CROWDS going into KENSINGTON TOWN HALL ..... BBC NEWS now

[RTKangaMummy]

They were outside but now the crowds have all entered the civic centre town hall

I am not surprised that this is happening

No decent person gives a fuck what the DM and Katie Hopkins think.

And it's that sort of arrogant dismissal which is so utterly dangerous

Plenty of people give a fuck what she says, and even side with her

We've had the conspiracy theorists saying this was a deliberate act of social cleansing

I can completely envisage that post-riot, Hopkins is going to suggest it was a deliberate act to illicit sympathy, money and 8-bedroom mansions for illegal immigrants? And you don't think that will lead to a huge backlash?

I'd be shouting as well all those people dead and fuckin point scoring going on

Too many people on MN want to tell others to shut up!

The contractors getting paid fine. Normal working people.

The folk who run the companies, mates who've schmoozed their MP. The ones in the 8 million quid house. The ones who've paid back handers. Who've bribed. Who are friends with the politicians.

There are examples of this ALL over PFI in the NHS. All over every council and quango.

There are literally hundreds of examples where people get rich off selling to the public sector. From arms dealing to cladding tower blocks, to providing latex gloves to the NHS.

We're as corrupt as Italy and most people don't realise it.

How will we all feel when we find out that the company who refurbished the tower block were paid 10 million to do it and that they provided it to current code but the director of the company PERSONALLY profited 2 million of that money. Are we still going to call him a good businessman?

This is what happens when you just ignore peoples needs and tell them austerity means tough choices, while your friends get richer.

This x100000000

For those saying violence isn't the answer, what the fuck is the answer then???
FOR YEARS the residents of Grenfell have been asking for their concerns to be taken seriously.
They weren't, they were ignored.

So when talking isn't working, and hasn't worked, what do you suggest then??

These people have been ignored for fucking years, now their friends, neighours AND CHILDREN are DEAD.

It is literally pathetic to be calling for calm from your safe place behind a keyboard, when peoples friends and family have died an entirely preventable death

FFS what is wrong with some of you??

plastic used cheaper option.

i agree with the pp who said this is in danger of turning into a Princess Di situation, for want of a better description.
There is only one acceptable point of view - and anyone who digresses must be shouted down as they clearly aren't as virtuous as the crowd.
This is turning into a ridiculous and dangerous situation, which is being whipped up by the media, so-called celebrities and forums like mn, when anyone who dares to disagree with accepted wisdom are accused of being a troll!
Why do people think a baying mob bursting into a council office and intimidating innocent council workers is a good idea?
Yes, people are angry, but this anger is being harvested by people with their own agendas and they are capitalising on the misery of the poor people caught up in this horror.
So many silly rumours going around - the fire was started deliberately, ethnic cleansing conspiracies, tarting up the appearance for the rich neighbours etc.
There is a great example of what I mean over on the thread in Chat, when posters jumped on the story of a child left alone at midnight as the mother was at work and turned it into a rant about Tory policies making single mothers work.
It then transpired that the child had been left alone in the flat by the father, who had gone to another flat in the block to see a friend.
So quick to twist any situation to fit their own agenda they didn't even bother to check the facts.
The fire quite clearly was a terrible tragedy, but no-one knows what happened yet. Yet council workers, the government and the manufacturers of the cladding have been hung, drawn and quartered on here by the kangaroo court.
I think it's madness.

Who should take charge in situations like this? Innocent question.

My late mum was an active WRVS member and used to take part in emergency practices. She had to take a bucket, a pair of rubber gloves and a pint of milk.

I genuinely don't think anyone is prepared for this sort of tragedy and what needs to be done for the best.

Draylon - ok, it's how our economy currently works but the consequences of unrestricted capitalism are what's happened

Instead of profiting 2 mn (just a made up figure !) he should have instead profited 1 million and it should have been done better than code, to European standards, with the safety of the residents at the forefront

Pure profiting without censure, without regulations gets people killed

Today I hate unrestrained capitalism. Capitalism without care kills.

@bringmesunshinetoo Even if the council released a figure of how many people were OFFICIALLY resident in the building, how could they possibly know how many were actually there that night? It wouldn't account for visitors/house guests, or any number of tenants living in flats without being declared as residents to the council. I can't see that there would be any benefit from the council releasing such a number.

With regards to the death toll figure, people need to understand that the authorities must be given time to carry out the terribly difficult formal identification process. The building is still smouldering for goodness' sake; how anyone can expect them to have a concrete number and to have formally identified all the victims within just 2 days is ludicrous. I also think it's hugely inaccurate and unfair that the authorities/council/media are being accused of 'downplaying' the death toll - today they officially announced it stands at 30 and will likely rise much higher. What more can they be expected to say than that at this stage?!

A sensible article from the BBC about the reporting of the number of victims vs speculating on the number of victims

cathf

but WHY can't the Council confirm the normal occupancy of the block?

the refusal to do something as basic as this is what enrages people.

Lana yes to EVERYTHING you said. How dare people,any people, ask them to be calm.

tarting up the appearance

not a rumour cath : well documented fact.

Worship it has been estimated that 600 people lived in that block. That was from the council housing officer i spoke to at westway centre. Yes thats 600 people

Are people who lost everything still sleeping on the floor with nothing? Not according to what it says on RBKC website - it says that they have been offered hotel accomodation and given money to help with immediate needs.

www.rbkc.gov.uk/newsroom/all-council-statements/fire-grenfell-tower

Maybe the people sleeping in community halls are people evacuated from nearby buildings?

I know people are angry and upset but they can't magic up homes for 120 households from nowhere

I

Lana the answer is to vote. To be prepared to stand up and be counted. To agitate. To harass your local councillors, MP.

I do this anyway, on loads of issues....all it has got is to be branded an "agitator".

I go to lots and lots (often never in the media btw) of protests.

I vote.

It doesn't change the fact that the entire system needs fucking addressing.

To be prepared to stand up and be counted. To agitate. To harass your local councillors, MP

THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT THE RESIDENTS OF GRENFALL DID. WHERE DID IT GET THEM.....OH YEAH...FUCKING DEAD

I'm not sure why the number of residents would help anyone

And the authorities came in for a deal of grief after the Manchester Arena bombing for not identifying victims quickly enough. I imagine it will take a lot longer to identify these victims, if indeed they can.

ButterflyFree x posts...
Yes, you make important points.
But if the Residents wish to know what the average figure is, who is the Council to deny that basic information and to decide if it 'helps them' or not?

I absolutely understand the anger . if I had witnessed or even knew a friend of a friend had witnessed a mother having to throw her child out of a burning building knowing that she was going to burn to death I would be pretty bloody angry as well .
And to then have my grieving micro managed in such a patronising way would possibly tip me over the edge.

I am angry and none of the above is my life.

The people protesting may not be the ones who got out of that building but they probably know them or their neighbours or maybe they live in a flat with similar cladding and are shitting themselves now.

The fact that the residents had not been listened to for years about safety concerns probably makes you feel less inclined to wait nicely while an investigation happens.