Medicine 2022 entry - How difficult is it really? *title edited by MNHQ at OP's request*

[notmedicmum]

I couldn't find a thread for 2022 entrants to medicine - maybe I didn't look hard enough! DD is in Year 12 and has wanted to do medicine since Year 10. It's only this year that we realise the enormity of actually getting a place. Not only do you have to have brilliant grades, you must also have done work experience, volunteered (both difficult in the current situation), got excellent BMAT/UCAT scores. Oh, and you also must have cycled from Land's End to John O'Groats to raise money for charity or climbed Kilimanjaro or won the Nobel Peace prize or found a cure for cancer (joking about the last two). How competitive is it REALLY? I'm not sure about the value of the last apart from being used as a selection tool as the unis get so many qualified applicants - and showing enterprise and drive. Apparently this sort of thing is even more important this year as getting work experience is very hard this year. How does climbing a mountain make you a better doctor anyway? And what can normal students do to improve their chances of success??

Interesting.

DD is currently 16 going on 26! Bodes well!

Hi @MidLifeCrisis007 My DS is 3rd year Exeter med student. He loves it there, very hands-on course and a great city. If you have any questions let me know!

Thanks @Lovecatsanddogs. She's heard Exeter is great... which probably explains why it's so popular and difficult to get into!

It's hard to know where she should pitch herself without having done any UCAT preparation yet.

@MidLifeCrisis007 He's been very happy there. Weirdly it was my DS only offer but he had a v
good UKCAT. Blackstone tutors have all the questions from med schools so that was worth looking at on their webpage and he used Medify. I think you still need to have 3 a star predicted but the MMI were only 3 mins long so that was obviously good for him. I agree with @Monkey2001 re girls at interview!

Exeter is a lovely place with a great course, but I think that another reason for its popularity is that in a normal year if you are predicted AAA you don't need a great UCAT for an interview. There is a shortage of med schools for people who struggle with UCAT (although that was not your DS's issue @Lovecatsanddogs*) and Exeter is the only one which focuses on A level predictions. This year was thrown by the high number of gap year applicants with generous grades which they may not have achieved in a normal year.

Hello there I'm sneaking onto this thread quietly as I'm in the funny position of coming at the medic mum experience backwards. DS2 is a 3rd/4th year med student at Sheffield (currently intercalating) so I'm happy to try and answer questions about his experience there if anyone's interested.

But now DS1 (24 yo science masters grad) has decided he wants to try and get into medicine too, either on a graduate entry course or an A100 so I find myself going through the whole roller coaster of tests and work experience all over again except this time with older ds who knows it all already and bites my head off if I ask too many questions. So I'm hoping I can share the stresses, disappointments and excitements with you all here instead

Hello @Backseatmedmum, that is not an enviable position, the competition is even worse for grads although it is good if he can afford to fund himself on an A100 course as they are not quite as tough to get into as A101.

Welcome to the LONG roller coaster!

This thread seems to have gone dormant! I thought it might be helpful to share info on open days.

Open day at Leicester 27th March. DS1 was very impressed by their open day talks for medics, he liked them much better than Edinburgh.

That’s interesting. I thought most universities held open days after Easter. Are there any other open days coming up soon (presumably virtual)?

I think Cardiff is 21st April, so that is after Easter. The great thing about virtual open days is that you can visit loads with minimal effort and no cost, and hopefully actually visit them in the autumn.

Have people’s DCs decided on UKAT or BMAT or both yet?

And if both, which sittings?

Both. DD wants to try for Oxford (BMAT) and Edinburgh (UCAT). Oxford requires the later BMAT sitting so we think she should do UCAT early - and then have a bit of a break.

I was in Oxford today to pick up DS1. I know DD would love it there but it's such a long shot. As is Edinburgh....

Not decided on the other two yet. She likes
the idea of Bristol but we need to do some more research. Leeds is also a possibility.

Definitely just UCAT here as DS2 can only apply for 3 courses with his A levels and they are all UCAT. If not applying to Oxford it is much better to do the early BMAT, it is really comforting to know the score before you apply so no choices are wasted. Leeds should be fine for @sandybayley DD, with her GCSEs you just need a top 50% BMAT. One word of warning re Leeds is that they have a very low offer to interview ratio - just over 50% of interviewees get offers, it is over 75% for most med schools.

Thanks @Monkey2001 - tbh I'm not sure why Leeds has turned up on the list. I need to interrogate DD. But only when she's finished her maths coursework. It's proving painful for us all 😬

@sandybayley Hi from another IB medic parent (DD did IB in Brighton, if that's where you're based too).
My DD's tactic for UCAT was intense almost full time practise on Medify for a week at the start of summer hols, and then the test (she could have postponed the day before if she didn't feel ready, but she did, and it worked out well for her). So if your DC knows it's the kind of test that suits them, it's a tactic worth considering. IBers have an advantage on BMAT as they are still writing essays, so that might work in your DD's favour. Although we were very relieved that BMAT unis weren't on her list.
Another thing is that interviews often come at exactly the same time that you have to get lots of IAs and extended essay type work handed in, so the end of the 1st term of year 13 is INTENSE. Although a break during summer hols is obvious important, it's worth spending some time getting as up to date as possible on CAS reflections, EE draft, etc. so it doesn't all come at once in Nov/Dec.
@Monkey2001 Hi! Can't believe you've got to go through it all over again.... Good luck!

@menotastic - thanks for the IB perspective. We're in London not Brighton!

We have been told that IB can work well for a medical application because of the range of skills they have to keep up and the community element can double up for practical experience.

I need to keep an eye on the coursework timetable. DD has already started on Maths and History but I don't know when the other bits are coming. She's a perfectionist and I know she'll spend too much time on it.

Hi there. Hope you don't mind me joining. I have a DS applying for med this year and I am active on the current year's thread. However, I also have a second DC considering applying for 2023 entry. Non-medic family and this year has been a very steep learning curve as well as a very strange year to be applying. Happy to share any experience.

Welcome @opoponax

DD had an initial meeting about her medical school application plans yesterday. She's a bit sad to be strongly advised not to apply to Edinburgh as the odds for her (RUK plus independent school) are just too low and they say it's a waste of an application.

The advice is if she wants to apply for Oxford that's worth a punt but given the low odds of success there she can't risk another low odds choice.

She's sad as it's where DH and I met and she really likes the city. But she is a sensible girl and will take advice when it is from a reliable source.

Need to wait for Provisional Predicted Grades next week....

Edinburgh do not discriminate on school type (other than widening access). If she is predicted full marks in IB and gets over 3,000 band 1 on UCAT, it did not look so risky. I would not advise any RUK applicant without a band 1 to apply there. They have a great offer to interview ratio if she does get one. I think she should leave it on the list with a caveat that she will have to let it go if her UCAT is not very strong. Might be worth doing an FOI request on interview numbers and school types for RUK applicants. I would expect a lot of private and grammar as not many comprehensive kids get all top grades at GCSE (none at DS1's school with a 250 student cohort).

@sandybayley please get her to look at the course structures before applying. Oxford is very different as it's still academic for a few years so no seeing patients. Most other Unis have some degree of hands on placements earlier, some from first term. If she's happy with that then perfect. Just don't apply for the name. I will get my head bitten off by one poster (I always do) but no one cares where your medical degree is from. Each course is very different so choose the style she likes (CBL/PBL/integrated, does she want full body dissection etc).

sandybayley's DD seems to me to be ideally suited for an Oxford medical degree, from what sandybayley has said about her and speaking as someone who sees considerable merit in the Oxford structure of degree.

I would also think that a prospective medic with the top grades possible at GCSE and at the best school in the country almost certainly has the nous to have already checked out course structures.

Even accepting your long held view that a student's training and the sharp mind and scientific aptitude that tends to go with Oxbridge medics has no bearing whatever on a future career, the fact is that six years at Oxford, mostly Oxford based with far less trogging around for placements, and all the opportunities that Oxford brings in terms of extra curricular etc - well, not to be sneezed at. Obviously not an option for those with only six or seven top grades but certainly worth considering for those with ten or eleven Grade 9s.

Just throwing that in to counter the anti Oxbridge bias often seen on these threads. It's an annual affair :)

My DD is at Edinburgh, rest of UK and from an Independent school. Like Monkey I have never heard that the school you are coming from was part of the decision making in terms of getting an offer. Her UCAT was over 3100 and all GCSEs at A*. So a strong application overall.

Knew you'd be along @goodbyestranger 😂😂. I not anti Oxbridge at all. I just see so many parents (& schools who can put it in their marketing) push their kids down that path because it sounds prestigious. And a few students come back and say they wish they'd looked at the course more carefully. That's all. Not anti anywhere. Some course styles suit different students better.

I might as well weigh in then.

Absolute top tip. Practice UCAT, then practice some more. DD had strong academics, and strong extra-curricular/volunteering/shadowing, but a weak UCAT. She eventually got three interviews in March, and two offers, but she was very limited in where she might apply and had to be quite tactical. You have so much more choice and opportunity if you apply with a strong UCAT. UCAT is a timed test, so the more familiar you are the better.

On the Oxbridge/non Oxbridge thing. It depends where you want to end up. If you want to be a consultant in a leading teaching/research hospital, or want to keep options open, then Golden Triangle Universities should be considered, and indeed the learning approach may suit very academic DC better.

DD is very dyslexic with slow processing speeds, hence the poor UCAT. She was happy to get a place on a more hands on practical course. However she is using the scope to intercalate (ie take a year out to study something specialised www.intercalate.co.uk/) in London and feels that at the end of her six years she will be as well placed, if not better, as those from Oxbridge, at least in the area she wants to specialise in.

(Worth noting here that some medical schools restrict or forbid external intercalation.)

DDs experience, having attended two, is that medical degrees may be equal, but they are also different, and it is worth looking closely at approach.

I'm not really clear why as the mother of a medic rather further on in his training than your own DC, I shouldn't 'be along' mumsneedwine.

I would hope that there's something in the education that Oxford and Cambridge provide (which costs vastly more than even the current colossal fees, even for humanities students) which is of value over and above the brand name. It's a good brand, with substance. It's certainly made a very significant difference to my own DC.

To counter your own anecdote, I would say that my DS and the overwhelming majority of his friends and peer group at Oxford remain extremely glad that that's the one they chose.