'Stressed' father batters his 2 yr old daughter

[Lovecat]

story here

Poor little girl. It says he's been sectioned, shame he couldn't have gotten help sooner...

I read that he was sectioned after he tried to harm himself whilst in police custody - not that he was sectioned immediately.

I wonder - if this man weren't a wealthy, educated professional would everyone be giving him the benefit of the doubt and assuming he must have been suffering from a severe mental illness in order to have done something like this.

No, it's the 'being sectioned' bit that makes us all think he's suffering mental illness, not the rich successful bit.

argh, said I wasn't coming back.

going now, honest.

My brother sections people. It's a last resort but necessary sometimes. I don't think you can avert these types of tragedies and sadly some mumsnetters gorgeous toddlers in their teens may well have schizophrenia, hear voices and end up being unable to live fulfilling adult lives and indeed be a danger to others. So many of them even when on the medication don't take it when in fact it can control the problems.

Anyway must be dreadful for the mother today - husband arrested for murder and child dead. Her whole life fallen apart.

Where are you bobbysmum?

Do you know there is a difference between being sectioned and claiming dimished responsibility?

When someone is being sectioned they have virtually no say in the matter (generally because they are incapable of rational thought); it's down to the opinion of 2 psychiatrists and in the prescence of police officers. Thing may have changed but that's the basic premise.

ekra - would people be more sympathetic if the HE was a SHE, a stressed out mum who cracked under a mental illness?

I don't believe it is easy to get sectioned. I don't think it is just some excuse. To get sectioned means this man has a severe mental illness. Sadly in this situation he wasn't diagnosed or identified early enough to save this more little baby

hula - that's almost exactly what I said earlier in the thread...

diminished

Xenia, totally agree with your last sentence

yes. I would not be that mother for all the tea and t shirts and IT components in china. She is in a terrible place where hope is completely crushed.

The side effects can be awful but not taking the meds can be much worse. Most people are not a danger to others anyway - that's a separate issue.

I think it would be very hard for him to say when the police arrived voices told me to do it and then fake what is needed to be faked to be sectioned and also the consequences in terms of loss of personal power and indeed being lcoked into Broadmoor for life etc can be much worse than a life sentence for murder actually so it wouldn't be the soft option even if you were (unlikely) able to fake it.

Hulababy - I wasn't making any sepcific judgements. I'm merely saying we don't have the facts. He could have been sectioned just because he tried to commit suicide and nothing to do with why he harmed his daughter. I think that people are jumping to the conclusion that he must have been mentally ill because they can't imagine such a respectable man could commit such an act.

If it turns out he was suffering from a serious mental illness then he has my sympathy and I hope this case is used to help others seek help at an earlier stage.

Bobbysmum - many people with mental health problems hold down jobs and remain stable for many years. For all you know he may have been on medication in the past or decided he no longer wanted to take medication.

I disagrre. I think people are assuming he is seriously ill as he was sectioned. It ha snothing to do with who or what he is. Threatening suicide in a police cell would not, on its own, lead to a person being sectioned.

'Threatening suicide in a police cell would not, on its own, lead to a person being sectioned.' - Totally agree there Hulababy.

Having worked in a custody suite ( cells at a police staion ) if threatening suicide was the only issue he had shown then he would have been put on regular visits ( i.e 15mins or 30mins ) or even a 24hr watch .

He could have also been put in a cell which had CCTV to monitor him. ( If those facilties were avaible but I think most London Boroughs have them )

He's under suicide watch. I think it was the day he was arrested he was sectioned. They woudl need 2 psychiatrists and fairly strict tests passed to do that - presumably he was talking about voices he could hear and being instructed to kill and having some sort of psychotic episode But we don't really know. These are the real risks to us all - from the people we love. Many many more people are harmed by family than strangers.

My Mum has been sectioned loads of times due to her Manic Depression. When i was growing up i had to live with my Nan for almost a year when i was 3yrs old and my brother was just a baby.
Having my brother started off as PND then full blow manic attack and she was sectioned until she was stable.
All through my childhood my mum has basically spent her days, self-medicating, sleeping most of the day, never went out as she claimed she would have panic attacks.
She has NEVER worked in her life but at least she could be loving as a mother should be.
But, when i was a teenager i felt that i could never be MYSELF as she would threaten to harm herself if i dared go out at night.
So i basically did not have any boyfriends until my twenties.
She has attempted suidicide every year of my childhood and even tried it when my best friend came over for a sleepover.
Still have not forgiven her for that.
She was quite good when i met my husband to be and for 8 wonderfull years she got out of the house and actually enjoyed life.
Then i got pregnant and she changed overnight.
Made me feel like she was picking on me.
Since then she has been in hospital for 3yrs on and off and my daugher will be 5yrs next week.
Fell so sad my mum never got to really get to know her grandchildren.
She has now got Dementia brought on by the drugs controlling her mania and every 2 weeks she has an anti-schicotic injection just to keep her "normal".
I've started a job dealing with people with Dementia and Altzeimers just so that i can understand what my mum is going through.
They scare the shit out of me, but i have to understand for my own sake.
AB.

oh bloody hell, Ripeberry

Goes over my head now, i'm just watching my DD1 like a hawk as i spoke to my mum's eldest sister a few months ago and she said all the symptoms started when my mum was 5yrs old.
Don't think i'm affected by this kind of illness can skip a generation.
AB

Ripeberry, that's a tragic, tragic story. I really feel for you.

Thank you Edam, but i've been doing my new job (Home care) for about a month now and there are so many people out there not even elderly that have SO many problems it makes my famillies problems seem like nothing.
Out of 6 new starters i'm the only one who is still carrying on.
AB

Ripeberry, I'm so sorry - you sound very brave. My mum's best friend (well, former best friend now I suppose) has manic depression. It came on very suddenly at 36 (the same age as the father in this post) and strangely almost exactly the same time, to the month, that it happened to her own mother. She had two children of about 8 and 6 at the time and it took a terrible toll on the family. She went totally berserk and attacked my mum - I was 8 and witnessed it and can still remember it. There were 3 people - 2 men and a woman - having difficulty holding her back. It was terrifying for everyone involved. This was 32 years ago and she was put straight into a mental home where she stayed for several months. When she came out, to be honest, she couldn't cope with the pressures of normal life and after a few months, begged to go back. It was all very difficult for her family but that's where she felt happiest in the end as her life was controlled and managed. She has been there ever since. She was totally normal and down to earth before this episode.

When I read this story, it really reminded me of what happened and to be honest, I have sympathy with every member of that family. Bobbysmum07 is being extremely ignorant of what can actually happen and I am not one to make personal attacks but her posts are inconsiderate and insensitive. I can only assume her Dad was a detective in a less enlightened age, that of 'The Sweeney' maybe.

My thoughts are with the mother who must be in a state of complete shock. I sincerely hope she is getting appropriate support from both family and professionals. They are actually just around the corner from me.

"and sadly some mumsnetters gorgeous toddlers in their teens may well have schizophrenia"

I don't think we need to hear that really

But the stats show that one in four of us will suffer from mental illness in our lives - I think we always imagine that these things happen to other people, and that's why there is such a stigma attached to it. My neighbour was sectioned when he had a manic episode and attacked a policeman. In retrospect he did have an awful temper and a tendancy to get depressed, and he did smoke a lot of potent skunk. But you wouldn't have thought it of him, and he was otherwise a nice normal sort of person with a happy home life etc. It does make you much more aware of these things, and some disorders strike relatively late in life. Luckily after a stink in a mental health ward (not a pleasant place to be) and community support he seems to have made a good recovery, but very scary for his family and an ongoing worry for his partner.