Southampton publishes Clearing grade requirements

[HPFA]

I think this is the first time I've seen an RG Uni publishing Clearing grade requirements before Results Day.

It's not for all courses but a lot of popular subjects nonetheless

https://www.southampton.ac.uk/clearing/course-vacancies?subject=All+Subjects&filter=&studentType=uk&availableOnly=true

Not sure what it means for those students holding offers at Southampton - does it indicate how far they can drop grades and still get in?

p.s. UCAS only asks for applicants' NI Number (as optional) to help Student Finance link an application with a student loan or grant application.

International students won't have NIN's unless they apply for one in order to work in the UK.

I agree with this. Broad degrees where students gain deep understanding and analytical skills generally hold their value.

This is one reason why, historically, good from solid programmes degrees in Humanities, MFL and Liberal Arts have held their value. It is also one of the reasons Maths degrees are valued by a broad swathe of employers.

Within the field of CS @pumpkinjooce generally reflects the consensus.

I am only just catching up with this thread - it’s been really interesting (and am making notes for next year!).

There have been lots of comments about CCD students being cautious about going to usually-much-higher-tariff courses and how it may not end well, and it reminded me of someone I used to know, who got a 2 E’s offer from an Oxford College (can’t remember which one, sorry..) in the very late 80’s… Apparently they got DDE at A levels, so toddled off to Oxford for 3 years and have done very well for themselves! Sometimes A level results don’t always reflect what a person is capable of..

Stoufer I agree that the A level results aren't always an accurate predictor of degree performance. I didn't get great results in my A levels (huge understatement) in the 80s partly because I absolutely hated Chemistry and Maths but in those days you did either sciences or arts at my college, with very little mixing of the two. But I enjoyed Biology, did a biology based degree and absolutely flew, ending up with a PhD.

But I think we need to be a bit cautious about assuming that the clearing results this year will be relevant to UCAS applications next year. As I said above, the course that my DD is starting at Lancaster in September isn't listed on the uni website for 2026. It appears to have been axed along with a lot of language options.

Personally I think there could be a lot of changes at various unis in the next year probably due to the higher tariff ones scooping up so many students this year.

@Sweetpeasaremadeforbees Thanks - yes, it will be really interesting to see what happens next year - also as it is one of the last ‘bulge’ years in terms of cohort (i think birth rates etc dropped a bit after 2007-2008)..
i took lots of screenshots of the courses we are interested in for next year, and at least it has served to make dc2 feel a bit less anxious about mocks / predicted grades this Autumn (they are always able to focus better if they are feeling less anxious, more relaxed). There seemed to be some really good courses in clearing this time around, and quite a few were saying that they would guarantee accommodation if you fixed it up before a certain day / time (which is always the big worry about going through clearing - having to sort accommodation in a mad panic!)..

Your right I don't know about computer science. I was going by the experience of my Computer science grad dbro ( who admittedly graduated 20 years ago) who had had to train an entire workforce in India to do his job before his whole department was made redundant. Possibly he is a bit too old now.

Yes someone c from my school for this too in n the early 90s. It was based on his interview IIRC. Annoying because he was an absolute wastrel in class! Don't know what became of him!

The EE offer in the 80s was pretty standard for Oxford etc if you’d sat the exam. (Dh had one) or you had to do an extra term at school. I remember the ones who’d left sixth form and then came back were wafting around in their own clothes while the rest of us were in uniform.

Students with CCD can sometimes do just as well, or even better, than those with A* grades once they enter university. Academic grades alone don’t determine success at university; there are many other factors, such as motivation, resilience, and adaptability. I’ve seen students miss grade boundaries by the narrowest of margins. For example, one student may secure 59% and receive a B, while another with 58.5% is classified as a C. Such rigid boundaries can feel arbitrary and don’t always reflect a student’s true potential or ability.

@UnbiasedOpinion Thers is a lot of data that shows the students who earn more have gone to the best universities though. The CCD candidate would struggle to get into one even now. They would need to trade up after first degree. Of course some dc outperform their A levels but the lower grades do stop dc accessing the most sought after courses at the best universities. Ifs research doesn’t support your view.

I agree with some of the earlier posts that popular courses understandably require higher entry levels. However, this year’s A-level cohort was smaller, and we are already seeing a paradigm shift in entry requirements due to several factors, for example, a reduction in international student numbers (which frees up places for domestic students), and concerns about the quality of certain courses.
In my opinion, entry requirements are likely to decrease over the coming years. Universities are facing a crisis, both financially and in terms of the perceived value of a degree compared to apprenticeships. I don’t think the current high entry thresholds are sustainable, and they will likely fall to more achievable levels in the near future

Hello all

Really interested to read this thread and have been taking notes as we have two years of this coming up. Thanks to everyone for all the contributions.

I think it's really natural for any potential student to aim as high as they can and if a higher tier (right term?) uni is going to take them, why not? Especially if there is going to be a trend towards lower grade offers (for all the reasons mentioned above). Aspiration and high achievement is a very common driver and given the importance school, peers and employers, attach to uni reputation, I think it's totally understandable. Some posters hint that potential students should know their level and stick to it. Part of me totally agrees that you want the best-fit course, but they also make me wince as echos of what you used to hear about class or women or immigrants in the UK.

Following on from this. How does it work out for students who maybe do a Foundation course at Leeds (offer CCC/CCD) and then join a degree course that is currently offering AAA / AAB? Do you think the Foundation really helps them bridge the gap, or are the Uni broadening the academic content on the degree course?

@GrumpyMuleFan I know three young people who did foundation years - both were very capable but missed a lot of school due to mental health issues or, in one case, because the family relocated at a critical point in the YP's education. Thr foundation year helped them to bridge a confidence gap and decide whether university was for them. Foundation year students are only allowed to progress to the full degree if they reach the required level in their foundation year.

Thank you @pumpkinjooce that is really good to hear. Thinking about it, it def gives the university a very good look at the students to be able to judge how they will find the full course.

@GrumpyMuleFan

There's a research report here on Foundation Years which is quite interesting.

https://www.hepi.ac.uk/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/HEPI-Report-170_Cracks-in-our-foundations_final.pdf

I don't think there's anything wrong with students targeting their preferred uni in Clearing. If you like the look of History at Southampton and you have CCC why not go? If you're not bothered by the fact most students will have higher grades than you might well be fine.

Maths I think is a bit trickier - if you're one of a few students with a B where almost everyone else has an A or an A* then it's a lot easier to see how this could be difficult.

Personally my gripe about the Russell Group is that it's a self-selecting closed shop that has ended up being presented to schools and parents as if it was some kind of "elite" and intrinsically better. And it's pretty clear that there are really no grounds for eg Southampton to be seen as any more elite than the likes of Swansea, Leicester, Reading, Sussex, Aber, Brookes etc.

I would much prefer the genuinely elite unis in the Russell Group split off to form a new group.

@HPFA I think the "Russell Group" tag is widely understood to be meaningless these days (certainly on Mumsnet anyway) - what is much more meaningful are the league tables for individual courses. Any school worth its salt will tell students to look at those rather than the rankings for the uni as a whole.

For my son's chosen subject (Civil Engineering), Southampton is very highly ranked. But it is not a fashionable subject or a fashionable city, so they are more likely to have clearing places than, say, Bristol. Bristol has other ways of filling its course - they were offering Civil Engineering places to rejected Mech Eng applicants knowing that, for some, the city is the attraction rather than the course.

I'm pro them. Where I worked, they did some of the year one content but more skills based, so research methodology, and some essay based subjects but in small groups and also with study skills classes. By the time they graduated from the full degree there was no difference in performance from those who had gone straight into year one (we did a lot of data tracking). It depends on the structure of the foundation year. It basically taught them to self study more effectively and have more skills in their back pocket.

@HPFA thank you got the link. The Executive Summary states that 51% of Foundation courses are taken in Business Management. 👀 My DS is interested in this at Leeds, with a view to studying one of their Finance/management/accounting degrees.

I think that’s the nub of the matter for many: confidence and self belief. Maths, as you say, is very different. Also for any subject which you must have studied before.

@murasaki that is also v good to hear. I do love a bit of data tracking - nothing beats it. 🙏🏽

So in those cases ideally it would have small group stats and data analysis classes to build confidence.

@murasaki thank you - will def add this to list of questions for Open Day.

Sorry, message went twice. 😬

Yep, you want a clear view of what the year looks like, what you need to progress to year one etc. Don't be surprised if it is taught by sessional staff rather than departmental lecturers, but they are very good, or at least ours are, and often specialists wheres a lecturer can get dumped with any module, at least at 1st year level, so don't get put off by that if it's the case, and they probably won't say anyway.....

One thing to bear in mind, is that it will be four years of finance so I don't think there's any wiggle room for needing to retake a year at any point, but I may be wrong on that so worth checking.

@murasaki thank you so much for all this good advice. 😀