Church of england schools - proposal to admit more non-cofE children.......

[Icoulddoitbetter]

here

I'm not religious, and my child is not yet of school age so it's not something I've needed to think about for mysef.

But, I know a family where the parents are athiests who attend their local church weekly, read lessons, had their daughters christened and wear crosses around thier necks, just to get their children into the local church school, and this I have a very big problem with. I have no problem with children being brought up in a faith but not when the parents teaching that belief themselves have no belief in it whatsoever, it jsut seems wrong!

So if this new proposal stops the need for such behaviour then great (and the very mean part of me is secretly hoping the children above above get bumped off the list to make room for the non-cofe children in the community, whochaven't faked Christianity for two years, sorry.....!)

at ivykaty

Christian faith schools aren't that segregationist. There are reports that Islamic schools are more segregationist.

"in despair"?

not got much to worry about have we?

Exactly, that false assumption is so often made in these debates - choice is very limited for thousands of families and atheists often have to tolerate religious schools because there is no other option.

Religious schools perpetuate ignorance and intolerance between religions by their very existence and if parents insist on segregating their children they should pay to do it.

If this new measure ends faith schools then bring it on but I doubt it will.

I don't think CE schools perpetuate ignorance and tolerance weird thing to say.

Some might, some very very strict Catholic ones or the Islamic ones but most CE schools are as bland as semolina.

Oh really is blue bobble hats more segregationist than yellow bobble hats - wow I really shouldn't be worrying about red bobble hats then should I

"between religions" was what I said, not just generally and of course they do - otherwise why not allow your children to mix with others of different faiths and none?

If they're that bland take out the religious content altogether then.

I think it's a bit childish to maintain the hats metaphor to the way children are taught in schools.

There are differences to the way different schools practise the "faith" part of the curriculum and extra-curriculum.

Perhaps you think all Catholic, Christian and Islamic schools practise in the same way?

If you feel the need to reduce it to worshipping hats you probably haven't thought about it as much as you think you have.

It's the green bobble hats you really need to worry about ivy .

what so yellow bobble hats, red bobble hats and blue bobble hats could all go to school together and find the schools themselves and leave bare heads to go to school and not have any bobble hat praying?

I don't mind if the religious content is taken out, I'm just pointing out that standards will probably drop or maybe even out across primary schools.

Don't forget that in some areas, all the local schools are C of E. Where we are, our nearest three/four are all C of E and there's only one that isn't.

I'm atheist and I hate the religion side of it (not the religious ed) but the whole 'God is real no question' type nonsense. The kids do what they have to do (DD changes prayer words so she doesn't have to feel uneasy) and DS has decided that although he believes Jesus was real, God certainly cannot be. Nearly 100% of the wall displays are religious and it's all in your face.

I agree (as I've said many a time on many a thread) that schools shouldn't be any faith - religious ed should be taught as a subject and that's it. There shouldn't be a daily worship and it shouldn't be implied that any of it is fact - as it is in DCs school.

I'm a Christian but find the brand at the local village school (Church) isn't it at all; very full on creationist approach. In order to send them elsewhere I would have to gain approval for an out of catchment application from the LEA (we don't even get a list here to tick off preferences to apply- it's just done on thisis-your-school basis) and face an almight trek. As it happens I plan to do that for ds4 as school also rubbish with SEN but resent it.

If someone can show me whrere Jesus said 'suffer the middle class children whose parents are pushy, not working Sunday shifts or their finances are flexible enough to allow a move into tiny catchments to come unto me whilst tehir less fortunate brethren go to a school abandoned by anyone with the ability to get away' then I would be happy with the current system. He didn't, and the Jesus I believe in taught tolerance and acceptance- Samaritans in his day, all faiths in mine- not creating MC monocultures on the rpemise of what is ofetn falsely claimed faith.

I have no issue whatsoever with Church schools when there is already a secular school serving an area (although I agree about admititng a wider section of people, either that or mixing more with other more representative schools) but do not appreciate the choice of faith-or-nowt existent in so many rural areas.

Ivy, you seem to think your bobble hat metaphor is sufficient to the purpose.

Allow me to disabuse you of your misconception.

Where we lived before the nearest state secondary was a Jesuit one. I don't need to be an atheist to feel a bit reluctant to send DS there. I don't see why it should be funded by the taxpayer either.

I think it is all childish, telling me my child doesn't pray to something so although I pay for the service I can't use it as my dc and myself don't go to their church. How childish is that? You don't play with us so you can't come in for tea

Wow -- it's really worth talking to you isn't it?

Not.

well you seemed to want? Have you got something interesting to say that make sense?

Oh it's true that schools differ how they teach.

At our school chidlren as young as year R face an exam upon which faith funding is based (won't go into more detail as outed me in past on here). They chose ds2 to represent his year - sensibly with religion grad Mum I guess but he wants to learn about all religions, theya re enthusiastic about exploring different definitions of God and faith systems. Instead they are taught Christianity, and a term of Judaism (AKA the OT). That's a crying shame imo and I don't understand it at all, knowing something doesn't make you all want to convert after all- if it did none of my lot would have survived uni, our heads would have exploded jumping somewhere between Hinduism and Jainism

I did want to, I thought it was interesting but you helped me change my mind.

If you think what I've said doesn't make sense, then somebody's sense is at fault. It's definitely not mine.

well you tell me standards will probably fall if you take religion out of schooling - how does that make sense? anything to back up your statement that standards would probably fall?

As some have already said, I hate this assumption that there is a choice - certainly isn't in our rural area. And yes, while I'm in no way anti-Christian, it didn't feel great seeing my 5 year old intoning that she "wasn't worthy of Christ's sacrifice" and referring to herself as "a sinner like me" at the EAster service. It is, however my village school and I have no realistic choice. They're completely outdated. If people want to educate their children to a faith they should pay for it.

Standards won't drop as most church schools are in middle class areas anyway.

The fact that faith schools generally perform better at the moment?

The religion just acts as a selective medium. Faith schools are able to choose parents with the greatest foresight, drive, attention to detail, ambition and, yes, possibly hypocrisy.

It's not the religion that does it. It's the selection.