Grenfell Tower

[RhythmAndStealth]

Watching the news just now and I can't believe my eyes. It looks absolutely horrific.

I want to think everyone got out safe, but sadly I just can't.

Some of the news reports are about alleged poor safety standards and dangerous living conditions. If that's true it just beggars belief.

HelenaDove - That interview was on BBC1 about 10.15. I saw it live.

I have seen reports of a women having escaped the 22nd floor and another women with six kids escaping from the 21st floor but that only four of her kids have been found alive so far.

YY Condensed and tenants have no choice about who they let into their homes when it comes to sub contractors.

But i have been told on here by some (although most posters have agreed and/or been incredibly supportive) that i am obsessed and that tenants are getting repairs done "for free" so basically shouldnt complain.

Im betting the tenants at Grenfell are highly likely to have experienced the same attitudes.

I think high rise buildings have dry risers so the FB can pump water to upper floors.

They do. I've heard reports speculating are that there were problems doing this at Grenfell for some reason, which has made fighting the blaze more difficult.

This may be a stupid question but if we don't have the appropriate equipment for fighting fires above 10 floors or whatever why do we allow building above this height?

Tall buildings are designed to contain fires, i.e. using fire retardant materials for walls, floors, doors, etc. Fires can only be fought from within by firefighters going up and connecting their hoses etc to wet/dry risers (water pipes built within the building, so a kind of hydrant on every floor). In theory, each flat/room should be "firesafe" for an hour or so to allow time for firefighters to contain the fire and enable a controlled evacuation if necessary.

Unfortunately, that whole ethos was based around the fire precautions stopping fire from spreading within the building. What we've seen here is the fire spreading outside the building and into each individual flat/room. The fire fighting/rescue ethos just wasn't designed to deal with external threats (like flammable cladding and indeed aircraft such as New York 9/11).

Ironically, this old building seems to have been inherently safe when first designed and for most of its' life. It appears to have been made dangerous because of the recently added exterior cladding.

lagirafe, someone is bound to be more knowledgable than me, but basically fire doors, concrete between floors and fire proofing between walls along with hose systems inside the building mean that if a fire does break out it can be contained and stopped from spreading or at least slowed down allowing people to escape or be rescued.

It usually works well and limits casualties. It's why this is such an appalling tragedy.

Thanks lagiraffe and 11

I've heard reports speculating are that there were problems doing this at Grenfell for some reason, which has made fighting the blaze more difficult.

There were comments on the Grenfell blog about previous instances of faulty emergency lighting and faulty dry risers.

Sorry didn't mean to judge the blog. Just hope answers are found.

Just switched on the news after a few hours away and at least the toll has not risen, still 6 is far too many.

Has there been one official fund been set up? So many different ones are in my feed.

With regards to the dry risers, one of the earlier statements on the news was that these were unusable in this instance; it didn't clarify if this was because they were inaccessible or because they were not working.

I don't know if it has already been mentioned as I can't keep up with the thread, but the man waving at the window, who was identified by his family, was rescued at approx. 12noon. There are pictures of him being carried out conscious.

On a very sad day this is a bit of good news and I know people were asking about him.

The older man waving at his window has been rescued. It's on the Fail website so I won't link but there are pictures of him being carried outside by firefighters. A shred of good news.

I should imagine the organisations involved in the management of the building and the refurb seeking legal advice right now.

I hope other local authorities across the U.K will review the safety of their high rise blocks as well.

Every time I see the coverage i feel pure rage at what these people have been put through.

Why don't all tower blocks have emergency staircases like the flat in friends? They look difficult to use but could have saved lives here.

I imagine even someone with an emergency ladder to throw out wouldn't have helped much as the fire wrapped around the building.

There is a screenshot on Twitter saying someone is worried that going to stay with a relative or friend will disqualify or move him way down the list for emergency housing.

I can completely understand that fear. I had a house fire year in 2009 - we were out of our home for almost a year whilst it was cleared and renovated. We were told we would not be offered accommodation if we'd found family/friends to stay with - both our insurers and the council told us this. I can't imagine the housing situation has improved over the last 8 years. Who would be able to put several people up on their sofa/in spare room for this long, or longer? I know they can't magic properties from nowhere but they could offer priority on private rentals in a situation such as this, surely?

My family were very put out that I refused their offer of a bed for a few nights/weeks. They later understood why I'd said this, as no way could they have put 4 of us up for a year or more.

Good news about the older man.

Guy on BBC News has just said about being pushed to one side for accomodation if he goes to stay with friends.

How come the government hasn't stepped in and sorted emergency accommodation, hotel rooms sports halls etc etc??????????????? these people need somewhere safe to sleep.

Good to hear of his rescue but how terrifying must it have been for him if he was not rescued until nearly 11 hours after the fire started. Never knowing if all of a sudden your flat will explode in the flames or if the building would collapse.

Roomba. Im sorry you went through that. I think its the same guy who reiterated it on BBC News so this fact will be publicised more.

Ok thank you I understand.

This Charity is local and has a fund open for donations for Grenfell Tower residents.
thekandcfoundation.com/donate/

They are the recommended route via another local trust who are helping out with more immediate donations

www.facebook.com/RugbyPortobelloTrust/?fref=nf

I am avoiding crowdfunding personally xx

Helena I am extremely lucky to own my own house - I hung on to it by the skin of my teeth after splitting with my ex , I nearly had it repossessed and would have ended up in LA housing.

I feel somewhat ashamed that I didn't know how people in LA housing are being treated , I assumed that properties would be properly maintained . Horrified doesn't begin to cover it .

Yes -I wonder if emergency accommodation is being arranged right now? It's still pretty early after the incident but hopefully the local authority is already working on this. Perhaps some clean, safe accommodation in the same area which they can stay in until they return to their homes. That would be the decent thing to do.

The statement about not being offered emergency housing is confusing and I don't think the person on the news is doing anything but voicing a fear. This has nothing to do with emergency housing- he will need to be decanted and short term will be put up in temporary accommodation.

In terms of insurers I think they may avoid renting another property for you if you say you'll stay with family for the duration of the refurb but that's not quite the same.

Either way these residents will be offered emergency accommodation. Understandably they would may rather not live in a hotel but that doesn't mean they've given up their substantive tenancy at grenfell tower. It's mixing up two different things.

As far as I am concerned we should be offering safe and good quality temporary accommodation to each and every family - be this hotel or whatever for now I don't care we must find the money.

They'll be put in hotels Bog.