Law at Oxbridge

[JemmaAndHar]

Inspired by another thread, how can we support ds (year 10) to have a chance at getting a place at oxbridge? He's in top sets at an ordinary state comprehensive and on track for very good GCSEs. Looking to do Maths, History and either Philosophy or Further Maths for A-Levels or Politics. He has a passion for reading but doesn't read much non fiction. He's interested in history, philosophy, debating, law but not passionate or single minded about any of these. There is no debating club at his school.

We are not an Oxbridge family either. I've read on MN that candidates at interview are selected for their comprehensive knowledge and passion for the subject. Are any 17/8 year olds really passionate about the law? If they are, ds will probably not have a chance as he's interested in law but doesn't e.g. submerge himself in books related to law, if this is what's needed?

He's interested in all his prospective A-levels but not single minded. He's very social and lives for sports, especially rugby. He'd probably do quite well in the LNAT as he is academic and good at revising and memorising but not sure about the interview stage. Seeing how competitive Oxbridge is, maybe he's too 'ordinary' to be considered. What steps could he take now to be in the best possible place to apply for Law? Shall we get a subscription to magazines, newspapers or similar? Which ones? His knowledge of current affairs isn't amazing at the moment. I hope this post doesn't sound completely dumb, I admit I feel very much not in the know.

Also, which other Law schools would you recommend as possible alternatives? Any thoughts and tips would be so appreciated.

He is only y10.
Give him time for an interest to grow.
Does he want to do law?

I wouldn't start this early. Go through gcses and see what his grades are actually like. Even if he wants to be a solicitor or barrister he doesn't have to do a law degree. Around 50% do non law degrees and a law conversion. Indeed the main route to solicitor doesn't even need a conversion prior to SQE (post graduate professional qualification - solicitors qualifying exams).

He may be better off finding his feel for which A levels he wants to do. There is even a call for STEM lawyers so if Maths turns out to be his thing he can do a maths degree.

If he isn't interested in current affairs yet then politics would seem an odd A level. If Maths and FM are on the cards perhaps he might like economics. Economics has been a good A level for my son going into law as a lot of the application process for training contracts later focuses on commercial awareness and the Economics A level was a good grounding for that.

If he does want to start perhaps a good start is to spend a day at the local courts in the public gallery to see if that interests him.

Does he want to do law?
He thinks that he wants to. He finds it interesting, has read through the various undergraduate course descriptions and sees himself enjoying the course content, especially Oxford. We haven't done any open days and I believe this year's are full.

He may be better off finding his feel for which A levels he wants to do. There is even a call for STEM lawyers so if Maths turns out to be his thing he can do a maths degree.
He is very good at sciences, is doing triple science but finds it less interesting than humanities. His teachers say he's a very competent and enthusiastic mathematician.

Editing to add
If he isn't interested in current affairs yet then politics would seem an odd A level.
Agree with this and he probably won't. He is more interested in philosophy, history and maths.

Honestly by year ten I’d expect him to have a bit more interest in current affairs etc if he’s going to display the interest required. What does he enjoy reading?

I do think this is one of the downsides of the digital age - from an early age I picked up my parents’ papers and magazines and became enthused by the world.

This is something you cannot force. The drive to want it needs to come from him and he needs to show his passion for the subject. Oxbridge are very good at picking up on this at interview.

My DC is thinking of applying to Oxbridge but for a different subject. They were very much like your son. After visiting on a touristy day trip (I.e. not an open day) they were suddenly very inspired. Starting watching YouTube videos on prep and interviews etc, has started reading more widely on the subject, has found some work experience, asked teachers about applying etc. It is all coming from them.

Y10 is a bit early though so I’m not surprised he’s not really into starting to prep. They likely can’t see past GCSEs at the moment. A lot of kids still have no idea what it is they want to do. There’s honestly no rush.

My DD was determined to do Law at university in Y10. By ‘A’ levels she’d changed her mind and did PPE at Oxbridge, without Politics ‘A’ level.

He is actually a bit interested in current affairs, especially ethical issues but has little awareness or exposure beyond the school curriculum. You are right we don't have physical papers at home and he is not exposed to current affairs at all, Apple News is so superficial and we don't really watch TV or TV news. Would it be a good idea to give him an iPad subscription to the Times? He currently enjoys reading novels, a wide range, really.

If he wants to do FM then that should be as a fourth A level not third.

There are lots of good books that he could read to give him a sense of whether he’d find it interesting. I’d recommend Letters to a Law Student by Nicholas McBride, and The Rule of Law by Tom Bingham, to get him started.

He should think about whether what he wants is to study law because he’s interested in it, or because he’s interested in a legal career. If the latter then as PP says he could consider another subject for his degree (although IME a non law degree is more common among solicitors than barristers).

He should think about whether what he wants is to study law because he’s interested in it, or because he’s interested in a legal career.

He's interested in it and can see himself enjoying the undergraduate course, especially at Oxford and Cambridge. He'd also really like to do a year abroad as part of the programme. I suppose, I'm wondering what Oxbridge would be looking for in candidates at the interview stage.

Editing to add

Further maths would be a potential 4th A-Level although we're not sure this is wise.

@JemmaAndHar Why law and not say, philosophy or history or maths?
if he is set on law, he needs to think beyond Oxbridge. Most people don’t study there. Check out the university rankings for law and you will find other excellent options. But someone who doesn’t enjoy reading non fiction is probably not a good candidate for a law degree - there is a lot of reading - maths may be a better fit.

If he is interested in exploring law, there are lots of online resources you can use now. Eg Cambridge has a large number of webinars relating to the application process and various subjects. You or your son can register for these. You can watch on catch-up. Many universities have virtual open days including subject specific sessions. Check out the law society website and look at their suggestions for work experience. There are several wider participation courses which your son may be eligible for - check out the Sutton Trust.

Most kids don’t know what they want to do after school when they are in year 10. At this stage, I would encourage him to focus on expanding his knowledge of the wider world through reading a newspaper or news website. And reading more non-fiction - books and long form journalism such as the spectator, the economist, new statesman, etc.
And consider less traditional degree subjects. There are lots of other highly rated degree subjects which he may find more interesting eg International relations, Data Science.

In addition to the recommended Letters to a Law Student by Nicholas McBride, and The Rule of Law by Tom Bingham, what other non-fiction or indeed fiction books do people recommend for broadening his world view and getting him to think about the bigger picture. Reading philosophy instead of Law is a possibility. While he enjoys history, he prefers ethics and philosophy. He has read e.g. Kafka The Process and found it interesting.

Listen to Radio 4. It covers a broad range of topics almost all of which are pretty interesting (except the Food Programme imo).

In particular Law in Action & In Our Time.

I would agree that it’s quite early to be thinking about this now. But if possible I would look for some opportunities for some sort of law work experience to show genuine interest. His sport - assuming he does a decently high level of commitment - will help his application, maybe do a coaching badge or start to referee to show leadership etc.

Go to an open day at each uni and see what he thinks (I have studied law at both and they are actually quite different experiences).

Then really think about why he wants to study law and focus on development around that. So if it’s about the the theory side of things, then look into some of the more well known writers / books. If it’s about helping people, look to do work experience helping people to show this is actually true and not just a line in a statement. Etc etc. If that makes sense.

One of the difficulties with really giving advice on this is that so much depends on the people interviewing you for Oxbridge - they can be very different people and looking for very different things. My DW is a law fellow at a Cambridge college and does admissions, and even in their group of fellows they have huge disagreements over what they should focus on and who they should make offers to. And that’s just one college. So choice of college is actually pretty important, although too early to really be worrying about that now.

As far as I know most university open days aren't even open for bookings yet! Oxford doesn't seem to have 2025 details available yet, apart from the dates. Open days are generally aimed at Year 12/13 although there's nothing to stop you visiting sooner.

I'd say the key thing for now is to focus on GCSEs and getting the best grades he can across all of them, not just those he intends to take for A-level.

I think he should go and see lawyers in action. Tribunals, county court, maybe a magistrates court, the Old Bailey, a public enquiry. He'll see barristers, solicitors, the processes involved. Tbh I'd recommend a coroner's court too, inquests are amazing amd unlike other forms of law in this country.

If he's got the nous to find put how to do that, that's a good sign, but tbh at his age I would give him some support with it myself - find out together and perhaps travel together, at least for one of the trips.

A top barrister (I know her from long before she was one) also recommended volunteering at Citizens Advice Bureau, something like that.

We were advised at school to read broadsheet newspapers and at that time, we had the Guardian delivered each day. I still read it daily (edit - online.)

Yes - Radio 4 was always on at home when I was a teenager.

A top barrister (I know her from long before she was one) also recommended volunteering at Citizens Advice Bureau, something like that.
Ds would love to do this but they only take on volunteers over 18 in our area. What other volunteering options might there be where he could help others once he's 16? He's also keen on a weekend job but not sure year 11 will be the best time to start one.

I must have misunderstood the opening days, it was probably the fact that they're for older students that made me write it off for this year.

Radio 4 is a good idea (thanks for the Law in Action & In Our Time recommendation) as is visiting courts.

@CuriousGeorge80 would you be able to explain in more detail how Oxford and Cambridge differ for Law if you have personal experience?

DS read What About Law by Catherine Barnard, followed a couple of high profile cases in an area of law he was particularly interested in and sat in on case hearings at the local courts. This was during sixth form. (He had no interest in law until he started A Level Politics.)

Oxford has a Philosophy & Maths course in case that is of interest.

Law at Oxford seems to have a much heavier workload than many other humanities degrees. Bear that in mind when choosing.

Agree year 10 is a bit early to be choosing, give it time. All those A level combinations would be fine for Law - I think they like a bit of a mix of sciences/humanities, as long as you have one essay subject.

Lots of other universities are good for Law. If he wants the Bar then Oxbridge may be a benefit.

It’s interesting that you say choosing the correct college is important, the official line is that it doesn’t matter which college someone applies to.

Shame about the CAB. Well, is there a debating club at his school? If there isn't one, is there a friendly teacher who would be willing to join forces with him to set one up? Being able to construct arguments, and increasing your confidence at speaking in public, all v relevant for a law career without limiting his options.

Bear in mind that other knowledge can be helpful for law - eg patent attorneys need really to be scientists first.

He’s y 10.

wait until y12 and let him find his own way.

I'm following your thread as I also have a yr 10 who wants to study Law at Oxbridge.

My general point is that is definitely not too early! My older child is starting Uni in September (not Law). Their, and our, experience started this time last year booking and attending Open Days (so yr 12). However it would have been much more beneficial for him to have started years earlier, especially with Oxbridge.

Firstly, choosing the right A Level options. Also the right 6th form that will support them with their application - including entrance tests (LNAT) and hopefully interview.

Secondly, it turns out that Oxbridge is very different to other Unis and each other, for example applying to different colleges. So worth researching them.

Prepping for the entrance exam (for older DS) should have started much earlier.

There are also summer schools and courses that can be signed up to. I think between yr11 and 6th form, but I might be wrong.

So basically, starting looking and thinking about Uni in yr 10 isn't too early! And IMO, supporting your child through it isn't wrong either. For example, making a list of suggestions from this thread..

Oh and volunteering - how about your local food bank. They often have people there to signpost clients to help. Whilst your child can't advise, they can help with food distribution and maybe the advisor will be able to chat to them about wider issues.