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Higher education

Talk to other parents whose children are preparing for university on our Higher Education forum.

Original poster

Oxbridge Jealously

120 replies

eginma · 26/03/2019 09:52

I’m not sure if I just meet a fair amount of bat shit parents, or if it’s a wider problem..

DS is a 2nd year at Oxford, his choice, we didn’t force him into taking the offer.

Anyhow, ever since he got in, we’ve had snide comments such as
“They’re bending over backwards to let state schoolers in”
“What’s the point studying that? Why doesn’t he study Law/STEM?”

The best of all, my son got a call from Oxford on results day asking if he wanted a place for Economics, as he got AAA in his a levels, but he turned it down for Birmingham. My ds assures me from working as an admissions helper this is a load of tosh.

Why is it that other parents feel the need to be arsey about the whole thing? DS works in a public facing role and he’s now ashamed to say which uni he goes to if people ask ! He’ll skirt around the topic unless directly asked.

OP posts:
goodbyestranger · 26/03/2019 21:41

incl

BubblesBuddy · 26/03/2019 22:23

It is a strange though that the Brits are so poor at celebrating success. The rich are vilified, those doing PPE are vilified, those not doing Stem or Law are complete wasters, those who don’t deserve to be at Oxbridge because they went to independent schools are vilified because they have elbowed others out, the list goes on, and on, and on. Why is it that doing well isn’t allowed unless you come from a “working class “ background and have a tear jerking back story?

We need people to do well, earn loads and even become philanthropists while paying tax! Frankly I don’t care who they are, where they went to school or what university they go to as long as it meets their needs and they become economically active afterwards!

TacoLover · 26/03/2019 22:27

I think you're missing my point. I never suggested that unconditionals mean that a student is not academically able. I said that unconditionals mean nothing when comparing students; so if you compared two students, one would not be automatically above the other just because they have an unconditional offer. Unconditionals mean nothing when considering the academic ability of a student is what I'm saying, as most unconditionals are offered to fill spaces, not because a student is special...

ErrolTheDragon · 26/03/2019 22:48

Taco - I'm pretty sure Birmingham is an exception to that, afaik they do only make unconditional offers to students with very good predicted grades. The particular case oneteen was citing is Birmingham.

oneteen · 26/03/2019 23:34

It's not just Bham - It's Lancaster (who interview for unconditional offers) and I think York and Exeter too ...my niece had 3 maybe 4 Unconditional offers. Bham makes a fair few UC's but the others are the exception-so it is down to academics.

TacoLover · 27/03/2019 07:00

You've named 4 universities that give unconditionals for academic ability and said that they are the exception. That proves my point. They are the exception. The vast majority of unconditionals are given out to fill spaces. Hence why saying my DD got an unconditional offer means jack shit when seeing if she is better than any other student, because with the exception of a handful of universities, that offer was given out to get her bum on a seat.

Fazackerley · 27/03/2019 07:02

So what about getting an unconditional early in the process when other applicants do not?

Fazackerley · 27/03/2019 07:05

Not really sure why you feel the need to keep banging on about this tacolover
I am sure there are unis that use unconditionals to boost their intake, but who on earth would feel the need to point that out to proud parents and relatives!

Xenia · 27/03/2019 07:24

The huge number of unconditional offers in only the veyr last few years has been a big change which the universities are looking at and its impact is being considered. There usd to be very few of them including when my older 3 graduate children applied. Right back 30+ years ago when when oxbridge bad its own exams and people applied in "7th term" having returned to school after upper sixth to prepare for and six oxbridge there were unconditionals - the 2 Es offer because those people had done so well in the entrance exams and were very bright and wanted - even then it was dangerous as some of those people took their foot off the gas and got A level grades which hampered their career for years.

My sons are in year 2 at university. One of them only had an unconditional if firmed and it was from his "worst"/easiest to get into of his 5 - Nottingham (not that Nottingham is a bad university of course) and he didn't want that one anyway. His twin got no unconditionals. In the 2 years since then I think unconditionals have become more common due to fewer children this age and either a fight to fill seats at the bottom end even if that person might struggle at university or a fight to get the best people.

Anyway the bottom line for teenagers remains the same as ever - get into the best univesrity you can and do not slacken off on the A levels as the grades matter in many of the better paid jobs.

Hollowvictory · 27/03/2019 07:31

Unconditional offers are widely regarded as being bad for a level attainment. Case in point the poster whose son had an unconditional offer didn't do very well in his a levels and may not otherwise have got a uni place

oneteen · 27/03/2019 07:33

@TacoLover - I am not arguing (because it doesn't matter what I say you have your own fixed notion) but my nieces' unconditional offer was given out 4 years ago to entice her to that Uni because of her academic ability. I am sure that Bham Uni could fill their places at that time on the given course and it was a case of putting the RIGHT BUM on a seat - not just any - like I said earlier NOT ALL unconditional are worth Jack Shit.

PortusCale · 27/03/2019 07:34

A friend of mine has a DCwho has been given 2 unconditional offers. However, he wants to go to a different uni so I doubt he’ll accept. My friend was amazed, she says he’s not academic and has found the Btechs he’s studying challenging. She feels he should be looking at an apprenticeship rather than saddling himself with a huge student debt. It does seem that in some cases it’s very much a bums on seat process.

PortusCale · 27/03/2019 07:36

What I’m trying to say (rather uneloquently) is it in the university’s best interests to be enticing students with unconditionals or in the student’s best interests?

Fazackerley · 27/03/2019 07:37

Oxbridge did their '2 Es' thing years ago and were the only ones that did iirc.i remember being narked as my friend got one and I didn't. He was very rich from a successful media family and I was convinced that was why Grin anyway he's a household name now and has done very well for himself

Fazackerley · 27/03/2019 07:39

Dd would have loved an unconditional! No pressure. Didn't get one though. It put her nose out of joint when she joined a Facebook group for one of her potential unis and they were all saying they had unconditionals and she didn't have one Grin

scaevola · 27/03/2019 07:43

Agree, getting an unconditional offer is not a marker of academic prowess - it's an entirely neutral thing, which only means your predicted grades meet that course's requirements no it is a course where they want to get bums on seats as early as possible.

In the olden days, Oxford (and I think Cambridge too, possibly others) would occasionally make an 'unconditional' offer (actually EE, as that was the minimum required for matriculation) as an honour. I'm pretty sure that was dying out by about the 1980s, but it seems the legacy might be living on if people are still seeing today's totally different unconditionals in the same light.

VelvetSpoon · 27/03/2019 07:47

Oxbridge jealousy is nothing new...I was at Cambridge 1990-93, and have experienced loads of it over the years...teachers who told my parents I should aim lower/ be more realistic (because I was a kid from social housing whose parents worked in low wage jobs), other people's parents who thought I'd been given a place not on merit but because I was poor Hmm, even when I started work I used to get comments referring to me as the one from Cambridge, not said in a good way. Or questions like how DID I get a place...etc.

I have spent years avoiding mention of it in RL, most people I know or work with now have no idea, which makes life easier.

Xenia · 27/03/2019 07:47

I wonder if it culd be sojme kind of mis-selling in that case for those who perhaps might be better off not going to university at all, although if they never earn much they don't pay back a penny so I suppose they have suffered no loss other than losing 3 years of wages I suppose (or gained 3 years of drinking time depending on how you look at it).

oneteen · 27/03/2019 07:55

From Bham's website :
Unconditional Offer Scheme 2019
In 'Undergraduate courses'
Search A-Z of courses
Arts and Law
Engineering and Physical Sciences
Life and Environmental Sciences
Medical and Dental Sciences
Social Sciences
How to apply
Unconditional Offer Scheme 2019
Back to 'Undergraduate'
This scheme allows us to target the very brightest students in certain subject areas, who demonstrate exceptional academic performance in their schooling to date, taking into consideration the views of their current institution and teachers. It provides them with an unconditional offer to continue their academic career at Birmingham, if they make Birmingham their firm choice.

oneteen · 27/03/2019 07:58

Lancaster :

Lancaster University Unconditional Offer Scheme
At Lancaster University we are proud of our reputation for academic excellence and we want to encourage applicants with outstanding academic profiles to study at Lancaster. The Unconditional Offer Scheme enables us to demonstrate to exceptional students our belief that they will continue to excel by choosing to study with us. An offer for a place on our Unconditional Offer Scheme will be made to applicants who have the strongest academic profiles in terms of existing qualifications and predicted grades. Personal statements and references will also be taken into account and, for some courses, an interview will form part of the assessment. The eligibility criteria for the Unconditional Offer Scheme will vary across departments as requirements for specific courses differ. The unconditional offer will be confirmed once a selected applicant has made Lancaster their firm choice on UCAS.

TheWayOfTheWorld · 27/03/2019 07:59

Jealousy, insecurity, envy... I went to Cambridge and got snippy comments from one of my school friends about how Oxbridge really wasn't for him, he could have gone if he'd wanted but the university he went to was much better for the course he wanted.

Never mind that he didn't get the required grades... Hmm

I could understand this attitude if I'd been a terrible show off about it, but I wasn't Confused

TheWayOfTheWorld · 27/03/2019 08:01

And for what it is worth, I was at a state school and was the first to go to university (first to do exams!) so it was a huge deal for me.

Fazackerley · 27/03/2019 08:02

Oneteen Smile that's good info to have.

Fazackerley · 27/03/2019 08:03

tacolover I think you owe oneteen an apology!

anniehm · 27/03/2019 08:05

Never heard that, here there's a bit of anti university sentiment in certain parts of the city, causing a lot of problems for teachers trying to help bright kids from such homes but once they go there's no specific anti oxbridge