Archie Battersbee thread 5

[henryhihat]

New thread...

@whynotwhatknot & @BarbarasStripedHands

Thanks. A lesson if ever there was one to be careful what you post on social media.

She simply won't listen to sense. Anyone who tries to talk to her like that will be 'against her'.

I was thinking yesterday that she seems to be one of these black-and-white, all-or-nothing people where you either 100% buy into everything she says/wants/does OR you're the enemy. There are no shades of grey or nuances.

There'll be another appeal now.

The prospect of her other kids being subjected to the sight of their mother being forcibly removed from the hospital room for trying to resuscitate her son after removal of ventilation is horrific.

The daily mail really isn't helping, it keeps posting dramatic headlines ,which of course attracts hundreds of comments ,i do think the media should withdraw now.

indeed

A question about these go fund mes.

Aren't they illegal? Fraudulent? Because they literally say they are asking for money for medical and court costs which isn't true, so even if people say the family can spend the money any way they like surely that's against the law because they money has been asked for a specific reason.

Not a lawyer so would be grateful for insight. My understanding was that you needed to give grounds for an appeal, rather than just not liking the judgment. Otherwise the courts would grind to a halt with every decision being challenged. I'm not sure on what grounds these appeals are being granted. Is it being set out anywhere?

My concern is that, while the right to appeal is a fundamental right, it must seem from the last few weeks that no court judgment is actually final until it's arrived at the ECHR or Supreme Court. Which is of course not the case.

Unfortunately posters on other forums have dug deep and have re-published family Photographs, posts, emails, videos etc. from the present day & the past.

If you put your life on SM, someone somewhere will find it all (and do what they want with it) years later if they want to.

The whole thing has turned into a circus.

Agree with Quia.

The High Court can refuse leave to appeal (and has done so in this case), but the parents can then ask the Court of Appeal for leave to appeal. This is an essential safeguard. The High Court will almost always refuse leave to appeal - no judge is going to effectively say, "I think I might have got this wrong". If people could not then go to the Court of Appeal for leave, some terrible injustices would never be corrected.

This case has not shown our legal system to be a ridiculous waste of time and money. It has shown our legal system doing its job.

Just read an article where Hollie is saying she’s had no privacy

Which is it? Are they there constantly so you have no privacy, or are they never there giving any treatment which is private?

She's said she accepts the transfer risks but would rather risk him dying in transit than in the hospital

very sad that she wants to win against all the adivce not to move him

And I came back to this thread to say I've realised that they were each time being refused a hearing for the appeal, rather than the appeal being heard. Which I did know but had forgotten.

Given that, despite my lack of legal background, I am usually fairly clued up on this sort of process, I think the likelihood that many members of the public now think you can just endlessly appeal.

"Although Archie's parents recognised the risks in relation to the transfer to the hospice - including Archie potentially dying in transit - they said they were prepared to take them in preference to remaining in the hospital."

😢 Poor little soul.

So it's just about getting one over on The Man?

I'm surprised they haven't put reporting restrictions in place tbh. It cannot be in Archie's interests for this all to play out in public.

The only reason I can think of for not issuing restrictions on reporting that is that they know the family would ignore then and then the Court would be in the unenviable position of having to take action against grieving family members for Contempt.

At what point does all this end ,when she loses all the appeals for him transferring him to a hospice ,will there be grounds for yet another appeal,for another reason?

That sentence breaks my heart. Instead of wanting to spend every last precious second with their beautiful boy they are instead just trying to say FU to the hospital who have kept him safe for 4 months.

Yes, the grounds for appeal are dealt with in the judgments.

I've just looked at that Kiwifarms site. It's utterly disgusting.

Which is her preference and her feelings.

It is certainly not the best option for the child, or for the staff who will have to manage that crisis.

Agree, this is the legal system working exactly as it is supposed to, because it has to demonstrate openly that it has considered every single option and evaluated it before saying no to a parent's wishes through the need to protect the child's interests first and foremost. It's a very difficult situation and difficult thing to do. The trouble is that at the heart of this very extended, convoluted process is a child, who is continuing on in a situation that protecting the child's best interest has been shown as ending as soon as possible. The child's need therefore has had to be subordinated through the requirement to go through the entire legal process as far as the parent wishes to take it. However it's plain that the courts have done their best to move as fast as they can for the child in the past few days.

She's said she accepts the transfer risks but would rather risk him dying in transit than in the hospital

She doesn't, or wilfully refuses to, understand that it's not about what she wants. It's about what's best for Archie.

They really are grasping at straws now. To call in an ‘expert’ who last practised in PICU before Archie was even born, who hasn’t examined him or seen the full notes.

And the transport team proposed to take him to the hospice would be the paediatric intensive care retrieval service. To be clear, there is one of these teams per region. Whilst I realise the family’s priority is Archie, surely they realise that asking for that service to transport him just so they can avoid being in the hospital is absolutely unjust in that it delays critically ill children being transferred across the region to the very few available PICU beds.

Archie's last chance? Headline from the daily mail. Really?? There wasn't a chance from the start. This whole thing has never been about the poor boy has it?

They have till 1pm today to start another appeal was it?

Can't everybody just stay in the same bloomin' room and not leave until it ends!!

It's surely all the same paperwork being waved about by all the same people at this stage 🙄 Rather than ''See you back here next week everyone'' why not have ''Who's appealing what and lets get on with it right now and get to the bitter end of this''.

It's so exasperating.

(obviously i've never set foot in a court)

Haven't posted before but I've read a lot of these threads over the last few days. Through my work I've encountered three families who lost their children tragically and suddenly. All three of them had their life support withdrawn within 48 hours. The parents absolutely broken with grief made the right decision to let their child go with as much dignity as possible.

All three sets of parents received abusive messages from people saying they should have fought, let their child die, let them be murdered etc.

The media publicising cases like archie- which have gone on for decades without being widely reported on - have a huge amount to answer for.