As a parent, do you feel your DC's Uni "should" communicate with you?

[UnexpectedItemInShaggingArea]

A general question really, I work for a uni and we regularly get complaints from parents that we should have told them stuff.

But, the student is an adult and the contract is between the student and the university, even if parents are paying the fees/living allowance.

In some cases we would be breaking confidentiality by informing parents (e.g. Health issues), in others, I just think it's odd that parents get involved (e.g. student not picked for sports team).

Would appreciate some views/experiences

I don't think that UpTheChimney seems unapproachable- she seems to be approached a lot because she states that she always asked distressed students if they have spoken to their parents BUT that it is not her job to go over the heads of adults. I expect she comes over rather strongly because she gets stuck with parents thinking it is an extension of school when it is not- it must be highly irritating on a day to day basis.

until your child actually leaves home you can't be sure how well have you have prepared them. You can do all the right things in terms of gradually increasing independence, trips away from home, making them handle problems themselves with you as back-up to be called on when needed but you don't know what they will face when they get to university. And the continual repetition of these are adults when they may be immature adults does not encourage them to seek help when needed.

For those who went to university there may also be memories of disinterested or out-of-their depth tutors and a lack of support when needed. I remember my own tutor saying he had no idea how to help with problems. I didn't have any real expectation that he would but some friends were luckier with their tutors.

This thread prompted me to talk to my teenager about an older friend who had problems at university and if mine would involve me in a similar situation. The response was I dont see what parents could do to help. Initially I couldn't either but later I came up with a few suggestions that would not compromise their independence. So perhaps my teen will be readier to involve me in future :)

Maybe there should be a booklet of common university problems and how parents can prepare their child for them - mumsnet's next publication?

I think you need a chat before they go- I said whatever the problem we were always here and if he didn't like the course, couldn't cope with the work etc he could tell us. Failure isn't the 'end of the world'
I think they need that 3/4 yrs to grow up, solve their own problems, particularly if the parent has always solved it for them. It is a time they can do it, with a parent in the background to consult and places to seek help in university.
DS has now gone through- he starts work in London next week. He doesn't know anyone and we will be off the radar as far as his employer is concerned. He needed that independence at university in preparation.
DS had an apprenticeship and even though he was 16yrs and living at home we had nothing from either the employer or college. It was very good for him.

I don't know what other Uni's offer parents but the Uni my DS attends has already taken on board alreadytaken's comments and has dedicated publications/part of their website designed specifically for parents covering everything from the application process to student support.

They appear to recognise that most undergraduates are fairly immature adults who are often embarking on a first prolonged period living away from home, sometimes hundreds of miles away from the support mechanisms they are used to.

Good post exoticfruits

upthechimney, I thought you gave detailed and useful information about what support was available. And I don't think name calling adds anything useful to what has been a generally enlightening thread

I didn't avail of support when I was at Uni, not because of any particular failings on anyone's part, but because I was too busy chasing boys and drinking too much... It was useful to get a low 2:2 at the end of first year because it made me realise that I had to work a lot harder.

Sometimes students fail because they just don't work hard enough, or they don't have the aptitude. It's no ones fault.

Believe me, I've worked with quantities of not very good tutors and academics who really don't want to deal with students, and I'd be very surprised if upthechimney is one of them. Look at the detail in her posts, just for starters. But I think what she is getting at is the immense frustration that comes from putting together the best possible set up for students to learn and improve in, e.g. Feedback, office hours, personal support etc, and then the students not taking advantage of what is offered. And this is made worse when students then claim that these things have not been made available to them, or parents complain about not getting value for money based on their dcs sometimes partial account of the facts.

Yes I agree, why do so many MN threads degenerate into slagging matches when the topic raised is so relevant and interesting????

Like you rhetorician - have worked with and known many academics who really don't see students as their bread and butter and their 'pastoral' skills are totally non existent. There will always be students who sail through with little or no help or input, whom you never see, and there are students who do struggle, need input and nurturing, often for prolonged periods, sometimes for a short while. The OP was about whether or not Unis should communicate with parents especially if their children are one of the 'strugglers'. Surely the issue is, if Unis are not to communicate with parents, they must signpost 'help', 'supporters' or whatever at the outset of the students academic career at the institution, so the students can be confident about who to approach, when and what for, so they can best manage the help and support they seek. ( I would stress AGAIN that it is very often these students who are the least able and equipped to actively seek help... so then what? The Unis MUST come up with a coherent and visible strategy so all students and staff are aware of their responsibilities.

).

guineapiglet totally agree

Surely part if growing up is realising that some tutors are useless at pastoral care?
The way I see it is that at school the DC themselves should be taking responsibility, but the parent is the backup and they will be phoned or emailed if the DC is getting into difficulty, e.g not meeting deadlines. The parent will get feed back.
University is a step further, the DC takes responsibility and if they have difficulties they should turn to the parent, or the tutor, to signpost them to the right channel. The university should have counselling services etc and realise that young people can be vulnerable away from home for the first time and some will find it difficult. They should recommend the DC confides in the parent but they can't force it and they shouldn't go over their heads. The parents may be the problem.
Employment is the final step and the DC really is on their own- if they want help they will have to find it for themselves or confide in the parent. The employer will not factor in the parent.
The university is the step between the two and if you treat the student as a child, at that point, they won't cope. You need to have done the groundwork before university. If they have got their exams because you supervised the revision, bribed to get good grades and kept them to deadlines - they will have problems. If you stepped in to solve all problems they will have problems.

No, I wouldn't. She is at college now (age 17) and during her first year I had one simple one line report and an offer to a parents evening. That stops when she is 18. I'm happy with that and expect Uni to be even more remote.

I suppose some parents see Uni as private education, given how much they are often forking out for it!

One of the biggest problems we have is that the support services are there, but students won't access them. My completely unscientific opinion on it is that there is a sense that its a bit pathetic or wimpy to have to ask for help, the whole mentality is that you have to go and you have to enjoy it and it had to be the most amazing time if your life, and to admit that you need help is to say that you are a failure.

Certainly there were times as a student when I could have done with extra help, and I knew it was available, but I wouldn't ask for it.

But at least the support services are there. DS starts his job on Monday- as yet he hasn't even got a place to live. He will be in London and he doesn't know a single person- he has no idea if he will get a social life through work, whether he will be able to make friends through living with like minded people or whether he will have to go out and find a way of meeting people. He will not have a support service on tap.

When you go to university you know that hundreds will be in exactly the same boat and actively looking for friends. You share houses, you have the shared interest of the course, you have fresher's week with a whole host of clubs etc. you are signposted to where to go for support. Tutors are sympathetic that you are away from home, quite likely for the first time, and may find it hard.
With all that in place it is a good time to cut the apron strings- parents are still there in the background for advice and support but I can't see that going over the student's head and discussing problems with the parent is beneficial. My DS has had 3 yrs of coping alone, solving his problems and getting a good degree and it stands him in much better stead for life alone in London. If university was like boarding school, without the rules, he would have problems. The apron strings have to be cut then- unravel them slowly though childhood and accelerate through university and you end up with a sensible, fully functioning adult- or at least it is more likely than brutally cutting them at 21yrs -unless of course you get them back home in childhood mode-( maybe that is what some people want).

When my 16yr old got his apprenticeship we went to a talk at the college for future students and parents. We didn't have any further contact with the college. We never met his employer- there was no contact. The contact was between DS, his employer and the college. DS did extremely well and grew up. If that is the norm with 16yr olds I can't see why it has to be different for 18yr olds.

exoticfruits he might be interested in www.meetup.com/londongraduates/

and www.londonivc.com/

www.citysocializer.com/?frm=Google%20Ads&gclid=CNem0IitkLgCFVDJtAodXDYAxA

and there are probably others as well as internet based ways to meet people.

Parents still have a role in suggesting things there young adults haven't found yet

Thank you so much- just because I advocate letting go doesn't mean I stop worrying! That is brilliant and I will give him the links.

When you pass a judgement on students you need to apply the same standard, terms and conditions to yourself when you studied. You studied in different times with opportunity. I am certain all or most of the adults posting here studied before the introduction of university fees in 1998 15 years ago. So most of you had no fees to pay which had been a wonderfull situation but today it is an nightmare to have to pay 9K a year for 4 years and still not to know if you will find a job at the end. 15 years ago people had a very good time and good economic prospects. Those good prospects are not any more here for our DCs. Those good times were called 'property boom during the Labour' - remember the national debt was falling - Mr Blair do u hear us?. These are gone times. Labour had a constant budget surplus for the first 4 years - good for all. Today we have still a deficit which is rising and a tripple downturn in the economy. Check my figures. House prices since 15 years ago started to rise at around 10 per cent a year and unemployment was at an all time low. If you had bought a property then in 5 years it had doubled the value. Many students had bought flats with somebody else, it was usual in SE London. Almost everybody with a degree could get into the housing ladder from the start. Not today. Today there is no prospect for students to buy any property until parents contribute. Many students live with mom & Dad and in the same single room they were at home.. There is high unemployment and few jobs.

For those boom days it is our students who pay the big price for all the spending of the previous older generation - they will pay your pensions and NHS treatment.

Give them young students a chance and a break from criticism. They are the fewer in our population and their cohort becomes ever smaller. They will be paying your pensions. IMO they are all admirable young people.

You'd think they'd be a bit keener to turn up and do the work, given all that, wouldn't you?

at TheOriginalSteamingNewt!

mariscal - just coming back to reply to your post (I'm malenky upthread).

Erm, no.

I did not escape fees.

I'm still paying them. Like all the other PhD students who teach at university. And my job prospects are not especially lovely, no.

I don't follow why you think people would judge students differently? Are you currently a student paying fees? How many years have you paid them? As many as the PhDs and junior lecturers who started out paying them? As many as the first cohort on the 9k fees, who've just started teaching as PhD students?

I don't know anyone who's my age who wouldn't agree with everything the grown-up academics on this thread have said about students needing to do the communicating themselves and needing to be responsible. If anything some of us would be harsher (not me, I hope).

So I really don't think your point is valid.

Gah. Must learn not to post when irritated.

The first cohort on the 9k degree (2004 onwards) not 9k the recent one, which would require truly spectacular progress for anyone to be teaching yet. Sorry.

Dear God

As a parent of teenagers I am absolutely longing for them to get to University when I will no longer be responsible for them.

Don't get me wrong, I'll pay for them and send them on their way with a box of condoms. But please, no letters home. No reports. No parents' evenings. I truly do NOT WANT TO KNOW.

Seriously if any university ever gets in touch with me, I will be flipping fuming.

The way it has worked in my family over the years is that if a parent is worried about their child at Uni, it gets round the Older Member Family Grapevine. An uncle or aunt or older cousin 'finds themselves' in the area of the University in question "sometime next week", contacts the student and invites them out to lunch or dinner.

We are a large family with relatives dotted all around the world. When a younger member leaves home for either Uni or work, then the family members living closest will simply let them know that if they ever want lunch, advice, safe place to rest their head, anything, then this is their address. Actual specific invitations might be issued, but generally the feeling is that the person is best trusted to find their own feet. However, if the parents are worried then invitations can be issued.

You don't know any of this stuff until you are yourself older, of course!

I'm cynical about the way this thread is going. Students=baddies who are lazy and dont turn up to lectures etc, tutors=goodies who spend every waking hour marking coursework in detail, whilst waiting for students to come through their always open door. It is all too black and white.

No wonder tutors wouldn't want parents involved at any stage however serious, because then they might get questioned by those prepared to answer back.

I think tutors are just saying its not that simple because there's a sense here that everything's our fault and we're not approachable. If the parents of any of the students I've spent months kindly and tactfully chasing wanted to get involved and could do so, I don't think they could say I hadn't tried.

It's equally black and white to say the poor old students pay all that money and nobody at university cares about them, to be fair.

Lots of students are lovely. Some are not as lovely, and we really bloody do try hard to do everything we can before their degree is terminated through their own action - or, more likely, inaction.

Cf. the student who posted on Facebook that one of us was 'a cunt' for failing his essay, and his supportive dad commented agreeing.

The world is changing. University education is an expensive commodity and tutors need to be seen to be doing a good and non discriminatory job of educating undergraduates. The days of giving 2 lectures a term in between undertaking mediocre and irrelevant 'research' whilst playing croquet on the lawn and slagging off the students have gone. Many undergraduates have not only worked very hard to get outstanding grades to get into uni, but are keen to get at least a very good degree and a very good job. The lazy student is a bygone myth. Much more common is the student with very little contact time who has no idea how to undertake self directed study.