State school kids at Edinburgh university- how bad is it for them?

[StartingAgainFGS]

I keep hearing reports of state school kids not fitting in at Edinburgh uni (at best) and at worst some real bullying going on. Heard it described on here as "pony club bullying". We are very far away from the private school demographic and I wonder how my DD would cope. We would be scraping by to send her there in the first place and I would not like her to feel so out of place that she's uncomfortable/unhappy.
Are these reports exaggerated? Does anyone have a state school DC there?
Thanks!

I assume they do a freshers event with all the clubs pitching for members, I went to a few (mostly for the free wine), and although I didn't stick with most, I met people there who were also 'no' and we became friends. It's worth having a wander round with people from her accommodation to see what's out there. I'm sure she'll be fine and have a great time

My DD went in 2020 (STEM degree) from a glasgow state school. Didn’t find it an issue, as many others have said, join the clubs she’s interested in and she’ll find her tribe there. Good luck.
ps my dd loved Edinburgh so much she’s stayed there for work!

My DD goes to Durham which has a private school reputation. My DD (who did go to private school) says there’s an active anti independent backlash. She tries to avoid discussing where she went.

I thought the training for staff was to help them address the mocking by other students, not that staff were doing the mocking.

🙄

My (local, mild) accent and pronunciation was mocked by staff at UofE on more than one occasion. Examples include:

'I'm sorry say that again in English.'

Repeating things back to me in a mocking tone and laughing.

'honestly you people have the strangest diction'

'we might need subtitles for that'

'say it again' looks at class and laughs.

Funnily enough intelligence doesn't come with an accent, mocking how someone speaks might seem like a joke but it subtly tells them they don't belong and reinforces the classism and elitism that is rife at Edinburgh. In the past 'queen's' English has been used to gatekeep opportunities, painting regional accents as inferior or less educated.

I actually don't think we're talking about a state Vs private school problem but the sub-set of people with elitist attitudes, who subtly dominate and bully using wealth and power to do so.

Here's the latest from one day ago on Reddit

https://www.reddit.com/r/Scotland/s/4zSSWK9imS

It's funny how things change...I consider my dc to be quite sheltered, and where we live, their school and our town are considered "posh" so they can be a bit of a target in neighbouring areas. When I was their age you definitely had to change your accent and demeanor to appear less "posh" so you didn't get targeted.

@EveryonesTalkingRubbish I totally agree and Edinburgh easily has a majority of state educated students. So why anyone worries about a minority is beyond me. Live your life and let others live theirs. The majority will always find friends. However most people rub along and dividing into tribes is rather foolish.

You can’t stereotype people along state/private school lines, it’s way more complex than that. My dd went to a failing primary in a deprived area, then a top independent (on a bursary!), then grammar school for sixth form. What camp does she belong in? We’re not rolling in it and she has to work in term time. (She doesn’t go to Edinburgh, I’m just making a point about how you categorise people!).

@StartingAgainFGS So were you a target at university? We live in quite an expensive area but no one in cheaper houses cares. Never been an issue. I actually think you might be a bit too sheltered. People really can be quite similar at a variety of schools. The best advice is to believe in yourself. Plenty of dc will be similar.

University was fine for me, but it certainly wasn't a place like Edinburgh!
I was aware of people with more money, but it didn't cause any issues. But it wasn't a place that would have been considered prestigious in the same way as Edinburgh.
I know she'll likely be fine, and if she's not we can help her through it. She could be equally happy/unhappy at other places. I just want to help her make the best decision!

There is no doubt though, that despite individual/anecdotal experiences, there is a problem at Edinburgh that is needing to be addressed.

I’ve been thinking about this OP, I think Edinburgh is already very committed to addressing this problem – hence the accent sessions with lecturers etc. I don’t hear similar stories of universities addressing the problem at other places that are known to have a percentage of “posh“ students – eg Durham, Bristol, Exeter, Newcastle and increasingly from everything I hear Leeds. Honestly, I think your DD will be fine, it’s clearly only personal experience but from my DC’s time there and that of friends’ dcs there’s never been an issue

Thank you @Umbilicat !
I was actually pondering that earlier....maybe its a good thing that she goes somewhere it's acknowledged and is starting to be addressed!

It’s interesting reading over the comments. What I always notice is that there is a definite sort of posh/rah/privileged group that can be bullies/intimidate/mock/look down on people who aren’t in their group and don’t wear the right clothes/have the right accent/go to the right school/ski in the right places etc. They are always privately educated.

No one is saying all privately educated people are like this. No one is saying all state educated people are bullied. But I’ve never met anyone from a state school (and neither have my kids) that would write off a person that went to private school because of that. But we’ve all met a fair number of people that went to private school that write off people that went to state school because of that.

My state educated DC have wide circles of friends at uni and I’d say probably the split is 50:50 state/private educated. The commonality is that none are wankers.

I wonder if it’s more pronounced at Edinburgh as less dc in Scotland privately educated and free tuition means they are bunched at a few Scottish universities. Human nature to stick together at first so they are identifiable tribes. My dc is at Glasgow and the x school lot are a recognised tribe whereas I don’t think she’d know which school others went to. They seem to talk about school a lot and socialise together. I asked my dc and there’s been no bullying or awkwardness (my dc is state school) her only observations were that they were noticeably more druggy (lots of disposable cash) and shit at washing up/cleaning kitchen up (boarding school?)
I certainly wouldn’t let it put your dc off and agree the fact it’s openly being addressed is a positive.

No it was staff too hence the training.

@StartingAgainFGS My DD is in her first year at Edinburgh and loving it. She was state-educated at a bog standard English comprehensive. Although she is on a STEM course three of her closest friends are at the art school - one Scottish, two English, none privately educated so far as she knows - and are happy there. I agree with previous suggestions to avoid the more expensive halls. The cheaper, shared bathroom accommodation is likely to attract a wider mix of students.

@RestitutionGranted I would say totally the opposite happens very readily. Time and time again state school educated only want to
mix with similar dc. They look down on better off students in a very mocking way taking off any accent they think is posh. I’ve seen it in my own family. They seem to have difficulty accepting privately educated dc might actually be pleasant and even quite bright. They seem to think they are better because the privately educated somehow get so much privilege they walk into university and jobs with no talent at all. This goes as far as not ever applying for a university with privately educated dc in any number. So staying in their bubble means absolutely everything. The far left can be very unpleasant and horrible towards people they don’t respect.

A handful of unis have more than 1/3 privately educated. Were the students who hounded Professor Stock privately educated? The truth is that unpleasant people inhabit all schools but the vast majority are pleasant and great to know.

It’s worth remembering that in Edinburgh one in four children goes to a private school and that feeds in to the proportion of privately educated at Edinburgh University

@Umbilicat i always had the impression that a lot of those kids piled out, down south or even St Andrews.

I think the students who feel slighted have formed a pressure group and are getting media coverage. The leading founder of the Scottish Social Mobility Society says she had “never heard of private schools “ before she arrived at Edinburgh. She didn’t like being asked where she went to school because everyone who asked meant “what private school did you go to”?

There are some wild assumptions there and a degree of ignorance. Why, when you are in the majority by 2:1, would you get upset about what a student asks you to break the ice. Instead of saying her Scottish school she said “you won’t have heard of it”. Thousands must go to small private schools no one has heard of either!

I cannot see why students are not able to find the majority they feel are like them and they can ask the ice breaking questions about school and interpret the answers.

If anyone remembers the Young Ones and the University Challenge episode, perhaps DC should learn that standing up for your “Scumbag” uni or school is perfectly ok. Taking offence has become a national pastime.

@TizerorFizz ”the far left can be very unpleasant and horrible towards people they don’t respect”

I wasn’t commenting on politics - not sure where that has come from. Sorry to hear you’ve experienced that with your family. I was privately educated and never experienced anything like that from state educated people, but my state educated DC have from privately educated people , so I guess we all talk from personal experience and sounds like my family’s experiences have been very different to yours.

The Art College is different ( I went there, taught there for a while years ago and know people who still do). Being posh is not seen as "cool" especially talking about what school you went to. It can be quite competitive (well it was in my day, I get the impression staff and students are all kinder these days) but its ability that counts not class, other than that everyone mucks in together, you spend a lot of time together in the studio in relatively small groups compared to uni so being cliquey just doesn't work. I ended up with some very posh friends and lots who went to state school like me. Virtually no international students in those days though.
My DS is at the other big Scottish Art School and says it's the same. There's a VIP's offspring in his year who does their best to play down being posh!

Oh and my Scottish state school educated son had no bother at St Andrews either!