What do people think is most likely to happen with the irish/UK Border Part 2.

[cathyclown]

OK I took it upon myself in my arrogance. Nah, just enjoyed all the views whether we agreed or not, it has been very interesting.

So carry on folks. Link below to the original thread.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/in_the_news/a3096781-What-do-people-think-is-most-likely-to-happen-with-the-Irish-UK-border?msgid=73760649#73760649

Well this way TM keeps any violence confined to NI/ Ireland so that's a win from her perspective, with the potential to get rid of NI altogether now a much more likely prospect too.

I wonder will the logical next step (as outlined on this thread) now also come true.

The DUP walk out, the government falls, and ... I dunno. ...

What's next? Anyone have the guts to say "hang on, let's have a new referendum Do you want to leave the EU now we know what it entails and now it means the breaking up of the union?

What will be the Scottish take on this?

Radio Ulster saying it couldn't happen without the agreement of a Stormont Assembly which we haven't got at the minute and even if we had they couldn't agree on anything anyway.

Ha ha to Stormont agreeing.

But it seems May is going to propose this as a solution without the agreement of anyone in NI

One thing May cannot dare say is "NI voted to stay", as that would open the doors for Scotland and possibly London wanting the same.

According to the telegraph 'unionists' claim that special status for NI breaches good Friday agreement.

Wow really? Apart from unionist objections, will that not lead to much higher prices in NI than currently, as their goods cannot come as easily from Britain? Ireland is much more expensive than NI, but both salaries and social welfare are also much higher.

It probably does, coffee. So would NI going with the rest of the UK and having a hard border.

In fact, essentially Britain leaving the EU breaches the GFA, but no-one thought of that

I realise I'm putting at the end of practically every sentence on this thread. That's because reading the news this morning I'm veering from [cynical] to [ffs] to [horror] to [cynical] again!

Ifailed, I never thought of that.

When I suggested back at the beginning that they should put the border at the England Scottish border I was joking. Maybe it's not so funny.

It’s just so depressing.

Re Scotland,

The Scottish government will definitely argue that the deal should apply to them too (hard border between Scotland and England?)

Independence support in Scotland has just bounced up a wee bit.

The Scottish and Welsh governments are AFAIK still planning on withholding legislative consent.

Interesting times ...

See how can the British government offer this to the EU as a "solution" to the border issue when they know that they won't get agreement to it in their own country.

The opposition will vote against, the DUP will certainly vote against, and I bet there are some conservative backbenchers who will not be happy with this.

Maybe I'm being cynical again, but is this a ploy to pretend to have a solution so that the UK can "move on" to talks about customs and goods etc and keep Brexiters happy, while in reality having no solution at all?

And then when it all goes to shit they can blame the EU, Ireland, NI, the DUP and anyone they like with "It's not my fault, I came with a solution, you lot are bullies"

Maybe I'm being cynical again, but is this a ploy to pretend to have a solution so that the UK can "move on" to talks about customs and goods etc and keep Brexiters happy, while in reality having no solution at all?

I'm cynical too...

I'm a bit of a Pollyanna. If TM, the Queen of pointless stubbornness, has seen that we have to shift on this just like all the other alleged red lines then there is hope.

Long time lurker, grew up on border and now in Dublin.
I reckon secretly TM is hoping that this leads to an election,l she has to resign, swans off to live out her retirement along side DC leaving them mess to everyone else.

I feel very sorry for NI, I have loads of cousins who live there and work in the south and this would be easier for them but equally have friends who regularly commute to UK and feel British so this sucks for them.

What is more astounding is that most ppl in Ireland and NI could forsee these issues as evidenced by they threads on here but a tonne of the UK politicians seemingly had no idea never mind the brexiters on the street

If TM, the Queen of pointless stubbornness, has seen that we have to shift on this

The problem is the rest of the government needs to shift on it too.

Eg from twitter 5 mins ago:

'Jeffrey Donaldson, DUP chief whip, tells me on suggestion UK has agreed there will be no regulatory divergence on island of Ireland on single market/customs union post-Brexit: "That is not our understanding of the UK Government's position."

Varadkar is holding a meeting at 1.30.

Rather fetching pic of his swarthy shoulders arriving to work in his gym kit this morning.....

What the DUP has always failed to understand about the British government and the Conservative Party in particular, is that they see the NI unionists as 'Paddies' too - it should have been blindingly obvious to them what would happen.

This is the top news story of the News Letter, a paper predominantly read by the Unionist community in NI; no mention of Brexit or today's meeting between the UK and the EU

Loyalists vow to continue flag protests, five years on from dispute

Instead there are still arguments about flags - not jobs, education or the collapsing NHS, but flags.

www.newsletter.co.uk/news

There is an opinion piece from Alex Kane on why the DUP should not overplay their hand which they would be well advised to heed.

yy the DUP and the Ulster Unionists as a political movement are famous for their "Ulster says NO" stance - we used to joke that it didn't matter what anyone suggested about anything, Ulster would say no.

This time they have a really good reason to say no - but I don't think anyone will listen to them.

Are the DUP really going to bring down a Government, potentially let in Corbyn (hated by them) and lose any influence whatsoever? Their hand is not as strong as they think. Anyway, I agree that TM must surely be looking for a way out of this mess at this stage. She's just being kept on stage to take all the heat for this.

As someone from a N Ireland unionist background I've never really understood the blind loyalty to the British government. Their loathing of us has always been palpable.

It's not a comfortable background to be from. There is a sense of desperation because frankly no one likes or wants us (and I use 'us' fairly loosely because I certainly don't identify with the DUP and am only very very moderately unionist in outlook) but it was an accident of birth to be born here, into this background. People feel afraid and isolated, but it's like being the unpopular girl in the class desperately trying to get the queen bee on side, and thinking if she tags along for long enough eventually the queen bee will come to see that she can't do without her.

I suspect everyone in the north feels a little like that, treacle

The Unionists want to remain in the Union but know the rest of the UK doesn't give a fuck about them. The Nationalists know they aren't wanted by the UK (any of them) but also know that Ireland can't really afford to absorb them. The middle-grounders are despised by everyone for having no backbone (and aren't wanted by either the UK or Ireland).

This entire fiasco is proof of how little anyone cares about NI - and it's ironic that when push comes to shove Ireland and Europe are showing themselves as much more interested in the welfare of NI than the British government.

I don't think the DUP have a choice, Phuquocdreams - they can't continue to support a government that is effectively chucking them out of the United KIngdom against their will.

Is it just me or is this meeting running late? I thought Varadkar was making an announcement at 1.30?

I’ve sometimes felt the Ulster Unionists are like the Sudeten Germans: caught in an awkward place geographically and almost psychologically.