Sex Attacks in Cologne and other European Cities Part VII

[januarybrown1998]

part 6

part 5

part 4

part 3

part 2

part 1

The events of NYE were shocking enough; the subsequent minimising and under-reporting were an affront to women's rights to equality across Europe.

It's a testament to the tenacity and commitment of this community that we are at thread VII; do join the discussion and feel free to share the links and letters to anyone you think may wish to be part of this important debate.

We are currently awaiting the approval of a petition to parliament.

Shortly we will post links for those who want to take a proactive part in safeguarding the rights of all UK women to live in freedom from the fear of mass sexual assault as we sadly saw in NYE and reports of which are finally seeing daylight across Europe.

I am assuming that the bans are taking the form of "you have to have EU residency rights"? Meaning that someone from China or whatever could also be banned. Even if this were desirable, this is not a long term solution as the majority of all migrants will soon get EU residency rights.

A more likely solution, in areas where these sorts of problems become widespread, is that we will start to see more gender segregation--women's only time at pools etc. Trouble is, this restricts men's freedom to swim when they like, and women who swim outside these hours could increasingly be perceived as "asking for" harassment.

"The ones at Calais are determined to go to the UK." But why ConferencePear and others? Could it be because they know they do not qualify? Afterall, I read that currently the genuine refugees are Syrian, Iraqi and South Sudanese. All others are economic migrants.

Theydon't you could of course simply ban those who misbehave rather than do a blanket ban based on a group of people based on where they're from. That way you could address the issue without going all 1930s.

In a normal situation yes perhaps. I guess anywhere this is what would normally happen. Once in a blue moon, some predator goes to swimming baths and behaves inappropriately so they ban him.

widow you seem to be willfully mis reading or mis understanding whats going on.

In one case lifeguards had to fight the men off to protect the women and children. This isn't a case of the odd nutter. Its gangs of strong young men!

These gangs more remind me of the nazis and the poor women being attacked the jews, not the other way round.

Life guards in the UK tend to be very young students and not many of them, just the legal requirement to watch the pool.

The problem here is so vast, they have decided the usual measures are not enough so they have to blanket ban these men.

Are you for real, suggesting gangs of strong men should be allowed into the baths, to grope and rape and then get banned?

unlucky video 1. I am appalled at Gavin Hewitt's report for the BBC. Not an ounce of impartiality. He should actually be up before his own union to answer why he felt a need to dress up his report, and he should be fined.

video 2. I saw this clip a month ago. This shouty, petulant behaviour is the norm for men from the ME (man in clip may or may not be Syrian), and demanding that the train go to where he wants the train to go. It's normal behaviour, i.e. do what I want or else, and it will be your fault, not mine. This way of expression does not sit well with the European way of discussion and seeing a situation from all angles, coming to amicable agreement. That is why we always see in TV reports, huge crowds of ME-NA men shouting, throwing and then fighting each other to the death. In their society it is never to do with meeting each other's opinion half way, but in dominating others who do not share your opinion.

You could say he misbehaved because he was at the end of his tether, but I would not.

I was around Iraqis (who live in the West) for over 9 years and I can see that it is very difficult to change inculcated behaviour.

help

I wouldnt even bother asking its clear what makes reports Ok to some posters...ones that fit into their narrow views.

Still waiting on Emily's appraisal / thoughts of the Atlantic article which clearly and consistently lays out each part where ISIS is strongly wedded to ISLAM.

'I saw this clip a month ago. This shouty, petulant behaviour is the norm for men from the ME (man in clip may or may not be Syrian)'

No, it certainly isn't the norm help. It isn't the norm for Syrians either. You are tring to spread a very negative stereotype.

I do think we have to be very clear though that it is the behaviours we do not want to tolerate and not any particular group, whether we define that by ethnicity, sex or religion.

I am not against refugees, men, Muslims or anti-immigration but I am against those who behave in an anti-social way and who would change our Western way of life and freedoms. I would like to see measures taken to stop those things through sensible immigration policies and education which, hopefully, would protect those refugees who truly need our help

Unite Against Fascism (UAF). I tried twice to engage with the UAF to ask them why - if they are really anti-fascist - they support and join demonstrations with extremists Muslims. Their placards read: "Death to British soldiers", "Freedom Go To Hell", "Be prepared for the real Holocaust", "Behead those who insult Islam", "Britain will run red with the blood of the Infidel"

All of the above shit and more. Afterall, enforcing one system, one identity onto a society is fascism. They would not respond to me so we now know they support fascism in all its guises.

Depressed to see so few MPs supporting the Early Day Motion mentioned earlier on the thread (by Sonya and January) that highlights the initial under-reporting of Cologne. Only six MPs, and just one from outside the DUP.

www.edms.org.uk/2015-16/953.htm

Help- I wonder again what you meant when you said you were a trained observer and analyst?

I am not trying to spread anything, Emily. I am relating my person, firsthand observation. It just does not fit into your attempts to portray all migrants as "heroes" - your own words in a previous post upthread.

Peoples from ME, Italy, Malta express themselves freely in a physical, loud way. You might call it the Latin temperament, if you like. Whatever you call it, their behaviour is very extrovert and aggressive when they do not like some pronouncement. I am not actually criticising the behaviour, I am pointing out that in Europe it will be seen as intimidatory and antisocial. Europeans - yes, even the Italians - do not resort to bad behaviour at the drop of a hat.

That might be to do with a number of things, such as we can register our disagreement by writing, well behaved demos, petitions, speaking on radio phone-in, etc. And of course, the crowds we see on TV are all men, that is not irrelevant.

Strongarming behaviour is not part of how Europe developed.

As I said before, I had an eagle's eye view of ME men for over 9 yrs so I know what I am talking about.

MoreShabby Thanks for the link about the swimming baths and those fluffy bunny heroes op speaks of. Well, do we feel culturally enriched? And for those posters who think this is how Germany's future doctors and dentistis behave, I dont think I will ever be a client.

Either they have deliberately molested, jacked off and "emptied their bowels" to show contempt for Germany, OR they behave like this back home.

WHICH IS IT, Emily and others? Please advise.

I think it's a good idea to focus on how the petition will be promoted.

Can we have a copy of the wording put forward?

Good point Vertigo.

Current version is as follows:
“Women in the UK must be free to work, travel and live free of sexual violence

Recently, women across the EU were subjected to mass sexual assaults of a type previously unknown in Europe. We demand that Government brings forward proposals for extra measures to uphold UK women's rights, safety & freedom, and to expand police understanding-recognition-response to such behaviour.”

I suspect we may need to resubmit with a specific demand in the heading... but we shall see.

I was thinking of drafting a short press release, if no-one has done this yet?

If no-one has already done this, please could anyone who feels inclined please provide me with quotes: even just a few sentences explaining either what you want to achieve, or why you care, or why you became involved? Anything like that really. You can PM me if you prefer. Happy to keep it anonymous if you like...totally up to you.

Separately, is anyone on here willing to speak to the media (on the slight chance that they want to cover this)? I honestly don't know if there will be any media interest at all... I guess it depends on whether anything more "newsworthy" is happening.

What links were used in the third box?

'Either they have deliberately molested, jacked off and "emptied their bowels" to show contempt for Germany, OR they behave like this back home.

WHICH IS IT, Emily and others? Please advise.'- Help

I ask again about this training that you claim to have, because it seems that you think explanations that explain disturbed behaviour are both simple and culturally generaliseable.

I don't know why these men behaved in this disturbing way. But I doubt there is one simple causal explanation.

Here is my soundbite.

"I have nothing against refugees or transwomen, I wish them well in life. I have a problem with legislation that erodes women's hard won rights when then clash with other groups. I should have free speech to explain my concerns when rights clash"

Amend to

"I have nothing against refugees or transwomen, I wish them well in life. I have a problem with legislation that erodes women's hard won rights, when they clash with other groups. I should have free speech to explain my concerns when my rights are eroded."

The right to free speech means you have the right go utter your opinion. It doesn't mean the right for your opinion not to be challenged when you utter it.

I am happy to be challenged, i am not happy to have threats on my person for doing so.

Do you know any men, Twisted, from anywhere who behave like this? Just one possible reason for their behaviour would be fine - thanks. Dont need an essay on causal reasons.

Vertigo, these links were in the third box:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/petitions_noticeboard/2550186-Women-in-the-UK-must-be-free-to-work-travel-and-live-free-of-sexual-violence?watched=1

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-35241808

www.nytimes.com/2016/01/15/world/europe/as-germany-welcomes-migrantssexual-attacks-in-cologne-point-to-a-new-reality.html?_r=1

You want me to simplify in a way that i don't think is helpful.
When I talked about why people may end up behaving in barbaric ways before, I was called an apologist.

I do not think the explanation 'it is their culture' is anything like sufficient. I don't think it's true and i think it is an extremely destructive and reductionist message to spread.