercise and competition at the very heart of his existence, it must have seemed unbearable. But then I think about people with various degrees of paralysis being taken skiing etc on adapted equipment. He could, to take an extreme example, still have gone tandem sky diving, there would still be adventure out there if he had had time and strength to go looking for it.

So no, if it had been my boy I dont think I could have supported him. I would hope to have asked him to give it maybe 3 years and then I would have been scouring the globe to find the things he needed to stay alive.

Easy to say of course from the outside.

I do wonder if we had legal euthansia here with all the stringent checks that would be needed, that it would take the pressure off. If I was in one of these horrible situations I would know that if it ever did get too unbearable I would have a choice and therefore could afford to wait.

Well I thikn grandparents are a bit different as there's only one way it can end up really in a relatively short period of time. A 21 year old has all sorts of opportunities - even taking into account the shortened lives that tend to go with certain levels of paralysis.

There was an article recently in a newspaper or maybe it was on the radio, but someone in this sort of situation said that he opposed euthanasia because a year after his accident would have had it, in fact he;d gone on to get married and had a life he could never have imagined. He;d looked into euthanasia but hadn;t been able to sort it, then his 'second chance' kicked in. If I could vaguely remember where it was I'd look it up,

I do think many able bodied have problems imaganing a life of value with a significant disability.

You need time to adjust. It's a completely different life.

Sorry if I could vaguely remember where it was I'd link to it. He;d gone onto have a child - and I think it was that that made him really sure that euthanasia was wrong. This child was obvioulsy the light of his life.

Cathpot I agree with you- 3 years is a reasonable length of time to discover that life can still be good. 1 year later you're still going to be in shock, never mind anything else.

this is so difficult.

If it were my boy, im not sure.

I work in acute care and every day i face patients who are in a living torture, and everything we do to them, we know that we are causing them discomfort or pain despite every feasable step to prevent and relieve this.

Its living torture for us as carers and living torture for those suffering.

However, i am very uneasy with the thought of assisted suicide, i agree but could not do it myself.
We "withdraw treatment" legally and ethically, and yet we do not consider this to be assisting in a death. We cloak it with "nature taking its course" but we do not do this unless every avenue has been explored and when the situation is hopeless.
Very difficult.