DD wants a RG Uni that does F2F teaching - which will?

[mugglewump]

My DD is in the process of choosing which universities to apply for and wants Russell Group. After hearing Manchester say that blended learning will continue indefinitely, she has decided that F2F learning is (unsurprisingly) important to her. She is interested in Leeds, Sheffield, Newcastle, Nottingham, Bristol, Kings, Cardiff and Southampton and would like to know which of these have declared an intention to return to face to face learning for 2022. If you have a DD or DS at any of these and know the uni's intention in terms of course delivery, can you share it please? She wants to study geography. TIA.

@Newgirls

My dd has started to hear from tutors. Some are doing face to face and others not. They seem to be making their own personal decisions one based on fact he hasn’t moved back to the uni town…

Presumably at that particular university, what academic staff do is not solely down to diktat from on high, then?

Gosh Newgirls I wonder how university will handle that if students complain?

Last year the reason was COVID restrictions, this year some universities are using numbers in lectures for whether it's online or in person. So if other lecturers are going ahead with classes in person of a similar size...,,

RG unis are taking more students in apparently so I would expect blended learning to become the new norm. It’s really not bad. I did blended learning with the OU (and I assume all unis will copy the OU format now) which let me pick and choose which lectures I wanted to attended and a variety of formats - from interactive Microsoft Team sessions, to pre-recorded, or face to face, while also allowing me to contact the tutor privately if I needed more help.

@TheCountessofFitzdotterel

‘I think online lectures are fine, so far as any kind of lectures are fine. Nobody learns very much by attending lectures‘

I couldn’t disagree more with this. Perhaps it depends on the subject.

I absolutely hate this trope that keeps being aired on Mumsnet.

I totally disagree with it.

It's really hard to be sure what will be happening until term is up and running.

My daughter is at the same uni as Newgirls and did get a reasonable amount of proper F2F in semester 1. Same uni, different tutors, different experience. I've no idea how applicants are supposed to make any decisions, really.

I disagree with the 'noone learns very much by attending lectures" if it wasn't clear

@Bryonyshcmyony

I disagree with the 'noone learns very much by attending lectures" if it wasn't clear

I learned more during my Zoom lectures than the face to face ones because they got recorded and out into an archive so I could refer back to them

Lectures were recorded anyway at dds uni for that reason and for those who can't be arsed to go.

Dd learns far more at RL lectures and talking to peers afterwards.

The only thing you can do is speak to individual universities and preferably the course leaders as they they will be able to tell you what their plans are.

Our official line is back to normal BUT some course will keep some online, f2f content because it did work better - my course will be around 60% on campus with the rest delivered online. I've been very transparent about this and was moving towards this model pre covid but the additional investment in the IT infrastructure meant I was able to do this earlier.

My dd has started to hear from tutors. Some are doing face to face and others not. They seem to be making their own personal decisions one based on fact he hasn’t moved back to the uni town…

If a course is keeping some online content it will have had to go through a very thorough validation process and the academic will have had to provide justification for these changes. We are now no longer following emergency covid procedures so academics can just decide to move course online in a whim. I would be asking the university why they are keeping some content- hopefully it's been a considered decision.

@wooliewoo

Gosh Newgirls I wonder how university will handle that if students complain?

Last year the reason was COVID restrictions, this year some universities are using numbers in lectures for whether it's online or in person. So if other lecturers are going ahead with classes in person of a similar size...,,

Genuinely don’t know. I guess the individual tutors will say they are vulnerable? She doesn’t know all reasons.

@AChickenCalledDaal

It's really hard to be sure what will be happening until term is up and running.

My daughter is at the same uni as Newgirls and did get a reasonable amount of proper F2F in semester 1. Same uni, different tutors, different experience. I've no idea how applicants are supposed to make any decisions, really.

It really did come down to individual departments.

@SkinnyMirror

My dd has started to hear from tutors. Some are doing face to face and others not. They seem to be making their own personal decisions one based on fact he hasn’t moved back to the uni town…

If a course is keeping some online content it will have had to go through a very thorough validation process and the academic will have had to provide justification for these changes. We are now no longer following emergency covid procedures so academics can just decide to move course online in a whim. I would be asking the university why they are keeping some content- hopefully it's been a considered decision.

I’m sure it was considered by the uni staff - no one asked the second year tutorial group

I guess in some cases, there could be international postgraduate students who normally provide face to face tutorials etc but are currently stuck in different countries and studying remotely themselves. Although you would hope that the universities have had enough time to organise alternative tutors/module changes in that situation.

I’m sure it was considered by the uni staff - no one asked the second year tutorial group

Had she spoken to her tutors? Raised this with the university?

@SkinnyMirror

I’m sure it was considered by the uni staff - no one asked the second year tutorial group

Had she spoken to her tutors? Raised this with the university?

She found out today. Starts in about 3 weeks. Do you think she can do anything?

@AChickenCalledDaal

I guess in some cases, there could be international postgraduate students who normally provide face to face tutorials etc but are currently stuck in different countries and studying remotely themselves. Although you would hope that the universities have had enough time to organise alternative tutors/module changes in that situation.

Maybe - this one is in the country though

@Notanotherusernamenow

I know KCL is largely online this year

Some of the lower RG unis will likely offer more as less competitive - eg Southampton?

It'll be prerecorded lectures and face to face tutorials and a lot of extra one to one meetings with course leaders, at least in my department.

It would be foolish of any student to make a decision for Sept 2022 based on what universities are saying in August 2021.

Certain subjects are more suited to online delivery. There will be a far greater difference in delivery between different subjects in the same university than there will be in the same subject in different universities.

Also, it is worth remember that selecting universities will underpromise and overdeliver while recruiting universities will say anything to get more bums on seats.

She should speak to the SU - they will be able to advise.

If she doesn't have this already it would also be useful to get the full breakdown of how everything will be taught from her lecturers - it might not be as bad as she thinks.

I know that timetables have been delayed at many universities- I only got mine yesterday, but academics should have been working with the timetable people so should have had a good idea about how it was all going to work.

Also, it is worth remember that selecting universities will underpromise and overdeliver while recruiting universities will say anything to get more bums on seats.

Not necessarily. I work at a recruiting university and we take CMA very seriously. We deliver exactly what we say we will.

I know that timetables have been delayed at many universities- I only got mine yesterday

That’s good going. We don’t normally get ours until the start of October anyway.

IMHO any university that is claiming full fees but still choosing to run remote teaching is failing in their duty. My (non RG) university is promising a full in-person teaching programme and is also committed to recording lectures for anyone off sick or self-isolating. Unless government guidelines change, this should be the expectation.

@mugglewump as per PPs all universities should have their COVID restrictions on their website. Have a look and also ring them to check. If your DD is set on an institution that won’t commit to running a full live teaching programme, consider deferred entry.

If your DD is set on an institution that won’t commit to running a full live teaching programme, consider deferred entry.

You could be deferring for an awfully long time.

@SkinnyMirror

She should speak to the SU - they will be able to advise.

If she doesn't have this already it would also be useful to get the full breakdown of how everything will be taught from her lecturers - it might not be as bad as she thinks.

I know that timetables have been delayed at many universities- I only got mine yesterday, but academics should have been working with the timetable people so should have had a good idea about how it was all going to work.

Thank you. Not sure what SU is - student union?

She has a break down of lectures, labs and tutorials and it’s a mix. She is disappointed that the small tutorials are online. Not sure how many are international. She’s not away of any so she doesn’t think that is the key factor. She expected the lectures to be.