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Home ed

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Original poster

why aren't more people open-minded about HE?

144 replies

BeNimble · 26/02/2009 07:02

why can't they be?

OP posts:
sarah293 · 27/02/2009 19:27

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piscesmoon · 27/02/2009 19:30

'but for some reason they were secretive. The Mum was a key part of the home ed organisation, but again was never forthcoming about what she did with them, which was a great shame.'

I think that it is a great shame and a missed opportunity. If HEers would only be friendly and open I don't think they would have a problem. If the LEA could go in and check that they were being educated, then they would become just another educational option. It won't happen while they are a secretive community.

lou031205 · 27/02/2009 19:37

juuule - I was sharing my experiences of the families I knew who had home educated. I was acknowledging whilst doing so, that the observations I made were unlikely to be solely because of home education, and that I was aware that individual families will differ in their ways.

With regard to the family who were 'samey', I could write an essay detailing what was 'odd' about it, but it would be a bit boring. I just observed that they didn't seem to have developed independence of thought, and all behaved the same way. Given their natural personalities, I don't think this would have been the case if they had been exposed to a wider variety of peers in different classes.

I don't think that a child who is asked by an interested adult what they have been learning should 'fob them off'. It was a genuine question and the reply was not one of humour, but parrot fashion.

Yes, we commented on exclusivity, and we also encouraged the group to allow others to sit alongside them, and split them up slightly at times also.

I was not trying to prove anything about rich and varied educations. I saw children who had been allowed or encouraged to look down their nose at others, and form exclusive relationships with others 'in the gang'. Again, not a phenomenon exclusive to home ed, and I did qualify that in my previous post.

In my experience, all the home edding families wanted to protect their children from the school experience, to shelter them from the 'world'. The world is the world. It isn't going to change because you separate yourself from it.

Just an observation. No vested interest. I would love to meet a home educated child that is motivated, keen and willing to share their life experiences. Just as I love to spend time with school educated children who are motivated, keen and willing to share their life experiences.

ForeverOptimistic · 27/02/2009 19:40

If I had the resources I would home educate. I am envious of people who do home educate thier children. I agree that lots of people are sceptical about it but then lots of people are sceptical about lots of things.

lou031205 · 27/02/2009 19:41

Riven, with respect, I think that I made it clear that my experiences were with 5 families, and I limited my observations to those 5 families, and I didn't go on to make generalisations. I said 'some' children. I am sure that I haven't met the children who do really well out of home ed. I would love to. I love children who think independently, and who have their own opinions.

juuule · 27/02/2009 19:41

riven exactly.

piscesmoon "It won't happen while they are a secretive community."

From my earlier post.
"And it isn't that home-educating parents are secretive, a lot of times people ask questions but don't listen to the replies. So unless you think that someone is genuinely interested it's often better to just give the short answer and a smile."

Which of course could be construed as being secretive by someone looking for that in someone they consider as being different.

Having schooled children and HE children, am I part of the 'secretive' community or the 'normal' community?

TheFallenMadonna · 27/02/2009 19:45

I would rather like to HE my children, and I'm pretty confident that I'd be able to do it effectively. My children do love school though, and for them, rather than me, I think a good school where they learn to love learning alongside their peers is the optimum. I have to get my fix teaching other people's children instead

sarah293 · 27/02/2009 19:46

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seeker · 27/02/2009 20:26

I think that home education is a valid choice - and so is school education. I think people should be able to make that choice - and I think it's brilliant that they can. I do have an issue with some of the reasons some home educators have for doing it - but I also don't approve of religious schools. As piscesmoon has said, here and on other threads on the subject, I don;t understand why home educators aren't "out and proud". I think a lot of the concerns people have about home education would vanish in a heartbeat if some HErs didn't pull up the drawbridge and want prove themselves to be oh so out there and alternative. And if the same people didn't treat people whose children are at school as semi detached at least and abusive at worst.

nickschick · 27/02/2009 20:32

Riven thats exactly my thoughts about H.E kids being in the real world and thats something I point out to people who 'dis' H.E the people that ds3 meets arent employed by a school, they arent child orientated yet ds3 has learnt that different people need different approaches and its made him a very menable child - hes not continually teasing and moaning like some of his friends-hes very popular and is always welcome to play at his friends houses hes not a 'needy' child and it seems his friends like to be here too the other day he and his pal were writing out dr who stories and his friends mum was shocked as she cant get her son to do any writing but here he seems to like to learn .....another surprising thing that id not thought of is that one of ds3s friends has autistic tendencies and ds3 is very sympathetic to his needs helping him do things(lego models) showing him things many times to help him cope indeed I was most touched when at his friends house his friend took his toy from him and began stroking it the boys mum told him to give it back straight away - ds3 told her that his friend liked to touch things a lot thats how he learnt about new stuff .......his mum ws so pleased that a friend 'understood' her son and his needs so well - she cried as she told me.

seeker · 27/02/2009 20:40

Were any of the home edders on here home educated themselves?

piscesmoon · 27/02/2009 20:41

To my mind HE is a very valid educational choice. Some people would only go private, some want selective schools, some want same sex schools, some want church schools, some want HE etc. All are quite open, happy to talk about what they do and confident about their choices except HE.
If the general public is a,to realise that you can HE by law and b,see it as a viable alternative-HE needs to come out of the closet and be friendly and open and tell people what they do! They can't have it both ways and say it is the best thing for DCs but we won't let you question our DCs or ask us what we do!
I also don't see why HEers are so scared of authority-be confident and tell them what you are doing and why.

piscesmoon · 27/02/2009 20:44

Unless I have got it wrong, my memory is not too good, Seeker was Home Educated and yet people won't pay much attention to her because she doesn't always say what they want to hear!

nickschick · 27/02/2009 20:46

I also don't see why HEers are so scared of authority-be confident and tell them what you are doing and why

Im not scared of them!!!

They came to my house quite a few times and foned me up it was the last visit I had when 2 women came stayed nearly 3 hours and interrogated my kids that I inda thought ermmmm no - im not doing this and thanks to Julie Noshoes .....I learnt to say no i dont want a visit i will send in a report .

piscesmoon · 27/02/2009 20:51

Exactly nickschick-defensive and secretive!

juuule · 27/02/2009 21:39

"people won't pay much attention to her because she doesn't always say what they want to hear!"

So that's much the same as some people who send their children to school, then.

The difference being that the views of the school-ed children's parents are supported by the state (so they can more easily feel they are 'doing the right thing') whereas home-ed children's parents seem to be pretty much ignored/opposed by the state (which possibly makes some feel as though they are on a back foot).

nickschick · 27/02/2009 22:10

By piscesmoon on Fri 27-Feb-09 20:51:24
Exactly nickschick-defensive and secretive!

well when i read the report theyd written and theyd commented on the books on my bookshelf and the ornments in my home ( positive comments tho) i did wonder exactly what they were judging.......im very open and hospitable but 3 hours of interogation and looing through a years worth of work etc etc and asking me quite 'deep' questions I thought hang on a minute - ive been doing this for 3 years already plus time before - never had ny reccomendations never had any negatives this seemed v 'probing' - im not financially supported in my h.e I dont have to explain myself - why would i???

piscesmoon · 27/02/2009 22:20

I think that HEers just have to accept that you can't have it both ways! If you want people to be open minded you have to be open about what you are doing. While you are telling the LEA and other that your education is private and you won't discuss it, share, take or ask advice, or let them speak to your DCs, then I don't think you can expect people to be open minded! Open minded about what?-we have no idea.
I can go into school at any time and I can question the teacher or the Head. I work as a partnership and as long as I am friendly, open and realistic I can generally get what I want!
I just think you need to make up your mind-
a, be open and become a recognisable alternative
b, keep being defensive and secretive but then don't bleat that people are not open minded.

gagarin · 27/02/2009 22:20

You sound like a teacher after an Ofsted inspection !

gagarin · 27/02/2009 22:23

Just a thought - given this "let's sue for anything" culture.

If a dc grew up and reflected negatively upon his/her HE experience could they sue the education dept for not spotting educationally limited opportunities or choices?

Like dcs have sued schools?

piscesmoon · 27/02/2009 22:27

I would agree nickschick that the LEA should send around people who are sympathetic to HE! It seems common sense to me. My SIL has always had visit from people who have been very sympathetic-the last one even said that he would have like to have done it with his DCs. I still think it boils down to openness, if HEers were proud of their achievements and let them in, it would become recognised as a valid alternative and LEAs would be far more likely to take a different stance. Education is full of people who don't like what the government have done to education-I'm sure that it would be easy to find people who were not obsessed with curriculum and testing.They are more likely to do it if HE becomes more of an alternative and it won't happen while shrouded in secrecy IMO.

nickschick · 27/02/2009 22:32

I think that HEers just have to accept that you can't have it both ways! If you want people to be open minded you have to be open about what you are doing. While you are telling the LEA and other that your education is private and you won't discuss it, share, take or ask advice, or let them speak to your DCs, then I don't think you can expect people to be open minded! Open minded about what?-we have no idea.
I can go into school at any time and I can question the teacher or the Head. I work as a partnership and as long as I am friendly, open and realistic I can generally get what I want!
I just think you need to make up your mind-
a, be open and become a recognisable alternative
b, keep being defensive and secretive but then don't bleat that people are not open minded.

At risk of you thinking I'm bleating - I dont mind home visits ,I'm willing to discuss work that dc have done and ways to extend it,I'm willing to send work that dc have done for 'officialdom' etc etc - what I am not willing to do is to welcome people into my home without prior arrangement that 2 inspectors would be there and to expect a 3 hour long 'meeting' I'm not willing to have people look at the books on my shelves and pass comment nor do I like my home decor mentiuoned in reports however positive the comments.

I dont think for a minute that that is acceptable.

What wasnt made clear at the time was that the 2 visitors one of them was being assesed and the over the previous 3 years I'd never seen the same inspector twice.

At any time I welcome questions about that days 'work' and I keep detailed records,that I submit yearly to the L.A.

ShrinkingViolet · 27/02/2009 22:41

OFSTED can't inspect home educators, because that's not what they are there for. OFSTED have a duty to report on the education being provided in schools by the state on behalf of the parents. So those parents who have chosen to exercise their legal educational duty themselves, have no need to be inspected on behalf of themselves. Who would OFSTED report to? The Local Authority? Part of whose job is to arrange for education on behalf of those parents who choose not to provide it themselves (for many good reasons, I hasten to add)?

piscesmoon · 27/02/2009 22:43

I would agree that your visit was unacceptable nickschick. I think that your alternative is fine, but I wonder how many HEers keep detailed records about the days 'work' and are willing to send them in-not many-judging from posts on here.
I find in life that if you are friendly people are friendly back -if you are defensive people are defensive back. (there are always exceptions to any rule).

piscesmoon · 27/02/2009 22:45

I should say that schools have the same- some Ofsted inspectors are lovely and some are a nightmare!