The poor people in the 'plane, would they have suffered?

[hellymelly]

The news is so shocking, have avoided the tv news for days but read the papers today. Combined with the terrible images of injured children in Gaza it is all so upsetting. I can't help but think about the passengers in the downed airoplane, would they have been alive when they hit the ground? Or would they have passed out from lack of oxygen before then? I just hope that they knew nothing and were killed instantly but I realise that is probably unlikely. .

Well I agree with you there Beer, there was an bit of film on the news showing fingers poking out from under a black bag.
Both DH and I flinched and said it was totally unnecessary to show it.
This followed on from the distraught parents of a young Dutch man and his girlfriend who were on the flight.
Dreadful reporting and timing.

I have no self control to stay away

Beer How would you know about unnecessary news reports? Have YOU been trawling them then? I haven't seen any because i don't go looking for them to then express my outrage (after viewing them that is). Therein lies the heart of the matter- people like you regard these threads as entertainment not us because you entertain yourself by exercising a moral high ground that is actually rather low. I don't click on news sites that sensationalise. I don't click on threads that are about subjects I cannot handle reading about at any given moment.

And as for Titanic- was it not based on actual people, a ship, a sinking?

This isn't grief tourism.

People are talking about their feelings and those few comments that were too graphic have been shut down?

There has been a thread running where an OP is asking what happens when somebody dies and there have been many many threads containing questions and info like this. Why not go hound her for being intrusive, being insensitive, focusing on topics that should be shut down and hidden away lest they upset somebody who has just been bereaved? Poor woman just wants information about something that is upsetting and troubling her, just like the OP.

areyoubeingserved it's not about allowing personal experiences to shut conversations down.

It's about the fact that there are literally thousands of people around the world grieving for those who died, and some of us are posting about dead children's frozen expressions of fear.

If you can tell me there's no chance at all that a grieving person won't stumble on this thread, then fill your boots. Otherwise, leave it or move it to OTBT. Have some fucking decency and stop acting as if you're being censored. Your own moral compass should tell you this isn't right.

I switch it off and filter via radio. It really does help avoid painful images and actually in these days of TV content on demand, it is possible to not be assailed by it.

Phantom that thread was quite lovely, reassuring, supportive, etc. This thread took an unfortunate turn where it became the opposite of those things. That's the only difference.

Corporate

I believe ONE person mentioned that and it was quickly shut down. And actually nobody stumbles on a thread titled "The poor people in the 'plane, would they have suffered?"

BIG fucking clue in the title.

I think the mistake some make is to heap judgement and blame on the OP and others, based really on whatever distasteful revelations have been in the media. (for example the sky news reader who was rooting through a bag). But, I feel sorry for him too, he got confused between the boundaries and requirements of being a journalist and showing respect.

As soon as he'd had time to think he realised he'd made an error. But with a camera pointed at him , he made an error of judgement, so I feel for him. I don't defend everything that has been shown in the media. That is not my point.

Really what the posters who find these discussions so distasteful should feel careful not to do is to confuse 1) their distaste for what the media puts out their with 2) their feelings for people who react to what's in the news.

There is nothing worthy about confusing these two.

I wonder how many of us on here actively and extensively trawl the news for morbid detail on disasters.
I would think very, very few, most of us have seen the news though and have thought about it and then carried on with our day.

yes but it will not be long before somebody starts complaining about threads like that- mark my words because the more we give into it, the lower the threshold for 'upset' becomes.

Nobody is doing that, although there are posters who are casting people in that role iyswim

Beer

There are a LOT of threads like that and THIS OP wanted to seek reassurance and support for something close to her too. Why are we having a hierarchy of what people can seek support for? Why be so cynical about humans? The OP is clearly upset and bothered by her preoccupations as are many people. Ever wonder why our mental health problems are exploding? People NEED to talk. She was talking of her feelings and not wanting info on relatives nor graphic descriptions but being human we all make mistakes regarding what we think people are asking for.

But trying to make people feel guilty about a normal anxiety and preoccupation is cruel. There is nothing wrong with it and the OP is not speculating (a term which has been massively misused by the poster I took umbrage with when she then went on to add personal info about the children in her own post!).

Yes, Phantom there is a big fucking clue in the title. So I guess if a relative of the deceased came across it, they could just not click on it and forget all about it, eh?

Hey can everyone please stop now? The OP has apologied for upsetting anyone with her post, and it's very clear that she didn't mean to offend anyone.

There are millions of people across the world trying to come to terms with this tragedy. Obviously if haven't lost someone on that flight yourself, it doesn't mean that you can't be profoundly affected by what happened. It's natural to try and make sense of it (if there is any sense to be made. I don't think so). I think that's what the OP was doing, give her a break please.

Not clicking on it is the only way because to be honest if you abolish all mention on here where will that end? Not leaving your house for fear somebody mentions their bereavement? Expecting nobody to ever discuss a list of forbidden topics? Better stay off Mumsnet then in case you catch a glimpse of anything really. That is plain daft a comment to expect people to not post about NEWS items that upset them.

Beer you are the one who has been watching graphic news reports, not me so I cannot accept lectures from you re boundaries when you have been feeding the media beast yourself. I have managed to avoid graphic images. It isn't that hard.

Shocking I don't think anyone has had a pop at the OP, she started a thread with the best of motivations, but it all went a bit wrong, really, which is not her fault. It's just that some of the posts added in the general conversation were, I felt, too much.

I don't think (although I might be wrong) that the OP feels got at.

Nobody ever said anything about forgetting about it- do you really think not seeing anything traumatic on Mumsnet will enable a bereaved person to forget about it?

I just googled Grief Tourism, it doesn't compare to what is being talked about here.

See, this is where I think you have misunderstood, Phantom

Nobody has said (I don't think...) that we can't discuss things. But to be careful about what you're posting, sensitive to who might catch sight of it, and to remember that what you post online is on there forever.

Not really the censorship that's being claimed, at all really.