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Original poster

What do people think is most likely to happen with the irish/UK Border Part 2.

785 replies

cathyclown · 01/12/2017 18:45

OK I took it upon myself in my arrogance. Nah, just enjoyed all the views whether we agreed or not, it has been very interesting.

So carry on folks. Link below to the original thread.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/in_the_news/a3096781-What-do-people-think-is-most-likely-to-happen-with-the-Irish-UK-border?msgid=73760649#73760649

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
Maryz · 03/12/2017 21:15

So Martina, can I get this straight.

You don't give a shiney shite about NI. You don't care about them having to have passports to move around their own country. You don't care if they are marginalised and abandoned by their own country. You don't care if violence breaks out and they all spend the next 20/30/40 years under police/army rule. You don't care, it's just a "minor inconvenience".

Ok. At least we know where you stand. You voted for Brexit, presumably?

Martina888 · 03/12/2017 21:16

Mary:

please show me some snippets from the article you are on about

treaclesoda · 03/12/2017 21:16

You know what, until about 1995 ish, I had to provide ID to the army and police at checkpoints to be allowed to travel freely around my own area. We were quizzed as to where we were going, why we were going there, how long we intended to be. I even remember as an 18 year old being quizzed as to who my boyfriend was and how long we had been in a relationship. I'm extremely pissed off at the thought that having left all that behind and living a normal life for over 20 years I might go back to some sort of second class citizen who has to identify myself just because of where I'm from.

Maryz · 03/12/2017 21:18

Any newspaper article from the last four weeks about NI and the border will tell you that the DUP will never, ever accept the need for any border, any checks or any division between NI and the rest of the UK?

Can you read? Other than the DM, the Mirror and the other completely clueless English tabloids, obviously.

Start with the articles linked from this and the last thread. Lots of them.

Martina888 · 03/12/2017 21:18

Mary:

sure I care about NI - this plan is to keep things as best as poss for NI, ie. frictionless border with ROI, leave the EU with only the minor hassle of an ID check when boarding a boat to GB

treaclesoda · 03/12/2017 21:18

because it's a minor compromise you must make in order to aid the UK in leaving the EU

It's not a minor compromise. It's a massive curtailment of my freedom. And I don't want to leave the EU anyway, and nor does N Ireland as a whole. So why we should compromise to make life easier for a government who don't give a shite about us is anyone's guess.

Maryz · 03/12/2017 21:21

I remember crossing the border after dark not knowing whether to be scared of the (frequent) IRA "checkpoints" or the (inevitable) poor trigger-happy 19 year old soldiers.

I really don't want to go back to that.

I'm in Dublin now; far, far away. But near enough to realise how fucking awful it will be for those who live near.

KennDodd · 03/12/2017 21:22

Hi sorry to ask as it was probably explained on the last thread somewhere, but why is saying Eire offensive? I always thought it was just Ireland in the Irish language (Irish Gaelic?) So using it if you're not speaking Irish just made people look a bit of a prat but no more than that. A bit like saying Deutschland instead of Germany when speaking English. I didn't know the word had history or what that history is.

Martina888 · 03/12/2017 21:22

treacle:

you are being melodramatic here, no one is talking about bringing back army checkpoints, razor wire etc and you know it

LaurieMarlow · 03/12/2017 21:22

martina yes the uk voted to leave the EU. Without any kind of plan for how they were going to execute it or get round knotty little problems like the NI border.

So now they find that no, those whose lives are going to be severely disrupted by it across the whole island of Ireland, are not prepared to make 'compromises' to facilitate the UK's poor planning.

Tough shit.

treaclesoda · 03/12/2017 21:24

you are being melodramatic here, no one is talking about bringing back army checkpoints, razor wire etc and you know it Hmm

I didn't say they were. I said that your solution would make us second class citizens again, who don't have freedom of movement within our own country.

implantsandaDyson · 03/12/2017 21:24

treaclesoda that’s what pisses me off the most as well. I find it very difficult to explain how hard the thought of having to provide that kind of info is again even if it’s just a box ticking exercise. I’ve quite a visceral almost reaction to the thought of it.

Martina888 · 03/12/2017 21:24

treacle wrote: 'it's not a minor compromise. It's a massive curtailment of my freedom.'

a massive curtailment of freedom???? what are u on?? LOL

you have to show a passport when getting EasyJet or Ryanair to UK already , even domestically

this is no change, stop the melodrama please

Martina888 · 03/12/2017 21:26

treacle:

you will still have freedom of movement within the UK and Rep.Ireland

Maryz · 03/12/2017 21:27

Martina, do you know who the DUP are? Do you know what their opinion is of "he minor hassle of an ID check when boarding a boat to GB"?

Do you realise that Ireland the EU have offered that and it's been completely rejected by the DUP

treaclesoda · 03/12/2017 21:28

It's not melodrama. You don't have to show a passport to cross on the ferry.

If you don't have to show a passport to cross from England to Scotland then why should I have to show one to travel to Scotland?

Martina888 · 03/12/2017 21:28

and realistically, it's not like everyone's passports will be looked at - more like random spot checks from time to time to stop illegal immigration etc..

Maryz · 03/12/2017 21:28

Foster has rejected it

And May depends on the DUP to stay in government, so ....

planbatman · 03/12/2017 21:29

It's not a minor hassle. I'm from a nationalist background and I'd feel it an erosion of my rights to be asked for ID going between Belfast and GB. The reaction from the unionist community would be far more emotive. It's a betrayal of their national identity to placate someone else who likely didn't even consider them.

treaclesoda · 03/12/2017 21:29

I won't have freedom of movement within the UK in the same way that other, non N Ireland, UK citizens would have. I'd have to identify myself and they wouldn't.

Martina888 · 03/12/2017 21:29

treacle:

because NI is different politically from the Eng/Scot border

Original poster
cathyclown · 03/12/2017 21:30

I wonder how TM and Vlad's crucial telephone call went tonight.

Imagine a phone call only at this critical juncture. Maybe she is afraid to meet him face to face or something. Well I am sure she needs something to give the impression that Sufficient Progress has been made on the Border issue at lunch Monday with Junker.

Should be an interesting day tomorrow. Either there is or isn't sufficient progress.

OP posts:
Maryz · 03/12/2017 21:30

Martina, your "solution" has been completely rejected by the DUP and the British government.

Have you any other suggestions?

Or do you not believe it? Do you think they are all lying, and that a simple "ID check" on the Irish sea is ok now? Better tell Arlene Foster it's all going to be ok.

PurplePillowCase · 03/12/2017 21:31

...and the most thing about this all is that the referendum was advisory
the government could have done a thorough impact statement and said 'sorry folks, can't do it, it's a stupid idea. but we can be more active in brussels and make a difference that way'

treaclesoda · 03/12/2017 21:31

because NI is different politically from the Eng/Scot border

It's part of the UK. How is it different? It might be disputed, and not everyone wants it to be part of the UK, but it still is, whether people like it or not.