Open days - what attracts you? What puts you off?

[shovetheholly]

I'm interested in hearing about your experiences of open days!

What attracts you and your DS/DD to a course or a place? What puts you off? What kind of information is it good to receive about the course? How much does the city/town of the university matter? How significant are job prospects later on to your decision? Do open days always confirm what you already think, or has one changed your mind (either positively or negatively)?

Am asking because we rarely get honest feedback from parents on the day (for obvious reasons), and I'd love to hear what you REALLY think... and get a sense of what we can do better.

I said 'senior staff' as I think it was the presence or otherwise of these which was the issue, not the ranks of untenured staff.

But it isn't "senior staff"" versus "junior staff" which is the issue for many students: students often want to talk to whoever is lecturing a specific module or whoever will be doing the interviews for a particular degree programme. It may well be that it is a "junior staff" member that they want to talk to, but that junior staff member has no reason to put a lot of effort into (unpaid) open days when they are on a fixed term contract.

BTW there is no such thing as tenure in the UK.

Interesting thread. I've been to quite a few of these with successive dcs and I've just asked ds2.

We both agreed a sales pitch about the city/ nightclubs per square mile/ access to the M1 is not helpful. We have google map, thanks.

Whizzy presentations or taster sessions about the subject make the day fun but need to be related to the syllabus actually studied at that uni. e.g. this is what all our first year students do in week 3 and not just a fun thing to do only vaguely connected with the subject. (One subject talk we went to really inspired ds until he found that the guy giving the talk wasn't even a lecturer at the uni, but a bought-in marketing bod for the session).

They wanted more in depth information about the syllabus e.g. if you say you cover the life cycle of the 3 toed sloth in the first year, what does that include, how is it taught, how is it tested?

The most useful info for a school kid looking round a uni is what we heard least about - what it's actually like being a student doing that subject in that uni , what does a 'normal day' look like in that department for a first year? They are trying to imagine themselves in this place, having no experience of university and concerns may be as straightforward as how would I get from halls to lectures, what actually happens in a tutorial, what happens if I get stuck etc.

The worst open day resulting in a blazing row with ds mid campus was the one where the uni advertised a free shuttle bus to the station and omitted to mention that the bus only went a few times a day and did not have the capacity to cope with the long queues, resulting in a long wait only to be told the next bus was 2 hours later.

I recently attended open days with DD and did some with older DD. What we liked

-Not too crowded and clear timetable
-Hot drinks/refreshments provided (many have travelled long way and haven't had time to grab coffee etc)
-Sample lecture, really gave DD a flavour of the uni and lecturers
-current students to talk to and focus on the students not the parents
-useful if interviews take place on applicant days
-clear over view of programme and modules

user3615 - and there you have it: families perceive that a university education is an expensive investment and they believe that universities should make information (including access to academics) available that will enable them to make a proper assessment of the offer.

The level of access may well be incompatible with the financial reality of the academics themselves.

Personally, I find some of the marketing techniques adopted by UK universities overseas, in particular for those courses designed to capture lucrative international students, distasteful and inappropriate. The British Council, in particular, comes across as a sort of package tour travel agency.

Haffdonga. I do think that wanting precise detail about modules on an open day is not really possible or indeed desirable. It tends to show that prospective students want a continuation of A level style thinking where everything is spelt out for them regarding how to get top marks. Why is that level of detail necessary? It seems as though the lecturers must do everything they can to ensure students get 1sts and have everything to suit. No university will be able to tick every minute box. Surely the fact that the three toed sloth is an option, and presumably taught by an expert on a three toed sloth should be adequate? Would a marking scheme really make the difference between one university and another? Offer days are for going into a bit more detail!

One aspect of going to university that is overlooked is happiness. So many threads on MN are related to the difficulties of living with students that are not like you. Not wanting to give up because the course is not what you thought, the three toed sloth marking scheme was a total nightmare or even that the three toed sloth lecturer went on maternity leave when you had set your heart on it - these difficulties appear rare. It is the personalities and the "personality" of the university that matter a great deal.

Lastly, if you are an arts graduate, the need to be self-reliant and able to do research in your non contact time is paramount. As is meeting deadlines, ability to discuss opinions and be sufficiently organised to do the work needed. University can add a great deal to even the most confident student. It can give opportunities to run clubs, join societies, and even organise a ball! Something like that is a terrific advert for organisational skills and DD found employers liked the fact she could multi-task! University can also make you reassess what career you might like. There are so many opportunities to talk to employers if your university attracts them. As I have said before, at no time was DD asked about her university modules. It is highly likely the three tied sloth option could be of little interest to anyone other than yourself! That's fine, but obsessing about modules will not make you employable. It is work/volunteer experience and transferable skills that matter for arts graduates, not what you think about the literature of the three toed sloth and his life and times!

All three of my DC who did stem subjects were interested in the modules offered on their courses. ( There were spreadsheets involved for one of them 😂) They were an important part of why they chose their particular courses. Courses such as engineering or comp sci vary an awful lot from Uni to Uni. I'm not suggesting that my DC knew exactly what everything was or that they already knew precisely what modules they were interested but knowing what was on offer was definitely important.

One of my DC studies maths and wasn't sure at all what she would be interested in or, indeed, quite what some of the modules would involve but it was still interesting for her to see how the different universities differed.

All of my kids had done taster courses in the subjects that they went on to study at university (London Uni Taster Days, Headstart etc) which really helped them understand the type of things they were looking for. I'm sure the reason they are all so settled and happy at university is that they put a lot of time into researching their options.

I think there's a difference between giving precise module info and an idea of what being on the course is actually like. Some of that stuff will be on the web but giving students an idea of a typical first year week shouldn't be difficult if subject specific talks.

Bojo I take your point that the uni couldn't and wouldn't want to be specific about mark schemes and exact module content etc. That's not really what I meant. It's more that just giving a name of a module or topic area doesn't really give any feel for what in depth study of it might involve.

So rather than just telling students, in year 1 we cover 3 toed sloths and curtain design give a flavour of what studying this might actually involve them doing. e.g. ^In year 1, students study the life cycle of a 3 toed sloth. They'll be given a variety of referencing sources and then work in groups to present an interpretive dance on an aspect of the sloth's behaviour. Last year one group analysed the mating call of the male sloth by bla bla bla etc.

I think giving a flavour is best done in a sample lecture - however I also think having a reasonable level of info is important but clearly impossible to meet all needs all of the time re details.

Obviously having a look at different universities brings out the differences. There are differences in arts courses too. However I still think just looking at the course is only part of the picture. Does your DC actually think they will be happy at this university with students like them? (Or enough students like them!). The overall picture may outweigh one issue with the curriculum. It is interesting that ReapandSow's DC researched before going to an open day. That makes sense to me. My DDs did that too.

As DH employs engineering graduates there is a huge difference in their skills too! Some courses spoon feed the students so they cannot work anything out for themselves - work is the real world and problems have to be solved: quickly! Time is money! Few prospective students will have the faintest idea of how to judge the quality of graduates a course produces!

The most useful info for a school kid looking round a uni is what we heard least about - what it's actually like being a student doing that subject in that uni , what does a 'normal day' look like in that department for a first year? They are trying to imagine themselves in this place, having no experience of university and concerns may be as straightforward as how would I get from halls to lectures, what actually happens in a tutorial, what happens if I get stuck etc

This.

The most useful thing my DD did was spend two days student shadowing, so she had an insight into what a normal day was like ( She knows she was lucky to have that opportunity).

I'm not sure if the average 6th former knows what a tutorial actually is, what's involved,etc. How many hours of lectures and labs they might have per week and how long you spend before and after. It would be good to explain some of this . Or even have an undergraduate student do this. A typical week if you like.

And before anyone points it out, yes I'm sure that all your kids who went to public school have been doing this since they were 7, have been giving tutorials since they 9 and writing articles for peer reviewed journals since they were 11. But the vast majority of applicants haven't.

bojo - prospective students are unlikely to be able to judge the calibre of graduates of the courses they are looking at best but parents sometimes can!

Parents will find this difficult if they are not in that line of work themselves! It makes a huge difference though regarding future prospects.

Umm Kr1tina - my dds went to boarding school - they did none of the things you mention! In fact - who does? Mine never had a chance to shadow anyone at a university! Not that they wanted to or needed to really!

I agree that parents need to be in some sort of related field but the truth is that many prospective students pick disciplines that are quite close to their parents' interests and/or professions. And many 50 year olds are used to working with all sorts of teams and clients and are quite good at sizing people up!

err Kr1stina, my dd went to a comprehensive school. Let's not turn this into a independent v state sector argument, its very boring. However you are right, the number two thing after 'is this the course I want to do' should be 'is this the way I want to spend each week?' and unless you know what that week looks like its a difficult question to answer.

I graduated 5 years ago so I feel like I'm still closer to the prospective student experience than the 'parent' experience...

I remember as a sixth former wandering around on open days these were the 2 main things that appealed to me:

1. Looking at the student accommodation: cheap and expensive... I found it so exciting!

2. Having a chat with friendly students, this made a massive difference, it's a scary time and knowing the students there are friendly makes you feel less worried about fitting in/settling in there.

Was less interested in the course itself

Crunchyside - interest in the courses themselves increases in line with the increase in fees.

" BTW I think that a lot of the contact hour questions are driven by coverage in the media. They don't tend to come from parents who themselves studied at university and who understand how degrees work."

Re my previous post - this in spades. ds has ( on paper) very few contact hours. As far as he is concerned and from what he has told me about - the time he does get is very high quality. For his degree the time he gets is entirely appropriate and more so - i.e. he gets a deal of face to face time with people very expert in his areas of study. He is more than happy with that. But if you just divided the tuition fee by his contact hours - no it wouldn't look perfect. Actually he thinks it is really good. I do too.

The obvious thing to point out do we really still have to say this? is that tuition fees pay for:
The library, the books , and all the electronic resources
The health and counselling services
All the buildings and their equipment and maintenance
Security staff
Sports centre
Grounds
Subsidy of the Student Union or Guild, and related student services
Bursaries and scholarships
Overseas exchanges

Not just the hours of face to face teaching

Virgils, I hope my point was clear in that DS has relatively low contact hours. That is just fine by him as the ones he gets are high quality and appropriate. I do appreciate that the fees pay for very many things. Sorry if your post wasn't to me.

The DSSs have both needed to pay for sports separately, on top of fees. And not negligeable amounts.

Crunchjy, good points. My sons' school has some boys who left just last year and are at university who came round last term to the school (not an open day) and I think they found that very useful indeed (although apparently all the UCL boys who came back to the school to report which I imagine was only about 2 or 3 said they didn't like it there . So do get unreasonable biased views I suppose which is a pity as UCL is really good. They probably just found they were not very far from home as are within the M25).

This is almost why I hope mine don't go to the interviews (one has booked one only) as they get perhaps some really random thing that happens that day and it puts them off (eg my daughter thinking Durhma is religious because of something that happened on a visit)

EnormousTiger - my DSS2 is at UCL. He really likes it but he is extremely robust. It wouldn't have suited DSS1 (who went to Bristol) and I can already see that it is unlikely to suit DD. We have several friends whose DC have gone to UCL and are not or have not been especially happy. This has nothing to do with the quality of the course, as far as I can understand.

UCL is really good. I was just using it as a random example of how something someone says might put some people off. Just because a particular boy there now goes back to school and is slightly negative these other boys might think less of it. It is possible partly because the boys already live near London anyway and plenty of them have parents who want them to live at home for cultural reasons so university does not become quite the exciting leaving home experience at UCL still living at home with your parents and grandparents as it might be if you went somewhere which involved living away!

I also agree that, if you have been brought up in London, going to university there means that you miss out on the change of scene. I just think, going on my observations, that UCL doesn't seem as friendly as some universities.