Anyone's DC going to Uni in USA???

[Cblue]

Hi all

Has anyone's DC applied/gone to USA Universities in the last few years?

DD in Y11 very keen so we are off to Boston/NYC to see some Unis.

Reading up on it, it seems like there are some good bursaries and scholarships open to International students at the Ivy Leagues which would make it viable.
Do any of the lesser Unis have the same?

We have been to the Fulbright University Fair in London and that just made her even more determined.

Has anyone got any tips??
And has anyone else done it!??

Thanks

Oh, @Cblue, another option for studying in the States, or anywhere, is summer schools.

I did a few, they look crazy amazing on CV, the universities aren't fussy about entry qualifications as it doesn't affect their league table scoring and it brings in money, so it's easy to take the courses so long as you can pay. It's then the same modules as are taught during the term time, just much more quickly.

I did some at LSE, in the first year level course there were people who were freshmen level from the States through to people with degrees already. Lots of courses. It cost about £3500k for six weeks, two modules. Seriously worth it. Can do one module if prefer.

Harvard has distance classes, watch lectures online from anywhere, the students taking the classes are physically there.

I also did Columbia New York summer school, that's intense but again, fall of chair bonus points on CV. Similar prices to LSE.

She can do these in her summers if funds allow, it really adds to CV.

Adjunct professor at one university. But my main job is international ed/study abroad. I find the drinking culture to be very similar (just hidden) and the drug culture much more intense.

Professor here, full focus on that. Several universities as student, TA and professor, UK and USA.

That's my experience described above, it includes NYC. Students in dorms I think is a good thing in the big cities. Housing is insane and some places are dangerous. Closer to campus and library means it's easier for them to get to class and they spend way more time in the library.

Full focus on what?

"and the drug culture much more intense"...what in the US?

Unless the oxytocin problem is more widespread than I had realised, I think you would be surprised at the extent of drug use on some UK campuses. And the lack of supervision/pastoral care ("18 year olds are adults") appears to make it more difficult to keep a lid on.

Asian friends often ask for my advice when deciding to send their DC to the UK. There are several places I suggest they avoid, knowing, as in LuMaries point 5 they want to go somewhere where they can get the education they are paying heavily for.

@SofiaAmes
You said you went to Fordham. What was it like? It says it's Jesuit - does that impact on student life?

Asian students were swapping horror stories with DD. Their parents have saved very hard to send them to the UK, often because their own parents were UK educated. They are sociable but also there to get a good degree. Oddly London seemed to work, with British students willing both to mix and to put their heads down. Oxbridge, Buckingham and Ireland were also liked. Concerns were mainly about big shared flats where no one washed up, and where freshers week lasted most of the first term. Liverpool and Birmingham had picked up bad reputations amongst the people we knew, but I suspect unless overseas students were careful in choosing accommodation that suited their lifestyles, other places would as well. it comes up often on this board, with some Universities, touted as having an "amazing" social life, also seeming to lack superivsion and care.

I also work with large numbers of postgraduate students. The above would be very similar to the feedback I receive.

@Candyflip

Full focus on teaching and research

@Cblue - we looked at Fordham for DS and I have known many Fordham graduates. It is a not an overtly religious atmosphere and students of any faith or no faith would feel fully welcome.

@pallisers - good luck with your DD. If she's a rising senior she must already be working on the common app and her essays. I'm glad your son likes Northeaster, it's a fine school. My son wanted something a little smaller and less urban, so he's off to Endicott College in Beverly, MA this fall. He can hop on a train and be in Boston in 25 minutes so he'll probably wind up doing his internships in the city.

On the whole drinking and drugs issue, every college we look at offered what they call "health living" housing, which is what my son selected. No smoking, no illegal drugs, no alcohol, strictly enforced. So a more controlled environment is available for the students who want it.

pallisers - one more thing which you almost certainly know already, it is very important to get most of the applications in during the early action period. There is a very strong trend among colleges to award most of their places to people who apply then rather than latter at the normal deadline. Acceptance rates are much higher for early action applicants and thousands of kids who waited until January wound up wait listed with a very low chance of getting in.

www.npr.org/sections/ed/2018/04/05/599755974/college-waitlists-often-waste-would-be-students-time

@MissConductUS
That is very useful to know. Thank you

Abi, yes. On some levels I can see why academics resist the idea that higher education is a consumer market, but perhaps most would accept that seen from an Asian perspective it is. It is a huge investment, and you want your DC to have enjoyed their time in the West, gained a broader perspective (and worth noting that dispora Chinese are often looking for something different from mainland Chinese but risk getting stuck with the same stereotype) but emerge with a degree which gives them a head start in the careers race.

A number of English Universities increasingly depend on income from overseas students. They pay their Vice Chancellors handsomely, in part because they are supposed to understand the evolution of the international student market. And yet the offer, if seen from the eyes of an 18 year old and their parents, or even a PG, may seem woefully short. Especially at those Universities that do not offer the equivalent of "health living".

The Guardian www.theguardian.com/education/durhamuniversity has an article about the problems caused by Durham's expansion. The same article could probably be written about other Universities. Tertiary education is an international field and Asian (and increasingly British - DS and a lot of his friends will have spent at least part of their education abroad, with two of the brightest being lured to National University of Singapore) applicants will be being courted by the US, Australia, Canada, elsewhere in Asia as well as the UK.

There is a theory about investing in products you believe in. Parents are, effectively, investing in Universities. I would happily invest in the LSE. I think they understand their market, their constraints and their USP. I am not sure that I would invest in a quite a number of other UK Universities, nor indeed in a number of US colleges. Specifically 18 year olds are trainee adults. Not to provide some supervision, or at least ensure their safety, is madness. DD has coped because we are in the same country. I would not recommend sending a student from the oher side of the world to her University.

What perhaps University administrators may not understand is that many overseas students come from a small number of international schools. Their parents may not be super rich. My friends are doctors, academics, journalists and employees of multi-national firms. They are making real sacrifices for their children's education. Their schools will understand this and steer students towards education systems and establishments where they think students will thrive. And that decisions made by Asian parents are increasingly replicated by European parents who will increasingly take an international view when considering Universities.

And OP sorry about the thread hijack,. I hope though, that it will reveal some useful compare and contrast.

Especially at those Universities that do not offer the equivalent of "health living".

My apologies for the typo, it should have been "healhy living".

Almost all college we looked at guarantee on campus housing to any student who wants it but allow the option of living off campus for the last two years.

I went to Fordham 30+ years ago and even back then religion was not at all a part of the education. I am a "devout" atheist so would have definitely noticed and/or been turned off if it had.

Needmoresleep has much great wisdom and information about US/UK education. And it is very accurate to my experience for my friends' dc's going to uni and my exh who went to Leeds as a mature student. The UK students seemed to drink their way through Uni, while the US students took their studies more seriously. Also important to note that financial aid (including need based) is often predicated on keeping up a pretty strong grade point average.

Another "summer school" worth looking at is UCLA Extension. They offer university level classes, but anyone can attend without an application procedure. It was originally designed for adults who were interested in learning a subject at a sophisticated level, but without enrolling back at University. I used to take classes there all the time. These days, I'm told, many foreign students do a large chunk of their degree taking classes there as you get University credit (and can get a student visa), but don't have to apply in advance.

P.S. Don't forget about the student visa process, which could take some time.

P.P.S. If you want to look at any schools in Los Angeles, please feel free to PM me for advice.

@Cblue

That is very useful to know. Thank you

I just realized you were referring to the advice about applying to early action, and not my answer to your question about the Jesuits at Fordham. God it's awful getting old and slow!

Thank my son's college counselor, who was worth way more than she charged us. She worked with DS for an hour every weekend last summer going over everything, helping him refine his common app answers, rethinking his essays, etc. So when his first quarter grades were in last fall everything else had already been submitted and the letters started coming in about a month later. He had all of his letters well before Christmas and he got into 8 of the 9 colleges he applied to.

When I asked her why she worked so hard to make sure he was at the front of the queue she explained that schools were taking more early action applicants as a way of managing their "yield" - the number of candidates who accept the offer. It lowers the risk that they'll miss their enrollment goal, a real risk in that the number of applicants in the US has been falling for the last few years simply due to birth rate trends.

By the way, I'm fairly sure she works with international students via Skype. She's sharp as a tack and my son really liked working with her. She's a lovely person too. We already have her working with DD. Anyone who wants her website address can PM me.

early action is definitely the way most kids are going. I had a parent say to me several years ago "my neighbor's kid didn't know where he was going until March!" That was when most kids found out back in the day.

But people also need to understand that early action is different to early decision which binds you to a contract.

All of these are discriminatory on some level to students who are going to rely on financial aid - you put in for early decision/action without knowing what your aid package will be - that is a big risk. The merit money thing is also a way to swing the game toward middle class kids (I say this as someone who has middle class kids).

By the way, these days "middle class" kids are getting and relying on financial aid too.

By the way, these days "middle class" kids are getting and relying on financial aid too.

I guess I am talking about how merit money and early decision/action skews toward richer kids then. Because it does.

OP, I live in a country where sending your child abroad for further education is the norm for many. It’s just the way it is and for eg I had four of mine in the UK and Australia whilst a lot of their friends and familiy went to the states. We funded it ourselves in total as do most of the people we know but some of the children who went to the States received some kind of help once there. It was offered and whilst not much it was really appreciated. It does become much better at MA and PhD level though as someone else said.

I don’t have any practical help to offer you re the States but what I did want to say is don’t do this unless you can afford to do it without help. It’s a huge financial undertaking and will always end up costing more than you planned. You really do need to be thinking we can do this on our own without worrying and if helps available then all well and good. Please don’t go into it based on it only happening if good financial help is available and you topping up.

My dad planned to remortgage the house if I got into Ivy League.
I think my aunt & her husband remortgaged to send their kid out of state (she followed a boyfriend there). These parents are 56yo or so; they'll expect to work until they drop.

My dad planned to remortgage the house if I got into Ivy League.

It's not the ticket to success most people think it is. You can study accounting, engineering or nursing almost anywhere and get a good job. You can study art history or psychology at an Ivy League school and wind up working at Starbucks.

www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/04/what-is-an-elite-college-really-worth/521577/

These researchers tracked two groups of students—one that attended college in the 1970s and another in the early 1990s. They wanted to know: Did students attending the most elite colleges earn more in their 30s, 40s, and 50s than students with similar SAT scores, who were rejected from those elite colleges? The short answer was no. Or, in the author's language, the difference between the students who went to super-selective schools and the students with similar SAT scores who were rejected from those schools and went to less selective institutions was "indistinguishable from zero.”

What does that mean, exactly? It means that, for many students, "who you are” as an 18-year-old is more important than “where you go.” After correcting for a student’s pre-existing talent, ambition, and habits, it's hard to show that highly selective colleges add much earning power, even with their vaunted professors, professional networks, and signaling. If you’re one of the roughly 50,000-100,000 students who is sweating a decision from one of these tony schools, you’re focused on the wrong thing. The decision of a group of people you’ve never met isn’t as important as the sum of the decisions, habits, and relationships you’ve built up to this point in your young life.

Sorry posted on wrong thread. Will get it removed.

Sorry posted on wrong thread. Will get it removed.

No harm no foul. Perhaps you need more sleep.