Applying to Oxbridge for 2023 intake

[riverpebbles]

Not sure if there is already a thread on this? My son is hoping to apply to Cambridge for Computer Science for October 2023 start.

My DS has applied for Theology and Philsophy at the following, Cambridge, Durham, St Andrew's, Nottingham and Exeter. Quite a few of his friends have received offers already and he hasn't, as this is our first time doing this, are the offers made by the faculty? His friends have Nottingham offers and he's not so I'm wondering if it's his subject? Obviously I've told him to not to worry.

My son's school will only meet with him to discuss his application tomorrow afternoon. Should we worry? They seem to be leaving it SO late.

what has she applied for?
congrats on the York offer!

What does CAG stand for?
sorry to be so dim...

Yes they are leaving it late, however there have been strikes etc.
deadline is fifteenth. i.e. at least one day to go. I wouldn't be comfortable doing it like that but guess all places are different ....

My understanding is some unis encourage faculties to be quick off the mark but yes, of course, each faculty will offer at a different rate .. Nothing to worry about at all yet, most kids are nowhere near submitting their UCAS still;

Also, GCSE grades are contextualised according to the 'average grade profile' of students in the specific school the DC attend. It's not as simple as 'state v private' as some seem to think. Unis know that some private schools are very average or even rubbish, whole some state schools are exceptional.
So if they are applying with ten 9s from a school where'd the average grade profile is. ten 5s /6s, they will get a stronger contextualised score than they are applying from a school (grammar, academy-type school or independent) where nearly everyone gets all 8s / 9s.*

so how does that work with grammar schools then? They get higher grades because the kids are by definition all smart kids, not just because they have had better teaching or teh school has been more generous with their grading

DS is applying for PPE at Oxford. Plus Durham, Edinburgh, Nottingham and Exeter.

It looks like he has a place in the US (Ivy League) though (which he is very keen on) so if there were a choice that complicates things somewhat.

I have a friend whose son has a pretty much free ride at Harvard. It was a no brainer.

If you have to pay however it’s eye watering my expensive..

Agreed. Full price is a shocking amount. Most people don't pay anywhere near full price though.

I'm not sure it's helpful to generalise about schools in any sector, user29. Some grammar schools are much more selective than others - eg. a friend lives in the NW where the odds of getting into a grammar are 1 in 2; whereas in some of the London ones such as Tiffin or The Latymer School, the odds of a place are more like 1 in 12. You can't compare as grammars across the UK vary massively in terms of selectivity and consequently di do their results. It's exactly the same with independents. There are many London independents where 12-15 applicants sit for every place (nearly all of whom will have been among the most able at primary level). Even a less selective independent in London will still have probably 4-5 applicants per place which is more competitive than most grammars nationally. Then there are far less competitive entry private day schools, perhaps in more rural areas, which will barely be selective at all. There are independent schools specifically for SEN. There are boarding schools which are a whole different selection process again. Then, within the state (non grammar) sector, there are some excellent schools and some that are not great at all. It's a postcode lottery quite often. All unis can do is look at an applicant in relation to how they perform in their specific school. So eg. a student applying with 10 grade 8s at GCSE from a top performing school such as St Paul's Girl's (independent day), Wycombe Abbey (independent boarding), Tiffin Girls (grammar) or Brampton Manor (state) could find they receive a negative contextualisation score as their GCSEs are probably lower than average grade profile in any of those schools.

Each school has to provide its own "profile" page for UCAS with info in as to the type of school, contextual info, average grades profiles for the last five years, etc. You can ask to see the one for your DC school in most cases.

Also, if your DC would like to see their school reference they can call UCAS who will ping it though to them in an hour or so. (Just mentioning as we didn't realise this last year and for some reason DC thought the reference was sort of top secret between the school and the unis. It's not).

indeed, @user29 . I wonder the same. How grammar schools and private schools are in the same category escapes my understanding. They have absolutely different spending levels per student, approach to teaching etc. When meeting tutors in Oxford, I've heard "we are not spoon feeding our students like in your schools" and my thought was: not in our <grammar> school. Quite a few teachers in my DC school think the children should study further, independently, by themselves. And after 7 years of this style of teaching my DC is "positively discriminated" by being put in the same category with best independent schools in the UK. Yeh, right...

Nobody is being discriminated against. Students are just being assessed against the cohort in THEIR school. That's it.

My DC's school show all the students their reference anyway to make sure there is nothing wrong.
I am not sure how much emphasis can be put on GCSE grades this time because the process was not by any means objective - riddled with conscious and unconcious bias. For example independent schools have been known to inflate grades more than comps for example.
In any case Cambs (unlike Oxford) do not regard GCSE as a good predictor of degree success. Some students have a very 'spikey' profile. For example being gifted in one field, maTHS for example but only average in other areas In my own DC's case they have sat AS levels but lots of schools won't have,. Personally i think aptitiude tests will be important this time because they are at least a level playing field, and of course the interview.

One of My own DC has read maths at Cambridge and another chemistry at Oxford

I agree GCSEs are only a small part of the selection process and this year may hardly count at all due to the (CAGs / TAGs).

Are you an admissions tutor @zezzez?

Oh god, no. Just been through it twice. One DC just last year.

I did speak to an admissions tutor after the welcome talk when we dropped DC off the other week and this is basically what she said. She said it doesn't matter where they come from or what type of school it is, their grades are contextualised against that specific school cohort. Lots of people there saying they were worried about imposter syndrome because they are "only" from a state school. As it turns out, the vast majority are. The lady was saying there are other contextualising flags that come into the mix too based on postcode, family situations, whether a student has been in care, etc (something about POLAR and ACORN quintiles). The school is just one aspect, basically.

Thanks! PPE.

DS application apparently went in today so now the waiting game begins while he preps for the TSA.

Good luck everyone...

GoldieRetrieversRule1 you are quite wrong to say that grammars have a different spend per pupil than other state schools. On the whole they have less to spend than non selectives, let alone being a million miles away from independents.

Sorry badly typed on a phone in and out of signal. Basically grammars have the least to spend on their pupils across all types of school and all sectors.

Oh dear I now see I totally misread your post Goldie (on a train and I glanced at it then it disappeared). Apologies!

My DS is also applying for Music at St Hilda’s Oxford, Durham, Cardiff, Southampton and York. Which Oxford college did he apply for?

Hello. Just pressed send on ds's application to Oxford. Do they reject anyone BEFORE the TSA? I think that would be worse tbh especially as we have already paid!

@perseverence I totally sympathise about you finding the process nerve wracking - you are by no means alone feeling this way 🤗

I've been through the process for O twice in the last 3 years - once for Geography, once for Modern Languages. Both applied for and received deferred offers. So if anyone has any queries on these subjects please ask / DM.

Re Pooling - I agree with PP that Oxofrd's system is fairer as you are actually interviewed again. With Geography unlike most subjects they don't tend to do second interviews. DC2 (ML) had a two interviews with one college the first week and a second interview a week later with two colleges attending that interview and was offered a place by one of the second colleges. Exactly the same happened to their friend applying for the same subject.

It was a well managed process though interestingly all the colleges had different styles with the online interviews - some you are straight in to the tutors and no warm up while with another college there was a welcome room with friendly undergrads checking you were okay, had your background blurred etc.

Having had one DC have face to face and one have online interviews I'd say the online interview process is fairer and has less bias. Heading to O or C by yourself and having to socialise with a whole load of other nervous people is quite stressful especially if you are not used to such ivory tower settings.

DC2s college had an offer holders day very shortly afterwards so they could see the college.

Re other choices . For info for ML 2021 application for 2023 place (DC2): Bristol offered in October, Durham in Feb, Newcastle in March/April , Edinburgh she gave up waiting for in mid May . Context Northern Comprehensive till GCSEs then State Grammar for 6th form - not a contextual candidate