Part 6: Israeli-Palestinian conflict

[AndHarry]

Sorry, lost the end of the thread there!

Thread 5

Yeah - the article does say that there has been no adverse reaction from Israel, but quite what that means remains to be seen - it also says that necessary approvals still need to be sought.

because he challenged the pharisees - he wasn't interested in the romans granted but he had a lot to say about the jewish leadership and the hypocrisy of it and condemned it. he condemned the 'yoke' they placed upon the people and told them to come to him instead whose yoke was light etc and etc etc and he did publicly and loudly according to the stories. essentially a freedom fighter, the oppressors he countered were the jewish leaders, not the romans.

maybe a freedom fighter or radical but he wasn't aggressive and respected authority e.g. talking about taxes and caesar's head being on the coin. lots of people challenge the powers that be but it doesn't make them terrorists e.g. Martin Luther King

definitely not a terrorist, he helped people and healed tge sicj

of course he challenged authority and didn't respect it (the romans weren't recognised as an authority they were just an invading party) - the jewish leaders were the authority of the jewish people. he challenged jewish law, turned over tables in the temple, refused to conform, claimed himself to speak for god which was the ultimate blasphemy etc. he had a band of followers who walked away from all old ties and authorities over them to follow him.

nowadays anyone challenging their leaders in such a way and attracting such a band of followers would easily be classified as a terrorist threat - those are the times we live in. and you could bet if martin luther king was alive and leading a movement in palestine right now they'd be training the drones on his house and calling him a terrorist too.

... claimed himself to speak for god which was the ultimate blasphemy etc

Careful, Honeybadger - there could well be people on here who hold that to be a sacred truth. If you believe it to be a blasphemy then that's fair enough, but I'd suggest that's a bit different to saying it was

If we're going to repect peoples' religious convictions then that should surely apply to everyone - not just those we happen to support or agree with

I don't think HoneyBadger meant that she thinks it is a blasphemy, she meant that some other people at the time thought that was a blasphemy.

of course i didn't mean that i meant it was the ultimate blasphemy to the jewish authorities and leaders. for jews it was blasphemy, for muslims it's blasphemy that christians worship jesus as god. for christians it's not but christians and muslims didn't even exist at the time - judaism was the law.

You may well be right, Claig - but as I said, I believe it's wise to be careful, given the religious sensitivity of all types which is so often inflamed on here

she was right - see my reply above. i was speaking in context.

As a vair strict Christian I got the context :)

Sorry to go off on tangent, but can anyone suggest washing powder that doesn't break the boycott? Seems all the standard ones are produced by proctor and gamble or Unilever (with r&d facilities in Israel). I've tried Ecover and can't stomache the smell (tho I love their other products) and have found something called ECOS online tho that seemingly has coconut in it, to which DS is allergic. Suggestions welcome! I think Persil may be OK, but again, not v fond of smell (purple one esp. is like cheesy feet).

how about supermarket own brands? have you tried those? i haven't had to buy any yet.

Barcodes Start #871 or #729 includes Washing Powder or Liquid

hi everyone. been a few days since i've been on.

i was actually going to recommend this: www.buycott.com

it's an app for your smartphone or ipad so you can scan things in store. i only have an ipad so this week i've been through all of my beauty products at home to work out what is ok and what isn't!

i've also convinced my employer to do some pro bono work for the PCRF. www.pcrf.net they do amazing work for children in Palestine. Tomorrow a little girl arrives here for treatment. Meeting with them tonight.

feels very empowering to be doing something. however small.

QnBoudi you could try something like this - haven't tried it myself so can't say whether it's any good or not, or eco-eggs/eco balls (although I don't find them great for very dirty laundry).

This is very good if you don't like Ecover.

Finding shopping a bit of a nightmare too (don't have a smartphone). Didn't realise Magnum ice cream is owned by Unilever until this week. Also finding it hard with own brand meat free products - whether they are made by Tivall or not. According to one of the boycott sites they make a lot for supermarkets, but according to the barcodes the ones i use are fine. Not getting an answer from the supermarket. I know these things are a drop in the ocean.

maybe but imagine no one ever put a drop in the ocean? and we are what we decide to do or be. if we can't save the world we can at least live by our values i guess. if we're going back to religious analogies remember the salt and the yeast. small bits can make a difference.

and light - the tiniest candle throwing back a roomful of dark etc.

sorry, returning to say more and sentimentality warning coming up.

we have to hope it makes a difference - that giving a shit, that valuing human life and feeling something in the face of it's degradation etc etc MEANS something.

i don't know how far the economic reach or what difference it makes politically whether we care or not but i have to hope that at some core, heart level it makes a difference. it doesn't matter which religion you are or no religion at all, whether you think the world is run by energy or by money. i don't know how to put this but we have to hope that it somehow makes a difference that there are people in the world who witness and care, whatever tribal flag they live under.

sure it's just washing powder or asking your chemist not to give you israeli drugs, it's trivial and seemingly meaningless but if it's the only way we can nail our colours then?? it's important to to make your stand.

new ceasefire agreement reached and easing of blockade. Let's hope this is the beginning of better times.

boycottisraeltoday.wordpress.com/boycott-israel/ This site for boycotting might be useful to those interested as it is quite detailed.

Includes the likes of Motorola, IBM, Siemens, Intel, Este Lauder, M&S, Coca Cola, Starbucks, Nestlé River Island, Timberland etc.

Be aware that using supermarket home brands might still be made by boycotted companies.

Bambambini thanks for the link. Shocked to see that Starbucks has a branch at Guantanamo Bay. TheHoneyBadger I totally agree, the boycott has to be worth something. After being an M&S food lover I found it very easy to avoid today and after reading about those companies links with Israel it makes even more sense to use whatever power we have to make a stand.

I think that if people are serious about boycotting then they might want to know how extensive boycotted products could be. It's easy to skip a few packs of dates, oranges, flowers etc but to make your point the range goes on and a on and in a way that affects everyday shopping. Might help to email these companies to explain why you are no longer buying their products for a bigger impact.

yes and a shout out again for those on meds to ask their pharmacists for non israeli sourced meds. enough people doing that and walking away to another pharmacy with their prescription if they can't comply and it will make a difference to sourcing.

thread's gone very quiet. maybe we've run out of things to say. or hope?