Mental health - university choices and applications

[FoffFoffFoff]

I found a thread from last year that I was going to resurrect, but decided better form to start my own.

Dc in y12->13, severe anxiety and some depression. Quite young for age (not going to take a year out, that would make the anxiety worse). Social anxiety also.

Assume campus universities better suited than city universities? Dc aiming for RG-type universities.

Please share the names of any universities that your DC with MH issues have found good. Any to avoid?

Preferably in England as don't want DC to be too far away and not be able to easily reach/return if there is a crisis.

Previous thread I read also said to declare these MH issues on UCAS form - will that limit their acceptances to course directors with supportive attitudes? Guess better to rule out unsupportive courses, but would rather know in advance so as not to waste a choice.

Most open days currently online so can't just wander up and ask.

To add an extra layer of complication, I think DC will want to chose somewhere that will do on-site teaching in 2022, not sit at home with a laptop, feeling isolated and lonely. DC does make and need friends, tend to be sensible ones focussed on studies.
There is a thread about those types of universities on this board. Think York was mentioned as keen to get students back onsite.

@FoffFoffFoff I did look at the quiet accommodation mentioned and it is quite extreme, probably aimed at people who don't drink for religious reasons since you get thrown out for even having alcohol there, or making noise after 10 pm.

Who told you that? My DS is in "quiet" accommodation and it's nothing like that at all. They're simply not the "all night ravers". They still go out to pubs, for meals, the occasional club, etc., and have cocktail nights in their flat (which tended to go into the early hours), but it wasn't rowdy as such and wasn't an "open for all" party house. None of his 7 flat mates were there for religious reasons, all drank alcohol, etc., but just not to extreme.

He says the "other" flats, i.e. the ones that weren't "quiet" were usually pretty rowdy, lots of people coming and going at all hours, lots of noise/music in the middle of the night etc. He could see them as the "normal" flats were across the courtyard. He said he was very glad he chose a "quiet" flat as he couldn't have done with the "open house" atmosphere of the normal flats. Obviously they weren't all that extreme, but he reckons there was at least one rowdy flat on each floor of the other blocks.

@FoffFoffFoff

To add an extra layer of complication, I think DC will want to chose somewhere that will do on-site teaching in 2022, not sit at home with a laptop, feeling isolated and lonely. DC does make and need friends, tend to be sensible ones focussed on studies. There is a thread about those types of universities on this board. Think York was mentioned as keen to get students back onsite.

I think most, if not all, Unis will say they're keen for on-site teaching, as they did last August (!), but the reality may well be very different. My son's Uni promised "blended learning" but when they were promising that, they'd already told most of their teaching staff not to return to campus, so what they say and what they do, aren't necessarily the same thing!

@user1497207191 I looked at Bath and these are the conditions of their quiet accommodation. Another place we looked at didn't do quiet accommodation (York?).
Your son's accommodation sounds more reasonable - could you say where or give a clue?

If your DD is looking into Halls, I'd pay close attention to which universities have pastoral support in their residences.
Some high pressure RGs have live in academic staff/postgraduates who are on call for welfare and discipline out of hours, usually mental health and emergency trained. In my experience having someone who's on site and 'gets it' can be invaluable in bridging the gap between home and independence for new students with MH issues. As well as someone on site policing discipline meaning wild parties rarely become as extreme as those in the daily mail.

Be careful though as it's not the same as residence advisors, and the like who are undergrads living in halls usually for another year of party.

Feel free to DM op if you want to hear where I am referring to (to declare publicly would be really outing).

I ended up in a quiet halls my first year and it was awful. Very isolated and anti social. Avoid!

[quote FoffFoffFoff]@user1497207191 I looked at Bath and these are the conditions of their quiet accommodation. Another place we looked at didn't do quiet accommodation (York?).
Your son's accommodation sounds more reasonable - could you say where or give a clue?[/quote]
They don't , no, but there are quieter residences outside of the main colleges.

I just saw your previous post : York's' accommodation has improved hugely since way back when, although this does mean most of it has decamped to a new campus...

I have honestly never heard of anyone being unhappy there! The fact that it is a really nice, but not overwhelming , city also helps.

I do think it is worth bearing in mind that if unis have 'quiet' accommodation' this does suggest to students that everywhere else is 'rowdy accommodation' as if that means they have free licence.

Have you looked at Loughborough at all? Another campus uni. Very high Student Satisfaction rates.

@Piggywaspushed

Have you looked at Loughborough at all? Another campus uni. Very high Student Satisfaction rates.

And yet a friend's ds hated it and felt totally abandoned by them

Edinburgh also seems to get a big thumbs down from my personal anecdotal data

For undergraduate students, we aim to provide designated quiet blocks or to place students together who indicate on their application that they wish to live with others who prefer a quieter lifestyle

Quiet just means a preference for quiet, not anything else.

Have you considered Nottingham? The halls in campus are catered, but that really supported my DS. A group of them would WhatsApp each other to go to dinner together. He found it very social, but not over noisy etc. He is now in a house share with the group he had dinner with.

@Piggywaspushed

Have you looked at Loughborough at all? Another campus uni. Very high Student Satisfaction rates.

No will look, guess my preconceptions of it being very sporty and/or for engineering would need to be supressed. My experiences of looking at unis is decades old, but still fresh in my mind, IYSWIM.

Both my DDs studied or are studying sciences. We quickly learned to be very focussed in terms of what to get out of university tours:

• Course talk
• Accommodation tour
• Library
• Labs

The course talk gives you an idea of the direction a course can lead students in. DD1 studied biochem, one course talk was almost entirely focussed on biomed with biochem tacked on as an afterthought. Uni got crossed off the list

Accommodation - really worth checking out accommodation at the different price levels. The accommodation provider is keen to push the most expensive halls.

Library - it's not just about the books but also the study areas. It is good to have space where course friends can get together away from accommodation. This was an absolute lifesaver for both DDs as it meant they werent stuck in their flats with the happy shoppers/party animals.

Labs - or could be any other specialised course facilities. DD1 loved from the get go the labs at the uni she eventually ended up at. They are still the most advanced student focussed labs I have seen.

Loughborough is indeed very sporty, as is Bath.

From what I know of Bath, there are two worlds of sports - the elite students who compete at e.g. olympics and are there on scholarships whose main 'job'/responsibility is to play sport and win, and another level for those who enjoy playing sport as hobby/for exercise/would do inter-uni teams perhaps and are primarily there to study. My Dc would actually probably do the latter, but the right balance would need to be possible (e.g. opportunity to take part at non-elite level).
Slightly concerned about the mention of initiation trauma mentioned upthread.
But exercise is good for mental health :)

The best labs were the at Nottingham Trent.

DD2 is studying physics at Sheffield. I honestly couldnt tell you if the labs are good as physics is not remotely my subject. She has never expressed any discontent with the physics labs so I can only assume they are fine!

Thanks - both seem to get favourable comments about MH support (I think, people have been so helpful I need to start a spreadsheet :))

While I am disabusing myself of preconceived ideas - is Exeter still very public school? Slightly too far perhaps since factor no. 1 seems to be distance to home, but courses look suitable and nice part of the country. etc.

If your DC has mental health issues that mean they will require significant support, then sourcing random anecdotes and trivia is only likely to fuel your anxiety.

Things like one individual's experience or the general happiness of the student population, while interesting in a general sense, are not really that useful if being able to access appropriate, specialised, ongoing mental health support is your primary concern. Most universities are pretty similar in terms of their policies and general support, and some students will have good experiences, and others not so good, but what matters is the experience your DC, specifically and individually, will have. Realistically, you can only find that out be speaking directly to the people who will be responsible for providing that specific experience for your DC.

If I was the OP, what I would do is:

1. Identify five-ish universities that your DC would like to attend, based on location, course, prestige or whatever else besides mental health support is important to them.

2. At each of these universities, identify two people: a) someone who works in the university services that provide mental health support; b) an academic in the department where your DC would be based who has some level of responsibility for student mental health - this could be someone with a specific job title, the Head of Department, Course Leader, Senior Tutor, etc.

3. When term has been underway for a few weeks, send each of these people an individual email. In this email explain concisely what your DC's specific issues and needs are and ask to arrange a telephone / video call to discuss support for them. You can do this without needing to identify your DC. If you find it difficult to find who to contact or they won't speak to you, taken them off your potential list, because if you find it difficult, so will your DC - choose another university to add to your list.

4. (supposing they agree to speak to you) in the call, be focussed on support for your DC. If you meander off the issue and start talking about employment rates and sports facilities and how clever your DC is, you give them the opportunity to start selling their university, rather than telling you how it will be for your DC. You want to focus clearly on two questions: 'what actual support will my DC be given on a day-to-day basis?' and 'what actual support will my DC be given in a crisis?'.

5. Pay attention to whether they talk about actual practicalities, things that will happen, this person, in this role, will do this specific thing for your DC, and how often they hide behind policies and strategies and statistics. All universities are adept at having policies and picking and choosing statistics that make them sound good. If a service or department is doing actual things to support students with mental health issues, they will not be shy in telling you about them. Otherwise, there is a lot of good in theory, good on paper, but if they can't tell you what will actually happen for your DC then there is a good chance that your DC could be left to navigate a maze of things that kind of exist, alone.

6. Step back and consider: these people that you have spoken to are going to be primarily responsible (along with you, your DC and external health services) for the wellbeing of your DC - are you happy with that? Do you feel confident leaving that responsibility in their hands? If not, choose new potential universities and start again.

As an academic, my university is in many respects wonderful. Our students are generally happy, they get good jobs, our facilities are great. We have numerous policies related to wellbeing and we have increased our spending on student wellbeing significantly. We can sound great and we will genuinely try our best for your DC. But at an individual level, as will be the case in most universities, most of our staff have little or no training in dealing with significant mental health issues, many are short of time, and some lack any kind of aptitude. I can see that your DC might get great support, but that they also might not, as is the case for all students. If it was my DC, I would want to know from my university whether they could show me that my DC was at least reasonably likely to be a student who did get great support, because the general happiness of other students is of far less concern to me than the critical wellbeing of my child.

I agree about open days , we developed a similar system . Ds very interested in libraries ( anywhere quite frankly, he just likes libraries ! ) as he doesn’t like studying in his bedroom, accommodation ( although I have learnt not to get too fixated as you rarely get what you ask for unless you have a priority condition) , course talk and also go to the dept stand and actually talk to them and ask detailed questions unlike the talk which can be a big fluffy ( with the notable exceptions of Oxford and Durham) and geared to all the good things . I would also say focus on where your ds is likely to find her ‘tribe’ for us it was drama and music for others it might be netball or cricket

The most important thing to remember us open days are effectively selling you something and just like anything else you buy it’s buyer beware. Question question question , a forward sheet is a good idea !!

@phphion
Thanks that was just what I needed and brought my focus back to the main issues.

There is a good case scenario of DC being able to stay at university and live with MH challenges with the right kind of accommodation, friends, course facilities, hobbies (but although they sound trivial, just one out of unsuitable accommodation, poor course facilities and no friends would probably be enough to destabilise a student with MH issues).

And there is a bad case scenario of a downward MH spiral, crisis or crises, Dc not coping, and at this stage I get drawn into preventative strategies to avoid that and it is harder to face the dealing with what if that actually happens. So you have given good pointers to face the latter and how to have a good shot at finding somewhere that a) lowers the risk of the bad/worst case scenario happening and b) lowers the risk to Dc if that happens and means Dc gets the help they need. It feels like there is no way of finding this out, so your suggestions are a structured approach worth embarking on.