Oxbridge Aspirants 2022 part 3....Will they or won't they make it to interview? Our Mum nerves are in tatters!

[TangoWhiskyAlphaTango]

New thread for us, lots of lovely support whilst we wait. Some of our lovely DC now have interview dates whilst the rest of us hold our breath and try not to hassle our teens into checking their SPAM folders at least several times per day .

Where it's appropriate I mean.

I understood that the school reference will often include where a DC sits in the year. I know Fir both DS1 and DD it was included.

I think that depends on the school type. Utterly irrelevant in some schools?

We are certainly never told to write that in references...

My DD was 126th in the year for maths 😊. Out of 872. Over 300 got A stars. So position was totally meaningless.

Yeah in my school we have a B grade student who is top in German. I know this because one person does German

Piggy that student is top but not top of a competitive cohort, by definition. I'm amazed the class runs with a single student!

mumsneedwine yes 126/872 is fairly meaningless but had your DD been top of 872 then that might have been worth mentioning. Some A* are better than others, obviously, so if a student is heading for full marks in maths that would probably be flagged.

I think more chose German but then didn't turn up. It won't have been intentional!

My DC is one of only 2 in one subject. I'm impressed that they're running the class (a comprehensive).

Makes sense. Must be a miserable experience for the kid in question.

The German teacher is v nice so I'm sure it's fine!

Not a reflection on the teacher Piggy, just boring and not ideal educationally for a humanities subject.

Or rather, particularly for a humanities subject.

I was a bit surprised to find out how small a lot of our classes are last week when I was nosing. Considering I have 26...!! I think I am funding the entire sixth form with bums on seats! (well, along with law, psychology and biology who get smaller class sizes)

Interestingly, in much of Scotland we do have ranking, in that there's a Dux system: absolute best in year get the Dux, then the runner up. I suppose all schools have a ranking with subject prizes.

DS got school Dux and 3 subject prizes (out of 5) but that's absolute no guarantee he'll even get an interview. Fewer people understand the Scottish system and I do think it's a disadvantage.

Ds got “3rd in year” for one of his subjects on his teacher ref. Sadly not the subject he’s actually applied for. Not sure if they said how many are in the year, which is pretty relevant.

@Piggywaspushed

I think that depends on the school type. Utterly irrelevant in some schools?

We are certainly never told to write that in references...

Fits with my DCs experiences. All got to see their school references. None explicitly stated a rank in year of any kind. I wondered if any further 'secret' info gets sent to Oxford, but maybe not.

Anyway, we'll probably know yes/no on interview early next week. The student room spreadsheet shows Earth Science invites going out now. Just waiting on DCs college, they don't seem to have sent any invites yet.

I'm half Scottish and now live in Scotland Puffalicious and I have to say that when someone mentioned Dux earlier on this thread (probably you!), I assumed it meant Head Prefect and thought.... well, not really relevant to Oxbridge (although fair to say that lots of kids there do seem to have been Head Prefect).

@PhiRhoSigma

Bilberry Do you know that Oxford actually has information about where individuals are placed relative to the cohort at their particular school? Or did you mean the national cohort across all of that type of school?

At my DCs school, we are never told about a rank in year. I mean, it's possible to work out who the few standout kids are, but it's never actually articulated as such and I don't see how Oxford would know. The school reference is glowing but it doesn't actually say 'best in year' or whatever.

I believe they look at the performance of the whole year group across the board, not subject-specific data.

On the Contextual data page for Oxford they say;

The performance of the applicant’s school or college at GCSE. The applicant’s attainment will be considered within the profile of attainment within their school or college.
The performance of the applicant’s school or college at A-level or equivalent level
The percentage of students eligible for free school meals at the applicant’s school or college at GCSE or equivalent level.

www.ox.ac.uk/admissions/undergraduate/applying-to-oxford/decisions/contextual-data

...which I take to mean that if an applicant has, for example, 5x 8s and 9s (which are treated identically), and 5x7s, if they are in a school where most people have 10x8s or 9s that will not be given as much credit as if they are in a school where no-one else got any 8s and 9s at all.

That's how I read it too, @BilberryBaggins

Some of this makes sense, like recognising that a student at a school with low grades across the board being at the top of their cohort has actually achieved more than it appears at first glance.
Some doesn’t, like handicapping students who are in very selective cohorts to begin with such as grammar schools.
The first is adjusting to strip out bias, the second is adding bias ifyswim.

I don't think it is handicapping people in other cohorts; if you look at an independent school for example, if you didn't think it was beneficial to go there (ie if it wasn't conferring advantage by being in that school), then you wouldn't pay the fees.

With grammar schools it's a bit more complex, because it depends on your local set-up, but you still have the phenomenon where in a school where a much smaller proportion of the cohort achieve high grades, it is harder to personally buck the trend and reach those levels. For example if you are in a school with no 6th form, you may have fewer specialist teachers, because there is an incentive for specialist teachers to want to teach A level.

When you look at the actual make up of Oxbridge cohorts, it's clear that any and all of these contextual aspects do not really prejudice against students in grammar and independent schools.

@goodbyestranger

I'm half Scottish and now live in Scotland Puffalicious and I have to say that when someone mentioned Dux earlier on this thread (probably you!), I assumed it meant Head Prefect and thought.... well, not really relevant to Oxbridge (although fair to say that lots of kids there do seem to have been Head Prefect).

You demonstrate my point exactly! Most schools in my area, including my own school, have the Dux system. It's hotly contested every year and a real honour to get it as you need to be best across 5 Higher subjects, nominated by various teachers and ratified by the Head of Year and Headteacher. I believe some very selective independents have a similar thing.

DS was asked to be a prefect but declined . He hates a fuss and said he couldn't be doing with corridor duty or first years! Least he was honest.

See, this is the thing: all the DC here ,and all those applying, are outstanding to even be applying. I hope ours ALL get in.

Totally agree @Puffalicious!