anyone who is unsure about MMR I urge you......

[CrushWithEyeliner]

to contact www.jabs.co.uk. I spent over an hour talking to the most informative, helpful, balanced Woman who listened to my DDs history and just gave me the most incredible insight into the world of immunisations.

DD has already had a reaction to a vaccine so obviously I have more of a worry, but she was still extremely impartial and what she said just screamed common sense. When all I get from my so-called healthcare professionals is "you must do it there is really no risk".

For example she asked me to think about the ways in which we "catch" these viruses, normally through the throat which then filters through to the stomach and rest of the body. The immune system hence processes these bacteria in a the natural way. Comparing this to a shot of the virus (with other chemicals) directly through the bloodstream and into the internal organs. This can be just one factor to cause a reaction in a child.

Now I am just using this as an example of one of many things we discussed, I am not trying to persuede anyone that this is Gospel, but I have come to the right decision for me and DD talking it through with an intelligent, informative person which is SO mush more that I got from my GP after DD had a bad reaction.

Anyway I just urge you to call them if you are unsure or worried, they are fantastic.

My first son has autism, he had the MMR and the MMR booster with no problems. My second non autistic son had the MMR as soon as he was old enough with no problems. My (middle aged) brother is autistic too but didn't have the MMR as it was not around when he was a child.

Thank you! I'll have to talk to all the relevant people again.

crush, the website you stated that gave balanced advice has the heading "for vaccine damaged kids". Reading all their anti vaccine articles shows its hardly impartial!!!

Are you very easily led? you pick a website which has a clear bias towards one side of a debate and then state to everyone you've used it to make a balanced decision to .,....surprise, surprise not have the MMR!!!!!

pointless and disappointing thread

This site gives the other side of the argument

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MMR_Hoax

I don't think any of us has time to go over old ground so I'm not posting any more !

DD had both MMR and booster without problems
DS1 had first MMR but not booster (around the time of first links with autism etc)
DS2 - neither.

I have been told that the 2nd dose is just a routine booster to capture the 2% of children who did not get the immunity from the first. meaning that 98% are having a double wammy unnecesarily.

I have friends who have had perfectly healthy children UNTIL the MMR.

Yes, measles etc can be quite dangerous, but I had it and so did a couple of my siblings without effect, along with many other children in the 60's and 70's wihtout the adverse side effects thank god.

I really dont' know what is the right thing to do, but for the time being I just don't feel I can go through with the jab.

Hi flowery!

Odd isn't it - born on the same day, MMR on the same day! Except that we went out and bought Duplo instead. I'll be taking him for it as soon as he's better though.

wiki is just written by ordinary people like you and me, you know. Not necessarily more authoritative than JABS, although they do try to cover a lot of ground quite neutrally.

However, the current Wiki piece is misleading as it states critics of MMR believe it is the primary cause of the increase in autism. That's just not true. Wakefield argues MMR may be a trigger for autism in a tiny sub-set of children who are particularly vulnerable, AFAIK.

I think the first reference to Cochrane in the second par is a little misleading too, although they do give more details further down. However many people do not read to the bottom of a web page or scroll down so I'd argue the initial statement is over-egging the pudding.

I'm glad Jabs were helpful. Your NHS professionals are following a rule which was laid down by dear Tony B.Liar at the time at which this was relevant to dd - at that time it was a dismissable offence for a health professional to do anything but recommend the MMR. I imagine this rule is still in place.

Just one of the stupid things that so-called pro-choice Government did to encourage distrust in it.

Genuine question: what is the argument behind having single jabs rather than MMR, if one of the worries about vaccinations would be that you inject virusses together with other chemicals and that way the body wouldn't deal with it naturally?? Wouldn't you subject your dc to three times the dose of at least those nasty "other chemicals" when giving separate jabs??

Would like to correct the OP though: vaccinations are not injected into the blood stream- they are injected into the muscle of either the leg or the upper arm. MMR also doesn't contain bacteria: Mumps, measles and rubella are all virusses and an inactive form of these virusses will be in the vaccine.

the argument I think is about over loading the body with several viruses at once

we hope ds4 will have separate jabs; i have no idea if mmr is related to asd or not, but with 2 asd children, am not prepared to risk it, neither am i prepaed to leave him totally exposed either

But honny OP was given ALL the facts she needed to make her decision - as you point out there are soem flaws in her knowledge, but hey no point preaching to the converted!

regardless of personasl pov, it is not nice to make fun of someone who ultimately is just trying to do her best for her LO, who has had a previous bad reaction.

Peachy OP started this thread URGING US TO TALK TO A JABS lady as they are so-oo balanced in their views. I'm sorry but when flaws are exposed in that you can't claim an appeal to pity. If OP wants to kick off a normal discussion on MMR then fine - but advertise poor advice please.

and more importantly

a 2-1 !
well done Peachy.

DON'T advertise poor advise obviously!!!!

Everyone has to make a decision that is best for her child and family.

But FWIW, my mother lost about 30% of the hearing in her right ear from measles she had when she was 7 years old. And now, in her 60s, that ear has started to cause her lots of problems. She had a grommit in it now.

I have a friend in Edinburgh who also got measles when he was 7, in the early 1960s.

He is completely blind and deaf in one ear from complications of measles.

It can be very nasty and even dangerous for babies who are too young for the jab.

Also the immune system is constantly at work. It's usually only 'overloaded' in the case of a person with an underlying condition that compromises the immune system - chemo, on anti-rejection drugs, HIV/AIDS.

With all due respect to OP and the 'informative, helpful, balanced woman' she talked to, measles, mumps, and rubella viruses are NOT 'normally' transmitted through food/digestive track at all. These viruses are spread by airborne transmission, through large respiratory droplets. Which is why they are so incredibly contagious.

expat - ALL of my friends (of same age group) had measles. There was no vaccine during my childhood. NONE of us are deaf, blind, or otherwise affected.

It is a freaky coincidence that the two people you know who had measles suffered such terrible consequences, but I am sure you realize that they are in a very small minority.

Well, of course, I do, Cote. That's why I qualified it in my post.

But if it were like a common cold, why would anyone have gone to the trouble to invent a vaccine for it? It's not exactly a cheap or trouble-free process.

'freaky coincidence'? look at the statistics a relatively large number of kids got complications from measels as opposed to a tiny, tiny minority of kids whose parents think it was the MMR.
FWIW I also have a friend who is in her 30s and is totally deaf thru measels. So sad and avoidable.

DD's is booked for next month. I am really in two minds about it. People say "well, research it, blah blah blah" but for every bit of evidence for the argument there is a defense from the other side.

FWIW I believe that there are a sub-set of children in whom the MMR can trigger regressive autism. My question is - how cn you tell if your child is in that subset? And is there a benefit in delaying it?

My worry is that my niece has Crohn's disease, and I have automimmune thyroid disease. I want to know if these are risk factors but I am scared to ask my Dr for fear of being dismissed as a precious parent and not getting an unbiased, research response.

Teachersaysso - you say about your friend being deaf through measles - so sad and avoidable. I shoud think the parents who have had the MMR and then had their children diagnosed with Autism also feel its so sad and avoidable.

I am on the fence, not knowing which way to turn, and in the meantime doing nothing, hoping DS will stay healthy until we have concrete evidence either way.

It is not common cold, and it is not the hyped up boogeyman the MMR generation believes it to be, either.

My generation (I'm 37) all had measles. I had it twice (once at 9 months and again when I was 7 or 8). It wasn't fun, but it was not scary for anyone, either. You might think this strange, but our parents used to send us to play with whoever had measles so that we would catch it sooner rather than later.

I grew up in Turkey so while not a 3rd world country, it wasn't state of the art medical care either. And nobody, and I never saw nor heard of anyone who suffered any nasty consequences from measles.

So sorry but I can't take very seriously the scaremongering surrounding measles.