Madeleine McCann

[morningpaper]

Instead of starting lots of new posts about Madeleine, could I politely request that anyone who wants to post on the subject please post on this one thread? (N.B. Duplicate threads may be flamed hysterically.)

Please note that this thread is not to criticise Madeleine's parents or family, as this is not in the spirit of Mumsnet.

Please can I take the liberty to quote from this article:

"This is the real life of Kate and Gerry McCann, and it must now have become a place of agony beyond all understanding. Pity them, if you have any compassion at all, and demonstrate the minimum of grace: the ability to desist from judgment."

It must be very hard to fall apart when you have got to look after 2 year old twins 24/7

Pagwatch - we were going to let ds go to our local park during the summer holidays with thew week boy across the road (so they would have both been over 6.5). There is one road to cross, which has traffic lights with a pedestrian corssing, so we considerdd they would be safe.

As it was, we never got round to it - ds was in out of school holiday club all summer and never really had the opportunity.

We probably will let him do it next summer.

he gets to cycle up and down the (very wide) pavement on his own. Ironically, that is porbably where he is most at risk, as we have boy racers who take advatnage of the fact that our sreet is wide, quiet and stragiht - and one recenly swerved to avoid a pot hole (we think) and lost control, ending up on its roof on the pavement

He does get freedom when we are on holiday - when we were in Greece, we left him playing in the (small, family run) (not by the pool ) while dh and I wandered off to the shops to get supplies.

We also used to let him go up to bed on his onw, only going and checking on him later.

I can understand why they have to be calm in the public eye. They have to find their daughter. They have to stay focused and intelligible to the world's media.

I don't think the calmness is sinister. I think it is heartbreaking.

Would pictures of Mrs McCann beating her breasts and pounding the floor with grief earn her more sympathy? I dare say some of you would then comment on how unseemly a show it is, and how such extreme behaviour is proof positive of her guilt.

Agree with Hula about how we don't know how they behave in private.

As a McCann sympathiser and someone who has never been involved in arguments on these threads so far but is naturally interested in the developments of the case can I just ask for a bit of info on two issues I can't find answers to?

(I've been away and didn't keep up-to-date with the details of the case)

1. A few people in RL have mentioned to me the possibility that the McCanns gave sedatives to the kids when they went out. Is that real or heresay?

2. Has anybody seriously questioned where the McCanns supposedly hid the body for 25 days before they got the hire car and how they disposed of the body while under constant scrutiny?

Forgive me if these questions have been answered a million times over. But if you have patience I'd really appreciate it.

And if inappropriate in any way, please ignore!

Twinkle
I hear what you say and I don't wish to disagree with you - so we shall have to just accept that we feel differently about this [smiling reasonable emocion ).

I think my view has just been formed by a number of factors and I won't ever say "in that situation I would do x" becuase experince has taught me differently.
I watched my mother discuss casket prices with the funeral director when two hours earlier she had been lying on the floor. She never showed a hint of her loss - after 60 years because she wanted my darling dad to 'see' her hold it together.
My sister is a registrar and learnt REALLY early on never to assume why people are making an appointment as sometimes the most composed people are registering deaths.
When our son was diagnosed as being profoundly disabled I went into a frenzy of activity and it took my near collapse nearly a year later for anyone to realise I was barely holding on. My husband looked the epitome of composure and it took ME ( his wife, his best friend for twenty years) over a year to get any idea of just how deeply heart broken he had been.
He and i were frequently complimented on our 'coping' skills but it was far from the truth. And we value - perhaps stupidly, perhaps in an old fashioned way, dignity. My husband is only in his 30's but he could never display emotions like that in public without feeling he had exposed himself in an undignified way.
Perhaps that is why this is difficult for me. My husband would always be accused of being cold when that is far from the truth. I hope to god we never are put in a situation where he is judged for his emotional displays or he and I are screwed. Longer than I intended - sorry .
Thats why I can't agree with you. We just see this differently

pagwatch, you put it beautifully

Ok

Maybe you are right but what you call dignity could be just being cold and calculated - I fall apart - am not undignified am just taken over by emotion. I think perhaps she would have garnered more public sympathy and understanding if she had shown a little more emotion to tell the truth.

But then with me and my ultra quiet, shy, conservative husband also in his 30s up there wailing and crying it could equally be taken as us over reacting and may arouse suspicion.

just sticking my toe in the water - I have steered clear of these threads before.

Dh and I were musing that maybe they thought they were safe leaving the kids while they went out because they had sedated them - being doctors presumably they have the knowledge and means ?

Getting that wrong would presumably come under the heading of accidental killing ?

Sorry if this has been commented on before.

Whatever happened - whoever was involved has so far done a very good job at covering it up. That is assuming she did not just wander off and get swept away to sea somehow.

As a parent this whole thing this has to be your worst nightmare.

So had they sedated them?

(see my questions below... anyone?)

you wouldnt know how you would behave Twinkie unless its happened to you Im afraid. They have to deal with it regardless of the circumstances surrounding Madeleine's disappearance. Im sure both parents would have freaked out too at the thought of something happening. Quite often the reality is very different to the prospect of something happening

IF - there has been nothing official to suggest that they had sedated their children. Just one of the rumours flying I round I think.

Twinkle - perhaps we should get our husband together for some emotional reconditioning

Ithink its nice that we all react differently, I'm all for variety.With me it is a bit about dignity but it is also because I can't let go. I NEVER cry in public because I know it is like a tidal wave and i would not be able to stop.
FWIW I don't judge people who DO cry as being over-emotional - it is just their make up. I possibly envy them - I don't know? And of course it could be cold and calculated. But if I were that cold and calculated I thgink I would be smart enough to cry a little for the punters.

Blueshoes - thank you

While on the how the parents behave subject ... My father died a sudden, violent, awful death and while the investigation was going on my mum didn't cry once, she was in total trauma. She had a look very similar in fact to that on Kate McCann's face. My brother went into totally practical mode and was also seemingly 'calm'. I lost it completely and cried for weeks. So we all handled it differently.

Thanks hulababy, that's what I suspected. Where do these rumours come from?! It must be hell for the parents.

click clack
click clack.

Pass them more wool.

It's just specualtion that they sedated them - nonthing official.

FWIW, I would have been confident that ds would sleep through and not get up - and he has never been sedated (unless you count deliberately giving him EBM that had been expressed following a boozy supper and lablled as such! - but that was a long time ago!). I can also go in to his room, switch on the light, get things out of drawers, talk to dh and he still doesn't wake up. We made a point of being noisy about him while he was sleeping when he was a baby - and it appears to have paid off.

the item the judge wants to seize within 24 hours is apparently Kate McCann's diary

nfw unbelievable

Twinkle, you do not know how you would react. My 15 year old ran away two years ago now. Admittedly she was only gone for hours as her and her friend had decided to hide it out in her grans caravan at the end of her garden because they had boyfriend trouble . BUT i DID fall apart, i was heavily pregnant at the time, i cried, i wailed, i screamed, i did all of that AT HOME. But when i was talking to the police and the parents of the other child, i kept it together and after a while i told myself i had to keep it together for the sake of my unborn child. i was convinced i was going to lose them both. I can tell you taht a sort of numbness seeps over you allowing you to function, you just do.

I think Madeleine's parents have conducted themselves admirably and i would imagine much crying wailing and screaming has taken place behind closed doors. What sort of drama hungry public are we if we expect to see this laid out in front of us.

I am totally 100% in support of the McCanns and i can only pray that their little girl is found safe and that they take out the biggest bloody law suit against the police for the distress they have been placed under and their incompetence.

I have just heard on the radio that the Mc Canns are going to commision their own forensic tests of the car, why would a guilty party do that??

which ever way this goes their lives are ruined. I can not say how they can continue with their careers either way.

And whatever the outcome they are going to spend the rest of their lives in a living hell

imaginary friend, no, the mccanns deny sedating their children so they can go out on the randan. No published theory regarding hiding/transporting body...although rumours regarding the church they had 24 hour access to.

pagwatch. lovely post. i may not agree iwth you 100% but it's refreshing to see a discusion without people resorting to name calling.

I don't believe in god, but i do think that peoples faith can keep them strong in awful circumstances. i certainly wouldn't project my imagined reaction onto anyone.

sky (...) now reporting that police want to seize Kate McCanns diary. i really can't imagine she's written 'May 4 - caused accidental death of dd, must cover up, or public sympathy will vanish'. May 6 - had great idea, will start 'find maddie fund and pocket the cash. heehee.

I am getting bugged by people in general going, 'but who else had the car between madeleines disappearance and the McCanns having it - as if this just wouldn't occur to the portugese authorities.

last point (sorry this is a bit fragmented) I hate seeing pictures of the twins in the press. far from looking 'happy' or 'excited' at going out they look confused and bewildered. I appreciate that the mcCanns want them to get back to a routine and a normal home life, but that can't happen when there are press photographers following their every move. and why aren't they pixelised like 'celebrity' children? I'm not sure of the rules on that and would appreciate any illumination.

What has happened to innocent until proven guily.

What is now happening is nothing short of a witch hunt and is disgusting.

Let the facts come out and deal with them not idle gossip, I'm sick to death of everyone going on about their right to discuss what is happening in the news whilst preading more rumours.

er not all of us think they are guilty.

and you can now tick the box which says not in the news so you don't have to see it in active convos.

i've only seen one person openly state on here that she thinks they are guilty and i think that person is just after a bit of a reputation tbh