More women staying at home because they want to spend time with the kids - is this the reason?

[JustineMumsnet]

Hi all,
Am wrting in the Standard tomorrow about latest research suggesting stay at home mums are increasingly not returning to work because they want to spend more time with their children. Now Patricia Hewitt has said that Mothers who stayed at home had been under-valued for too long by the Goverment. What do you think - in an ideal world would you stay at home full time? Do you feel strongly about raising your kids yourself? If money were no object would you jack in the job and what, if anything, would make returning to work more attractive?
Have to say now I've chalked up four the thought of being a full-time mum is pretty terrifying (call in the professionals I say )

I haven't read all the posts but do you think there is a trend of people who would like to be a SAHM or are a SAHM because life would be better for the Mum? There are not as many mums saying they believe their LO's need a mum at home as I thought.

Personally I think life would be a lot easier not working on a stress level but I worry about depression brought on by isolation and the increasing debts. For me it is a balancing act. Find doing the SAHM bit a little surreal IYKWIM. I find I am withdrawing into a shell. Trying to introduce DD to nursery last week and this week cos I go back to work next week and I HATE it.

I stay at home because I want to look after my children and I don't feel childcare can ever do the job properly. Before having my kids I worked for 10 years at middle management level and enjoyed my work but deciding to be a sahm was the best thing for me and my family. I realise though that I was (and still am) very lucky to have the choice!

I don't think SAHM's resent the help offered to WOHM's, as some posters here have said. I think mums at home would just appreciate some financial help from the government, not everyone who chooses to be at home with their kids can actually afford it, but for many of us putting our kids into childcare is something we are completely against, that's our personnel choice.

What is this help offered to WOHMs? Curious, i'm not getting any, should I?

Cristina7

The help that I think people are referring to are the possibility of childcare vouchers to save tax/NIC on employed earnings and funding everyone gets of 2+1/2 hours a day at nursery for the over 3's.

In total this now reduces my nursery costs by approx £180 per month.

If my dh's employer also offered the childcare vouchers instead of part of his salary (annoyingly they just won't) we'd save another £90 each month in tax/NIC.

Thanks for the reminder. Neither my current nor past employer or DH's were into that :( Both v big organisations too.

The free places for over 3s is for all, though, whether working parents or not. DS was too old when they were introduced and DD is still too young.

Agree the nursery places, while useful to working parents, are actually provided for the benefit of the child. And the childcare vouchers are a bit hit and miss.

If I didn't work we would be eligible for more child tax credits (currently get about £22 a month) so we would actually be getting increased incentives for me not to work.

Cristina,

Please write to your local MP if neither your's or your dh's employers provide the vouchers. The MP's need to lobby the appropriate government department on behalf of their disgruntled constituents.

You could tell from the wording of his budget speech that Gordon Brown is well aware that not all employers are offering the scheme (usually because they calculate that there's no net saving in it for them).

He should have legislated to make it compulsory for employers with more than say 5 eligible employees but he still hasn't, presumably because the tax revenues are needed to boost his coffers.

Unless we make them aware that we are not happy at this random availablility of the childcare vouchers savings, they will do nothing to change it.

currently wondering whether to go back - exhauseted just at thought of juggling 2 lots of (1 pre-school, 1 school) childcare =- in opposite directions, very different hours with a demanding, long hrs culture office job. Truth be told, I don't want to leave baby - he's still too small IMO and I'm still bfing and don't wt to express ideally. Much more okay about leaving older child though . fEEL I should go back for the sake of my (future0 career/independence/security blanket, however, not missing it much at all!
Sorry, none of this is coherent - but in answer to the question, the gov oversimplifies the issue - most women don't simply want or not want to stay home with their kids. In very few cases is there any realistic choice.

Thanks for that, NN. My local MP is a Conservative this time round (not that the previous Labour one was much good) so it would be good to test him with something. My current and previous employer is a big London University but my contract is ending in a couple of weeks, after 8 years there. DH is self-employed now, so I guess we're on our own. (Actually, i might need to take DD out of nursery as it wouldn't make sense - financial or otherwise - for her to be in nursery and me at home. Unless i find a new job v soon.)

MissChief - maybe this belongs to a different thread, but you could continue BF and WOHM, even without expressing. I don't know how young your baby is, i guess the younger they are the more difficult it is (not to have to express). My DD is 13 months old and I work part-time and short hours and we've adapted BF to our hours apart (and I don't express at work).

hi cristina :). misschief, i am still bf my 9 month old, & working 2 days a week. no expressing at work. she has a bottle of formula at nursery, & i feed her when she's with me. it's working really well.

thx, Christina - IKWYM but he feeds over lunchtime too, not just am & last thing and there's no way I coudl work such short hrs in my job as it is (it's the nature of the job not my employer's infelxbility btw). This factor combined with the others (mainly juggling 2 v different types of chidlcare) makes me reluctant to return, I'm sure this is quite common after the birth of 2nd.

dd feeds on demand, several times during the day....

hi hoxtonchick - belated congrats (I remember you from antenatal threads way back obviously!).
It's hard fitting in feeds around work, isn't it? Maybe, if I'm honest, it's more because I don't want to leave ds2 rather than can't...

DD is the same, on demand during the day when I'm with her. She doesn't take a bottle at all :( so we just do more BF at night.

MissChief - the logistics of childcare for 2...We have a big gap and DS is in school, otherwise it would be v difficult.

I also bf my 3 yr old - currently just at night but until recently more or less on demand whenever we were together. When he was v small he had formula at the cm's but he was using a cup with water/baby juice from about 6 months with her. He was only away from me Monday, Wed and Thurs from 8.30is to 3.30 as I work at home 2 days a week,so there was plenty of time to top up on bm.

My older 2 bf at night and morning until they were 18m and 3 yrs respectively. They did have more formula during the day as I worked full-time then and 100% in the office.

Never expressed as I found it really hard to do and really life was too short.....

There are ways around these problems. Just have to find the right way for you.

thank you MC! i know exactly what you mean about leaving them, i find it very hard. 2 days a week is my absolute maximum. am so pleased i'm still bf though, i stopped at 6 months with ds. how old is your little one now?

I returned to work 2 days a weeks when dd was 8 months old and I missed her so much it hurt. I eventually stopped when she was almost 1years to be with her.

I could not imagine being away from her five days a week - that just never would of happended no matter what.

We did have to sacrifice alot, living on little money and in a small flat. I felt being with my baby more than made up for it.

I relish being a mum and really got into teaching and playing with her and spending lots of time outdoors and bike rides etc. When dd approached two I noticed she needed more than just me and I could see how much she loved being around her friends so I put her into a nursery two days a week. She loves it and has become a real independent little girl.

I started working part time again.

I am due another baby next month and plan to be with this baby all day everyday again and yes we will have to live on less money and juggle our debts again but to me being with and loving my baby 24 hours a day is more important than anything else in the world.

I chose to give birth to my children and I want to raise them.

Therefore in an ideal world it would be lovely for all mums to just enjoy their babies and toddlers without the worry of money and then usually around 2/3 years they need more stimulation and socialising so they benefit going to nusery a few days a week to socialise and learn in structured surroundings.

I think also by this time it would be nice then for the mums to work part time or take part in hobbies that they enjoy as a person and not just as a mother. Aferall its important to not forget about yourself.

Am I imagining it but the SAHMs on this thread are passionate that growing your own is the right choice ("could not put my little one in childcare") but the WOHMs are more whatever works for your family.

I am bird happy with my pt arrangement, which brings home a healthy amount to afford quality childcare and more. I shudder at the thought of spending long consecutive days with my demanding dd (which I did for a year whilst on maternity leave), SAHM so clearly not being for me. I get home at 3:30 pm everyday, so once dd is in school, I can still do playdates. Mind you, dh and I still make her X'mas plays and Easter parades. And my work is not demanding enough that I go into apoplexy if dd is ill and needs me at home at short notice.

It is possible to find a balance without feeling that you have compromised yourself as a parent. But the circumstances have to work for your family. But if I was not fortunate enough to achieve this balance, then I might find myself at home through no choice at all and feel quite bitter about it. My mother was a martyr for her children - I did not appreciate that.

Good post, Blueshoes - I identify with most of it.

Blueshoes - you are not imagining it, it is a MN phenomenon.

I think very few SAHM's on MN confess it was the right choice for them in comparision to their working life prior to motherhood. The vast majority say it is the right thing for small children in general to have a stay at home parent, not the right thing in their circumstances.

This is what I find so different to talking to RL friends where we all know about what each others working lives were like pre and immediately post baby's arrival.

I'm a SAHM who still puts her kids in childcare so I can have time off from them. Ds2 is in day nursey as I write (dh has just gone to fetch him)

"...it is a MN phenomenon"

Not just MN. I have NEVER heard critical comments about working parents in RL by anyone of my general age - although older people might comment from time to time. But on parenting websites I've heard similar comments ad infinitum. But as a reasonable majority of WOHM's do so due to financial neccessity maybe 'the right thing' has to come second to pragmatism and making the best of a circumstance that you wouldn't neccessarily choose.

Normsnockers - I'll be one of that small minority then. I won't admit taht I enjoy being a SAHM more than I enjoyed my job pre-children, but I definately enjoy being a SAHM more than I enjoyed my stint at work once I had one child. I don't believe children need to be looked after by their parents - I'm another SAHM who has their kids in childcare (dd in pre-school 4 mornings, ds in nursery 1 day) which is both to give me abreak, and give them teh very important (IMO) social skills and ability to realte to other adult carers.

I agev up work not because it was the right thing for me, or because it was teh right thing for my children, but because it was the only way I felt we could function as a family and that my dh couls continue to give his (highly lucrative and extremely enjoyed) career the focus it needed. I am extremely envious of those people who manage to make choices that are tright for their family that don't involve full time SAHMdom. It's been said before though that I think far too many of us have to make the least worse choices for our circumstances rather tahn having the opportunity to mae teh best choices.