Worried about my meeting with school

[mrsshears]

I have a meeting coming up with my 5yr old dd's school to discuss her recent IQ test results,i'm really not looking forward to it
School have been very defensive and basically have me down as a nightmare pushy mother,despite the fact dd1 went to the same school and i never went in to see the teachers in all her time there,in fact i bet some of the teachers wouldn'nt have even known who i was back then!
I'm really looking for any help or advice anyone has as to how i should handle this meeting,i know they have done some sats papers with dd over the last couple of weeks which whilst i'm glad they are doing something it kind of defeates the object imo as i'm sure they will have been full of things dd has'nt yet been taught (with the exception of the reading one) so i can't imagine she will have done too well,but then the cynic in me thinks that this is why they have done them.
What i want to say is that i just want dd to be challenged at her own level,not pushed but challenged,but i'm unsure as to how i can get this across without making myself look even worse?
On a positive note dd has been moved up a couple of book bands which has already boosted her confidence which i'm really pleased about.
Maybe i'm looking at this meeting far too pessimistically(sorry about my spelling) but after all we have been through i can't help it.
I would be really greatful for any advice any of you have.

@ mwita yes I think the cause matters. I initially asked psych. if it was sensory integration disorder for DD - sensitive to textures (clothing and food), noises and odours (smells she defines as horrible may be, to me, nice - she nearly threw in asda once over the smell of baking bread). However her issues are different - noise is fear inducing, others (like textures and smells) seem difficult to tolerate. Some of her issues which I thought were texture (a bow rubbing in car seat, socks/tights with wrinkles) psych. reckons are emerging obsessive/compulsive issues related to stress/anxiety. She ruled out sensory integration disorder as issues are not consistent (ie. the same things do not bother her to same degree all the time - they fluctuate). If it was sensory integration there would be consistency. She said it mattered what the cause was as it would impact the type of therapy she would use. We have art therapy for anxiety etc. So if you can define what has caused DD's sensitivities it might help you develop cause of treatment to help her. I really want this tackled as the fear and other issues were significantly starting to impact her life.

that's really interesting, thanks. (esp as ds1 also has anxiety and some phobic behaviour )

def not anxiety related with dd2. she has always been supersensitive to touch and would scream if we touched her arms as a newborn. the rest just followed on, really.

ds1, though... hmmm.

DD very hypesensitive to touch when I got her, pos. due to lack of physical contact in early months of life when in institution. Could even stand me lying near her, never mind holding her or touching bare skin. Also never made eye contact and always leaned as far a way as possible to avoid body contact! This early isolation (along with the constant 'abandonment' caused by staff going on/off shift) is underlying cause of her anxiety and probably her sensory issues too. Such hypersensitivity (and attachment/bonding difficulties) can be seen too in children who are isolated from mother at birth due to medical conditions (e.g. having to be in incubator) and thus missing out on that early bonding with mum.

Agree with your post seeker about hypersensitivities, it was what I meant with mine. Ds dosen't like loud sounds and nor did I. I think that is common with young children.

Adoptmama hope your Dd is getting better with the abandonment issues I guess it must take time .

thanks iggly2 She is night and day from how she was; totally different child in almost all respects especially attachment (had attachment disorder). Loves her cuddles, loves her family and mostly feels secure. Just every now and then (especially with unexpected events/transitions e.g. at school or leaving family after visits) I get a little reminder that the frightened baby who was left so alone is still deep inside her.

mm, we wondered about that too, adoptmama. (dd2 spent first 5 weeks in scbu at term and no-one could hold her for the first few weeks, and then even when we could, the movement would cause saliva to pool in the back of her throat and cut off her airway. it was all a bit grim.)

weirdly though, she failed all of her hearing tests for the first year or so (had about 9 recalls) but we put that down to the noise in scbu - all the alarms and monitors, and essentially literaaly switching off from them. the audiologists would say, we're pretty sure she is hearing us, we just can't tell. how she went from that to full-on moro at noise, i couldn't tell you...

Have you had that meeting yet, mrsshears?

Yes iamnotminterested it went as expected,very defensive,our school is at x place in the x list and our teaching is fantastic,your dd is manipulative and playing off home and school against each other,that sort of vibe.
From everything that was said it is clear they have little or no experience of gifted children and also said in so many words that they don't believe in IQ assessments.
BUT i have noticed this week that everyone is being increasingly friendly and i hate to be sceptical about this but dd has also been chosen for several things,which is great but not the norm,i sense that in a few weeks 'they' will be responsible for dd actually starting to do very well because of something 'they' have done.
We are going to look around after christmas and are also planning to send emails to several independents as unless her current school starts to believe in dd i dont see how it can work.

I should add dd is going to have a new teacher after christmas as a jobshare with the current one so i will be interested to see how that affects things.

ugh. but mmm, interesting...

at least you know where you stand, i suppose. and if things are improving gradually (whatever the rationale) then you can take your time to investigate a possible move.

and only another 2 weeks until the holidays - yay!

I was really upset initially madwoman ,its awful to hear someone talk about your child in such a negative way but i have had to talk myself down to avoid doing something silly.
I really hope what i think is going to happen will iyswim.
Christmas holidays is another reason why we are putting things on the back burner a bit as i just want to concentrate on giving my family a wonderful christmas,which reminds me "merry christmas everyone"!

i think you get to the point where you need some down time. just to relax and concentrate on something else for a bit and then try and have another look impartially later on. it does sound as though you might be right with your suspicions about likely outcome, though. which will at least get you to where you need to be, even it sticks in your craw about their methods.

and then after the hols you can have a fresh think about whether it's the right setting or of there's something that suits better.

is dd okay though?

She's not too bad thanks.
Her confidence is a bit all over the place,with numeracy in particulair (doing division and times tables at home and nothing remotely like that at school),the trouble is though its swings and roundabouts with dd,if its too easy she can't be bothered and will make a mess of it and if its too hard because she isnt used to being challenged she panics.
We are doing kumon and things nearer her level at home though which she is enjoying and i'm hoping it will start to bring her confidence in this area right up soon.
On the whole though she is ok,just has a big dose of christmasitis! if i hear another out of tune carol i will go mad!

Hi everyone
hope you are all well and looking forward to christmas.
Well we have had some lovely positive comments written in dd's home learning book,one saying how much better she is lately, funny that...
That said as long as dd is recognised and gets what she needs i'm fully prepared to suck it up,although of course it grates.
I noticed something interesting when dd was doing her kumon homework,which as she has just started is very basic atm,she was filling in the missing numbers up to 50 in a grid and instead of just filling them in she was doing them in an odd order and saying what they were e.g 43 is 4 lots of 10 and 3 units,that kind of thing,well in the end she started making mistakes as she had really overcomplicated it which got me thinking she perhaps is doing things like this at school?
I've never seen her do this before as with harder things she is really resistant to use her brain and think about it so it seems odd that she would try and make the easier stuff harder,what do you think?
or am i over thinking things again

Is Kumon actually aimed at G & T children?

Did school give you an eg. of what the higher maths activities were?

I would look at the possibilty that she is not fully understanding, or confident in applying, some of the more basic numeracy strategies. It might benefit her to slow down a little and revisit and reinforce some of the earlier skills as it sounds like she is confusing strategies and is not entirely sure what methods to use where. If she has been progressing very quickly with you through various aspects and skills of the mathematics curriculum she may not have adequately absorbed the knowledge of which skills to apply when and where.

adoptmama maybe if that is the case then the kumon might help?
It does seem quite back to basics at the minute (although they have said that this wont be for long).
We decided to do the kumon to build her confidence etc so hopefully this will be what happens.

no harm in reviewing early skills. if kumon work systematically then they should find if there are any missing areas. the splitting into 10s and units shows a good understanding of number. she may be concentrating more on this as it interests her and is therefore not concentrating on what she is supposed to be doing.

and yes to dd sometimes not engaging her brain. she struggled to add single digit numbers to teens in school, yet can do other harder stuff. sometimes though she does not engage her brain and guesses wildly. if she doesn't engage her brain in school, then they are going to think she can't do it and will not know to not accept poor performance. it would only take doing that once or twice for them to think she can not do it and not provide anything harder. (fair enough, you can only judge the evidence presented) dd is easily distracted as well so there is a big difference between the relative quiet of home and busyness of school. I think the secret is to motivate her to do her best and think carefully. I also let her know that I will be checking up on her at parents evening to see if i ill be proud of her work.

@mrsshears kumon will help if it is being used to allow the teacher of the programme to make an appropriate assessment of DDs levels in the different areas (shape and space, mental calculation, measures etc.) and then tailor her work to these. If it uncovers gaps or insecurities in knowledge application then it will be useful. There may be quite large differences between abilities in different areas. It will not help if it is going to be used in such a way as to advance her as fast as possible to as high a level as possible so that the kumon fanchise can trumpet a success in progressing children fast and advancing them beyond peer group (cynical I know but it is what happens).

What do you know about the background/expertise of the person operating the kumon class? Aside from being trained in delivering their programme does the person have any experience in teaching, identifying strengths & weaknesses etc. or are they relying on a maual to give them the answers (kumon is not a tutoring programme)? Kumon is not known for actually developing thinking skills - something your DD seems to have difficulty with in terms of deciding what known strategies she should use. Kumen (rather like some Asian education systems: and it is a Japanese-influenced programme) focuses on developing fast computation skills. Therefore what she is doing in Kumon may not crossover in any particularly meaningful way to mach her NC maths programme. As it doesn't wholly match the NC it may not offer a way of finding out if your DD has weaknesses in an NC area. Completing work where the focus is on a timed completion can be very stressful to some children and there can be lack of choice offered in applying alternate, and workable, strategies to the task. Professionally I question the value of a system where success is measured by speed. I have a lot of experience teaching S.Korean students who excel at fast computation: however they cannot apply thinking skills to problem solving and I feel this is also true of Kumon. Many, many children find it boring and, the older ones complain about the fact they are not taught to understand concepts (just compute answers) so they struggle as their school work becomes more demanding. Frankly nothing I have read about Kumon makes me think it is a particularly enjoyable way of doing maths for any child and I would not use it.

ah you see I know nothing about kumon.

that was very helpful adopt. getting them to apply things is a lot harder than teaching them techniques.

I see what you are saying adoptmama,tbh we will just go with it for as long as dd enjoys it and if it seems to be working with regards to her confidence etc,i have spoken to school and we have agreed that they will send home anything that dd seems to be having difficulty with so i'm hoping the two things may work in unison with each other iyswim.
I don't know much about the kumon teachers credentials,she seems to really get dd though as she has a gifted son,i had a lovely conversation with her at the induction,it was a breath of fresh air to talk to someone in RL who knows exactly where you are coming from and understands your child,it was really funny because she brought up the labels in clothes issue that she has with her ds and only that morning dd had got me to cut the label out of her leggings!!

I think if your Dd is enjoying kumon and it's building up her confidence then what is there to lose?

"Kumon is not known for actually developing thinking skills - something your DD seems to have difficulty with in terms of deciding what known strategies she should use. Kumen (rather like some Asian education systems: and it is a Japanese-influenced programme) focuses on developing fast computation skills."

But if it speeds up her computional skills it means she may then feel she has more time to spend comprehending a problem and working out what sums need to be done as she then knows she can work out the mental arithmetic side quickly.

Sounds like you all enjoy the sessions .

PS, I have nothing to do with Kumon and on other threads have criticised it as not sounding great for intelligent children that may get bored with repetition. I think all are different and have different problems. Here confidence maybe an issue so why stop doing somthing being enjoyed and in an environmnt where the child is thriving?