Anti Semitism in the UK

[Oakmaiden]

This is in the news a lot at the moment.

I have never, to my knowledge, heard anyone make anti-Semitic remarks. Anti Islam, yes. Anti "them Polish people coming over here and taking our very badly paid jobs", yes. Anti Semitic, no. Am I just very lucky/ sheltered?

DH and I have just had exactly the same conversation. And I live in a fairly mixed area, with several Jewish friends, and lots of Jewish clients and colleagues. No one has mentioned it to me.

I also have Muslim friends and colleagues - heard lots of anti Islamic views on a regular basis...

We were wondering what we are missing?

Same here. I've never heard anything mentioned at all.

In conversation I regularly get things like "all Jews are right with money" (that from the guy who wanted to split the bill equally when everyone had streak except me and I had a salad, and then got a lift in my taxi without offering any money towards it... I also hear "Jews run Hollywood/music industry/America /banking pretty frequently"

I think It tends to be much more insidious than "we hate Jews"... Much more about demonizing us so that we become targets that everyone accepts as normal.

Not right with money... Tight with money!!

Ingrained casual racism about ALL races is prevalent in the uk.

It's not just Muslims OR Jewish.

I actually had this conversation with my mil yesterday over her casual ignorant racist remark about a take away we were having. She just could not understand what she had said that was offensive.

I also have seen casual racism from minority races towards other minority races. ALL races are guilty of it.

Yes, it's easy to overlook as it is not discussed really and a lot of discussion about it gets shut down with how other groups have it worse/are more visibly attacked (and so often the mainstrem pits Jewish people and Muslim people against each other).

For a snapshot - the Orthodox shul near me, there is massive security. During major holiday events, they literally will have a list of who they're expecting and if you are not on the list, they will ask someone inside to vouch for you, people will stand at the door the whole time to check anyone coming or going - people missing out on the event to do this, and while leaving people are reminded not loiter outside in groups. This is because of violence that has happens during high holidays almost every year. Even during multifaith events, only the side door with the big obvious camera was used and someone was on the door the whole time and in the social area there are posters with phone numbers for support for such attacks and lists of local attacks they were asking for any witnesses for. To most guests it's probably easy to overlook, but the strain and precautions to take care of the community from the violence is everywhere - and that's before we get into all the insidious ways particularly the media portrays Jewish people and codes character with anti-Semitic tropes that often get dismissed.

Agree OP, I have never heard anti Semitic talk here. That's not to say it doesn't happen of course.

A few years ago I asked a friend what is was that people didn't like about Jews- obv WW2 being the main indication that there was hatred around- and she didn't know either. I asked my parents who didn't really know either but suspected it was related to the historical role of Jewish money lending.

But you know how, even though you are not racist you generally know why people say they are? "Immigrants take our jobs" Muslims kill non Muslims and want to take over the world" "black people look different" but I have never heads any reasoning behind Jewish hatred

( not that any racism has reasoning, but you know what I mean)

I think, like a lot of problems, you're not so conscious of it if you're outside the affected group. Like other forms of prejudice, anti-semitism is not necessarily overt.

I believe most of anti semitism is because of the strength of anti Israel and anti Zionist feeling. Just look at the pages and pages of threads about Israel/Palestine in this section of Mumsnet (7000 posts!) from the past few months and the hatred of Israel that came across through much of it together with a strong feeling of anti semitism. No other country in the world has been criticised as much as Israel for defending itself while under attack. The Palestinian people have suffered terribly, but it is Israel and Jewish people who get the blame even though other countries like Egypt and Jordan could have helped solve the crisis.

The current wave of anti semitism has proved that Israel really needs to exist for every Jewish person throughout the world.

I'm Jewish and can categorically confirm anti semitism is on the rise. Low level all the way up to hurling eggs at a lady walking out of the door at her jewish sheltered accomodation.

Are you suggesting the news reports are untruthful?

I've thought about this a bit more and I believe that the current wave of anti semitism in Britain comes from three main directions:

1. The right wing groups like the BNP. They commit mainly low level attacks like desecration of Jewish graveyards, drawing graffiti on synagogues etc. They might carry out thuggish crimes with possible physical violence but they are less likely to bomb or kill Jews at the moment.

1. The left wing liberal intellectuals who criticise Israel and in the process of doing so create an acceptable brand of anti semitism. They are not a physical threat but because of a certain way of presenting views in the media many Jewish people feel extremely uncomfortable and targeted by them.

1. The Islamic extremists. They pose by far the biggest threat as they are happy to target and kill anyone who doesn't follow their beliefs which actually bear little resemblance to the teachings of the Koran. iSIS are becoming more powerful by the day and although their main hatred is of Jewish people and Israel they will not hesitate to kill other faiths too. They openly admit that they want Israel to be wiped off the map and to kill all Jewish people. The extremists have always been present in small numbers in Europe but their strength is growing now. They tend to operate by using small groups of brainwashed young people who are happy to die for their cause. Sadly it is only a matter of time before attacks that are similar to Paris and Antwerp happen here in the UK.

I live a few miles from a town that has many young disaffected Muslim men and there are certain areas of the town that I would never go to by myself as a woman,let alone a Jewish one. Somehow we need to change the current attitudes that are being taught in certain mosques and schools in the worst affected places. The area that I live in has a small, liberal, open minded synagogue and a small, liberal mosque. My synagogue has close links to the mosque and churches in the area and we run regular inter faith events. Sadly the local mosque has come under threat from the bigger community in the town a few miles away that has so much anti Jewish feeling.

I know that this post is rambling a bit but my overall point is that education of all ages and all faiths is key to stopping the anti Semitism in this country. Anti Semitism needs to become as taboo as any other kind of racism.

I forgot to mention - I've been spat and sworn at in the street recently because I was chatting to a Muslim couple. Children at Jewish schools in some areas have been told to stop wearing their uniforms after being attacked on the way home. Is that enough evidence for anyone who doubts anti semitism exists in this country?

When I've worked in public-facing jobs I've been surprised at the amount of casual anti-Semitism that has come up. Usually the cliched stuff to do with money. It is really shocking what some people will say in a previously polite conversation, without apparently thinking much of it.

There is certainly anti-Semitism in France, hence reports of many looking to leave.

Re the UK and starting on a slightly lighter note, a few years back my son told me to look out for an American black comedian based in the UK, called Reginald D. Hunter, after he’d originally seen him on ‘Have I Got News For You’.

Reg (if I may call him that) is an edgy social commentator type comedian, but not for everyone e.g. has no problem in stories calling any character within, the racial ‘N’ word.

Anyhoo, a few Saturday’s ago on the Dave (not the Conservative) channel, a Reg stand up routine (possibly a year or so old) was on late, and flicking back and forth, I heard some of his observations, including the one about the Jews living here.

Reg said that in times of racial tension, he’d like to move to somewhere like Golders Green in London, as due to hundreds of years or persecution/murder, their racial tension ‘spider senses’ kick in earlier than most - and as a black man, he’d get a heads up.

OK it was the way he told it, but whether in France or the UK, the ‘anti’ race or religion spidey senses are tingling.

The are anti-Muslim-isms here every day, that get worse when an Islamist carries out a dastardly deed, anywhere in the world.

But to my lack of formal education mind, a weddings and funerals only CoE, the anti-Semitism got far worse in the UK after the recent Palestinian-Israel conflict, as I don’t care what ANYONE says, the Palestinian propagandists got hold of this and would not let go – and you don’t have to go far to see it – within several thousand posts, including organised anti Jewish businesses campaigns.

The UK parliament must also have jingled the anti-Semitism fears of those living here, as when UK parliamentarians (of all parties I believe) call for a vote to recognise Palestine as a State - when the Palestinian people democratically elected around 2004 Hamas, a Sunni Islamist organisation for 20-years, whose founding Charter (still) includes the death of every Jew in Israel, in order to live in that land – it shows dangerous political head-up-bum-ism.

This is not about the rights, wrongs, and history of the Palestinian-Israel conflict, this is about UK politicians bending to propaganda without even thinking of how WE brought a religious conflict to the table, by demanding ‘give and take’ - and prerequisite to recognising any government, IMO should at least demand that one party recognizes that the other, has THE HUMAN RIGHT TO EXIST.

It makes me so sad that this is happening.

I really do blame the previous & present governments who did nothing to stop the growth of extremism like a cancer in our society.
And it is still happening, I was reading today that there is nothing in place to de-radicalise & rehabilitate those returning from Syria etc

A Jewish friend of mine recently linked this article by the Institute for Jewish Policy Research, which he feels is more balanced than some of the ones in the press lately.

I've seen anti-Semitic remarks on Mumsnet with increasing regularity including one on a Charlie Hebdo thread. Usually it's a Palestine supporter saying something that tips over from criticising Israel to blaming 'the Jews'. Only a tiny minority of the posters on Mumsnet who argue against Israel's behaviour do this, but it happens more than I would like.

Been listening to a fair bit of debate on this, but I'm confused.

Judaism is a faith, not a race. How is it possible to therefore be racist against Jews? What about the Khasar Jews of Russia? - converts, as opposed to being born into a 'race'.

'Anti-Semitism' - Semites are historically peoples from the Arab lands who have their root in the Hebrew language. The language being used seems wrong as Jews are not Semites Millions of Jews are of European, American or Russian descent.

Someone please clarify as it's driving me nuts!

I've definitely seen/heard it.

In fact, I've ended a friendship because of my friend's anti-semitic comments.

I've seen eggs pelted at the local synagogue.

Local councillors have told me that they spend a huge amount of time/money each year cleaning up anti-semitic graffiti including swastikas.

The killings in France and Belgium feel very close to home :(

yes you are lucky/sheltered

Still a bit confused - apologies, but it's something I'd like to understand. What about non-ethnic Jews?

Also, I can't see the link to Semites Whilst a very few Jews are from Semitic lineage, most are not.

I think it's abhorrent btw, just trying to get a better understanding.

Jackshit,

Interesting link from Wikipedia which may answer your questions.

It confirms my experience that I have only heard reference to Khasars from antisemites

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars

Agree with Isitmebut
There seems to be a blurring (yes on MN as well) of the difference between being anti Israeli and anti Semitic.

when I hear things about 'jews' it tends to be positive, even if it is clichéd, generalised or just plain bollocks.

successful
well behaved kids
bright / well performing kids
good business people