Mozhe IS NOT going back to work next week after all......

[mozhe]

.....no, have decided to delay it by a week or so......Mr Mozhe is on 'incubator watching' duties....P-in-L's are manning the home front,( and DSsX3...), with nice new aupair....and Mozhe,Nanny and DTs are off to St Barts,( in lovely Carribean...),for a week's sun/swim/chill out !!
Any one been before ? Any pointers ? Off first thing tomorrow......

The assumptions being made about Mozhe and her family are bizarre, how on earth do you know that the DSs dont actually love being with the GPs?

You dont. None of us do.

I think after 2 years is much more acceptable. However this is 2 weeks old!!!

mumylyn said"I find it very strange that a mum who dosent seem to have the normal maternal bond to her little newborn would even think of having six children."

so its not irrelevent - in fact its a perfectly reasonable answer from jeremyvile

Walnut - what about that statement is simplistic or irrelevent?

Ta Custy

by AugustusRookWhooosh on Mon 16-Jul-07 18:27:00
He is too young and under-developed to miss his Mother.

nah, bollocks. new born babies know their mothers, they know how their mothers smell and the sound of their voice, they have been with them for nine months ffs, they become distrssed when separated from them.
the first six weeks of a baby's life is fkg crucial for brain and emotional development.
if they baby is not bonding with his mother, then who is he bodning with.
I must say that the phrase "incubator watching duties" is quite the most saddening thing I have heard in a very long while.

"I must say that the phrase "incubator watching duties" is quite the most saddening thing I have heard in a very long while."

Really?

And the level of emotional incontinence is rising and rising - someone get a mop and bucket, quick! The trouble with the emotionally incontinent is they can't bear anyone else to think or behave in any way differently to how they themselves behave. So the perfectly valid position of leaving one's newborn in the hands of experts (and his father) is either wanton cruelty (why exactly?) or - the classic mundane argument - signs that something is Wrong with the OP - she's not Normal? You know, there's not actually anything wrong with being different from the herd. And certainly nothing wrong with exercising a little self-restraint despite people coming up all gloopy eyed and clammy handed to insist that you're in 'denial of your feelings' or some other such crap.

Oh, and fair play to the posters who state that they did more than once want to walk away from their newborns: feeling like that doesn;t make you mad or be either. This bonding stuff has no basis in biochemistry, it's socially constructed: people used to have hordes of children in the full expectation that only about half of them would survive and even now, in developing countries, existing children get prioritised over sickly newborns.

yes. why not?
a premature baby is still a baby, a person.
it doesn't just need "watching", it is not a fucking cake that might burn.

I wish I could walk away from my shit job.

Right now, in fact.

Life's a trade off - for some more than others.

Horses for courses, let them all get on with it.

For those of you who think this is a perfectly reasonable thing to do, would you think the same if the Mozhe was a teenage single mum and had buggered of with her mates to Ibiza for a week leaving her mum holding the fort? I think not.

I found 'incubator watching duties' to be very strange.

Offensive if OP is a troll and worrying if OP is for real.

Umm there is a baby in there you know.

Twofalls: if the hypothetical teenage mum left her baby in the safe hands of its own grandmother, I fail to see what would be the problem with her having a holiday? Is it just that mundanes get uneasy at any suggestion that mothers are human beings rather than baby-servicing mechanisms?

madamez, with respect that's bollocks too.
there is plenty of historical evidence to suggest that even when rates of infant mortality are/were high, the sense of loss was/is very real.
actually there is biochemical evidence about bonding and attachment, but even if there wasn't, why should something only be real if it is "chemical"
"social constructs" are very real. like love, like all human relationships.

i'm loving your definition of emotional incontinence, will file it and use it to the full...thanks madamez.

JV - Apologies if I have misunderstood and read your post out of context (it is a hard thread to follow while watching, erm, BB ).

I thought you were simplifying a decision to leave a young baby with a 'fuck it, it'll all work out eventually'* attitude. My mistake evidently.

*god there must be a word for this, it's too late...

And madamez, ignoring all your vitriolic claptrap about the "emotionally incontitent" amongst us, yes many people do want to walk away from their babies at some point or other. The point is most don't. And if they did, they probably wouldn't post on an internet chat room in such a flippant manner.

madamez, what about the baby?
do you think the baby will notice that his mother is not there?
oh no, don't worry, someone will be watching the incubator

Oh madamez, I can't let that pass, it just isn't true.

having said that agree re bonding HC.

fact is we don't actually know what is going on in mozhe's head do we....she just gave birth, so is not in the most rational place in the world ever.

might be in shock.

Harpsi: social constructs of behaviour may well feel real to most peole at the time they are popular, but enough propaganda will change them fast enough.
The thing is with all this bullshit about bonding, if a mother is ill or badly injured or soemthing when she has a newborn, and has to spend weeks in hospital undergoing medical treatment on her own account or, for instance, has to leave her sick newborn to sit at the bedside of her sick older child or something, everyone will be falling over themselves to assure this hypothetical mother that it doesn't matter, that the care she gives her newborn as the baby grows up is what matters.
It's only if a woman wants to leave her newborn to (gasp, shriek, puke) enjoy herself that the outrage kicks in.

And as for "mothers are human beings rather than baby-servicing mechanisms" - I don't think wanting to be with your newborn baby is classified as a "baby-servicing mechanism" tbh.

Well not in my book anyway. Honestly, I do wonder why some people have them ffs.

Fair point, madamez.

they might fall over themselves to reassure.

but it won't take her much reading to discover that it has big consequences....consequences that can be somewhat mitigated if those effects are recognised and taken seriously.

but there are big effects.

no reason for vitriol imo tho.

'It's only if a woman wants to leave her newborn to (gasp, shriek, puke) enjoy herself that the outrage kicks in.'

have to agree massively with this statement.

and it what i dislike intensely about this thread.

it's not actually the fact that she isn't there, it's how and why she isn't there....

and evidently fathers count for absolutely jack shit.