Page 25 | David Cameron: It is your fault if you are fat and poor.

FairyMum · 2008-07-08T08:14:45+00:00

Has anyone commented on the David Cameron-speech on moral neutrality? He is a price-dick, isn't he?

rebelmum1 · 11/07/2008 10:59

Education couldn't be more standardised.

Original poster

FairyMum · 11/07/2008 11:01

What makes a school fail Rebelmum? Must be the lazy pupils? All the children of the lazy people being together in one class room, right?

OP posts:

MilkMonitor · 11/07/2008 11:04

Let's take one of DC's children from birth, put them to live in a sink estate in Britain with a family who believes that chips and ready made meals are a balanced diet.

And send him/her to one of the schools in the area (standardised education = not the case) and see how they get on, shall we?

Because, after all, they'll only have themselves to blame for not doing as well as their siblings in the DC household.

rebelmum1 · 11/07/2008 11:05

Obviously attitudes to learning, expectations and behaviour plays a part. Are you saying it doesn't?

rebelmum1 · 11/07/2008 11:08

I've taught in inner city schools and taught in suberbs and there was a huge difference in behaviour and expectations. The teachers were absolutely stirling in the disadvantaged areas. Are you blaming the teachers for the differences?

Tortington · 11/07/2008 11:42

peachy - i wasn't saying that riven should get off her arse and go out to work. It was she that brought up the subjet of her daughters disability - completely (imo) out of the blue and not in the general context that was being discussed.

who would tell the carer of a disabled child to get a job? on mumsnet of all places? how fucking stupid would that be?

Tatt - you said fortunatley on one of your better days you found your own solution.

so did i.

thats all i am saying - dont sit there and wait to be spoonfed - whatever definition of successful suits you.

labling yourself is not an excuse to not try harder for yourself and your family

this isn't a short term solution by any means - and i am not sayng that you will wake up one day and things will be hunky dory.

but we do have to take personal responsability - these things do not define me as a person - becuase i decide what defines me.

a mother with mental health issues
an orphan
uneducated
teenage mum
teenage bride
mum of twins
non driver
abusive husband
smoker
council house
benefit claimer
packing posters at 2p per tube

nope non of the above defined me.

am not saying that any of this is a piec of piss,

and i cannot define your definition of success. when depressed you definition of success might be simply getting dressed.

the only person who can change things is you. Govt schemes will come and go. defining yourself by the circs that yo are in - or excusing certain behaviours becuase of it - is tosh.

again let me repeat - i am not saying that you should wake up one day and work in the city.

i am saying that no-one but you can make it happen. with all the help in the world if you want to remain defined by life circumstaces - you will - it might take hard work and time.

rebelmum1 · 11/07/2008 11:50

What a refreshing and inspiring post custardo. Good on you. Much respect.

herbietea · 11/07/2008 11:52

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

tatt · 11/07/2008 13:08

but I'm well educated, Custardo and I haven't been ill from birth. So I have access to a computer and know how to use it. I'm privileged and lucky - and unlike DC I know it.

And rebelmum I could argue with that but I doubt you'd listen. There is plenty of evidence that there is a genetic basis behind some obesity. Try reading up on PCOS, for example, or leptin resistance or insulin resistance. You'll find comemnts like

"Leptin resistance is strongly associated with extreme obesity and appears to be a heritable trait. The determination of its genetic causes will aid in understanding the role of leptin in common forms of human obesity."

It may be easy for you to control your weight but others have the cards stacked against then from the beginning.

rebelmum1 · 11/07/2008 13:32

Like I said tatt it's your responsibility unless you have a medical condition..

That's rather a funny assumption that it is easy for me to control my weight.. I do by eating healthily and exercising, just had rye bread, low fat hummous and sticks of veg for lunch and I run 4 miles 3 times a week! So with all due respect bog off!

thehappyprince · 11/07/2008 16:26

Perhaps I'm being cynical but it seems like a really underhand nasty way of pandering to middle england's worst prejudices . I don't think anyone could argue that weight is not at least partly something for which we hold responsibility (of course if we eat more than we expend we'll gain weight), and of course one factor in poverty in certain cases may be related to lack of effort or incentive to leave it behind. That's why the labour government's drive since 1997 has been to incentivise work - whether or not you think it's worked. DC knows this but as I think edam mentioned previously has given a speech that appeals to those that think the poverty is "your own fault" and therefore not their responsility, and those who think people should take some responsibility. Who has ever argued differently. Obviously there are hundreds of other factors, many much more important in both poverty and obesity. why bother troubling himself with them as they won't win him votes. Altogether a completely pointless speech except getting the old style tories on side imo.

thehappyprince · 11/07/2008 16:29

Actually, it reminds me of an old psychology trick - you purport to "read" someones personality by giving some vague, universal, mildly flattering characteristics which applies to most people, and people think is great because "yes, that's just like me", as well as the old tories