Mother can keep birth a secret

[MamaMaiasaura]

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7109774.stm what do you think about this?

I was just saying what I think ppb was getting at about an overall principle - I am not sure it's relevant in this particular case - the conversation just seemed to have gone in that direction. is also moving too fast for me.....

I wasn't talking about this woman I was answering your question

oooh expat are we in some sort of telepathic communication?

paula i slightly agree with you in that we have to take responsibility for getting pregnant through the usual means but the girl did carry the child when she could have easily had a termination if she aborted she would never need have told anyone but she carried her child to give it a chance in life even though she didnt want it and on trying to have he/she adopted got all these problems which is very wrong imo as it will stop people letting their unwanted babys live and get a good home through adoption as they will fear problems like this which they wouldnt face through abortion

Which question were you answering?

Have you answered the promiscuity one?

when you give a man the right to control a woman's reproduction, you enslave her.

full stop.

this is her fundamental right as a human being.

He wasn't given the option.

What if they don't agree? Why should a father not have a right to his child? I get that the woman would have to carry it for nine months. But a wanted child would otherwise be terminated. That seems a very sad and wrong thing to me.

she didn't want to terminate! she wanted to give the child a two-parent home through adoption!

i also fail to see where electing termination is somehow an irresponsible way of dealing with an unwanted pregnancy.

I think if men want to be able to have children when women don't they should find a way of carrying them themselves. Until they do they don't have any rights in that area.

It's like the Taliban are on here tonight.

i have no problem with promiscuity as long as you can deal with the consiquences

paula the child is not a child until it's born. an unborn child has no legal entity and no legal rights...... that is why a father cannot force a woman to have / not have an abortion.

I'm nothing like the Taliban. Thats a bit extreme. I'm hardly a misogynist because I believe that men do have some rights.

The reason a father should not have "the right to his child" as you put it, is because his rights would conflict with those of the mother. And where her body is the one which is of necessity to be the means by which he has the "right to his child", then her rights to have control of her body have got to trump his.

As soon as he has the facility to have the "right to his child" without forcing her to do something she doesn't want to, then of course he can. Until then, he'll have to accept that his rights don't include enslaving another human being.

he gave up that right when he made a sperm deposit in her bank and then walked off without ever contacting her again.

Well Control thats probably why we disagree, while I don't want to discuss the rights and wrongs of abortion, I believe that it is a child. That would be why we can't see eye to eye. I understan that some men see it as a child and how awful it must be for them to lo9se that

She didn't contact him either. It takes two after all

Paula you don't believe men have "some rights". You believe they ought to have the right to control a woman's body.

That's not "some rights".

Or at least, you haven't clearly stated that you don't believe that. Every single post you make, implies that. I'll stand corrected if you clarify, but I doubt if you will.

well if those men think an unborn foetus is the sam as a child then, like you, they are wrong.

yes, but she couldn't abscond herself entirely the way he did, paula, she had to then either terminate or have the child, which she did.

"I'm hardly a misogynist because I believe that men do have some rights."

You're arguing that men should have "rights" over women's bodies in order that they can have babies that the women don't want. You also seem to have a very condemnatory view of women who are sexually active whilst saying nothing about what men do.

Those sort of ideas do have a lot in common with sexist fundmentalists both in the east and in the west whose beliefs are based around the idea that men should have control over women's bodies.

she didn't contact him - but she didn't have to contact him in order to stay in touch with the product of their liaison. he, on the other hand, if interested in taking responsibility for his sperm, needed to do so through her.

amy what's your definition of "dealing with the consequences" of promiscuity?

For many people, there are no consequences.

Yes I believe that if man wanted the child then a woman should have to carry it. I'm not saying its the easy way. I'm not saying it doesn't suck. I don't like it.

Woman do have the right to their bodies, they have the right to choose who, how and when (Most of the time) to sex. They can choose not to.

paula, she didnt contact him presumably because, for whatever reason, she didnt want to.... what is your point?

well if you really believe that paula i shall have to say again that you are, quite simply, wrong. your position is ill thought through and your views contradictory and anti-feminist.