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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

To question the jail sentence for the mum who stabbed her 4 year old?

276 replies

Liketochat1 · 31/08/2012 13:56

There's such a sad story of a mum who stabbed her 4 year old daughter in the news at the moment.www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/9510938/Nurse-who-stabbed-her-four-year-old-to-death-gets-12-years.html.
She looks like such a broken woman. She not only killed her daughter but also tried to kill herself leaving herself with some brain damage and confined to a wheel chair with other physical disabilities. At the time of the attack she was depressed and facing charges for malpractice and had been left by her partner that day.
She has just been sentenced to 12 years in jail. Do you think she should be jailed? I can't help help but feel she's suffered so much already. Am I unreasonable?

OP posts:
NCForNow · 31/08/2012 21:41

I'm getting off now but just to reply...I have reported one comment which was imo rather nasty and unnecessary.

BlackberryIce · 31/08/2012 21:43

We can discuss this cos it's OVER! Tias case is in early stages!

expat I have just seen the Facebook pic. How courageous of you. And a fabulous way to spread the message. I have often wondered how I would 'know'. Thankyou

kissyfur · 31/08/2012 21:44

I really wish I hadn't clicked on this thread, the thought of that poor little girl suffering like that and at the hands of her own mother is just so upsetting. Now in floods of tears. 12 years is not long enough IMO Sad

Smellslikecatspee · 31/08/2012 21:48

The treatment for drinking anti freeze is an infusion of saline with normal alcohol?

Simply the anti freeze molecules are too big, and rip through the renal tissue fucking up the kidneys, giving regular alcohol binds with the anti freeze and makes it easier to pass, this is a very simplistic explanation but Im on the real stuff.

I'm not saying that anti- freeze doesn't have side effects, fucks your kidneys/liver and eyes but as a method of suicide , effective suicide, it's blah.

Please don't get me wrong, I when I was nursing assumed that anyone attempting suicide needed support.

Be it that they were narcissistic and had taken 2 more than the recommended dose in 8 hours, or that they were in a horrid situation and taken 2 more than the recommend dose in 8 so that they could get to a/e and seek help.

If I wasnt bound by confidentiality I could make you cry with what people have suffered to protect their children.

I can understand a person in a horrific situation killing their child before killing themselves, and statistically they will be female and they will feel that there is no escape for them and are not prepared to leave thier child to suffer the same abuses they did. But and this is the biggie they will do it in as gentle a wat as possible, as weird as that sounds.

Stabbing in not gently, not caring.

Smellslikecatspee · 31/08/2012 21:53

I apologise for my rubbish spelling above.

thebeesnees79 · 31/08/2012 21:54

expat sorry for your loss,, I don't know what else to say that's helpful as i doubt any written word is.
12 years is not long enough.

Moominsarescary · 31/08/2012 22:03

I trained as a mh nurse and while it's not unheard of for people with severe depression to kill themselves and their children it isn't usually in such a violent way as this. She has obviously had treatment and was deemed fit to stand trial.

Unless suffering from psychosis, which is a totally different thing, they are usually more of a risk to themselves than others.

It's awful to think what the poor child must have gone through, the poor family must be haunted by it.

NovackNGood · 31/08/2012 22:25

When was this? I've been on the guardian news home page all day and it never came up. But then neither did the story of the woman being found guilty of molesting the 14 year old boy today. Do they just not report anything that doesn't match their agenda.

expatinscotland · 31/08/2012 23:35

I agree with the sentence, for manslaughter with grounds of diminished responsiblity is all. The judge took her mental state into consideration and she was found sane.

I do not find this crucifying.

And I reserve my compassion, for those the world over who must watch their children die, and there is really, absolutely, NOTHING they can do. No getting back at a partner, they broke no laws, they may be equally as depressed.

That child took 2 or more hours to die, at the hands of one she most trusted and who knew how to otherwise despatch her quickly.

And tbh, 'There but for the grace . . .' no longer applies to all, and particularly not to me, who has suffered with mental illness.

Till you walk a mile in those shoes? I already have. I washed and dressed a dead child. The skin on her left heel peeled away, from pressure sores. It was all the funeral directors could do, to erase the skin discolouration from the chemo from her beautiful little face. And I slept with her, completely warped from lack of sleep. She was rigid when I woke. That was only 6 hours after she died. And this gal went and dressed her?

I reserve my compassion for those who, like us, in our warped mental states after 60 days with severe sleep deprivation, had no choice.

She was found sane and guilty.

Matesnotdates · 31/08/2012 23:43

I am so sorry, expat, what you describe is heartbreaking. I am just sorry.

OlympiaLMumsnet · 31/08/2012 23:45

Hi there
We are going to move this thread to our news topic
Thanks
MNHQ

MissPerception · 01/09/2012 07:57

Just Fabulous I really have no idea what you are talking about Confused I am certainly not posting as if I were you Shock

JustFabulous · 01/09/2012 08:09

No, I don't suppose you do MissP.
Oh, the irony of your username.

kittyandthegoldenfontanelles · 01/09/2012 08:41

"I read no money.

I thought it was a strange thing to say."

Upthread it says no money, not mummy.

JustFabulous · 01/09/2012 08:51

Yes, and I have read it on line as no money.

JustFabulous · 01/09/2012 08:52

Kitty, you contradict yourself.

Liketochat1 · 01/09/2012 08:55

Expat, I'm so, so sorry for your loss.

OP posts:
RabidAnchovy · 01/09/2012 09:38

Why is it when someone does something evil like this people try and justify it with "oh they must be mentally ill"?

No they are just evil!

ChazsBrilliantAttitude · 01/09/2012 10:13

expat
If I could reach through the screen and give you a real hug I would. I'm afraid the best I can do is a virtual one (((hugs))).

ChazsBrilliantAttitude · 01/09/2012 10:21

Rabid in this specific case the court has decided that she was suffering from an abnormal state of mind at the time, they are the ones that heard all the evidence not us. On the other hand Rose West and David Oakes (the man who shot Christine Chambers and their daughter in Essex) were not found to be suffering any mental illness / abnormality in their state of mind and are facing spending the rest of their lives in prison for murder.

Not everyone who does awful things is thought to be mentally ill.

MadameCastafiore · 01/09/2012 10:22

She would have had a full forensic psychological assessment to address her fitness to stand trial, obviously she was deemed accountable for her actions.

ChazsBrilliantAttitude · 01/09/2012 10:34

Madame
Agreed, she was accountable but she was also found to be suffering from an abnormality of mental functioning at the time she committed the crime hence the diminished responsibility defence.

So I suppose it could be seen as a temporary aberration by an otherwise sane person.

As I said up thread, her sentence seems to me to be at the high end of a Manslaughter with diminished responsibility case and not far off a possible murder sentence so it appears that the court did find a high degree of culpability in her actions despite any abnormality of mental functioning.

kittyandthegoldenfontanelles · 01/09/2012 11:35

Justfabulous- I'm sorry, I don't understand! Where do I contradict myself?

LadyClariceCannockMonty · 01/09/2012 12:23

'The idea that some people are just "evil" is deep-rooted and longstanding, and not easy to shake.'

Agree completely with this. Thanks hackmum.

I'd just be repeating myself if I tried to explain my thoughts again, so I'm hiding this thread now.

MissPerception · 01/09/2012 12:47

JustFabulous - ditto re your name Wink. I've just received an email from a friend asking what you are referring to and I had to say I have absolutely no idea.