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If you decided to delay or to forgo MMR, how did health professionals react?

431 replies

usedtogotomars · 19/12/2017 16:41

Just wondering about this (and haven’t yet decided) - do they respond in a way that respects your view or do they try to persuade you to have the vaccinations given to your child?

OP posts:
Pagwatch · 19/12/2017 22:41

Usedtogotomars

My first two were vaccinated, my DD wasn't and my GP agreed that that was appropriate.
The idea that health professionals won't take you seriously is not necessarily true but seeing yourself as alone in the huge decision will just make that feeling take hold.
Talk to people you trust, be patient and try to be sensible. The fear that something dreadful may happen is understandable because to vaccinate feels like you are doing something to your child that might precipitate harm. But of course the reality is that the first time your unvaccinated child is ill you have the same fear -exactly.
It's not a 'safe' alternative.
Go and find people to talk to and try not to get too stressed.
Good luck with your pregnancy

usedtogotomars · 19/12/2017 22:43

Thank you Flowers

I am reluctant to mention autism, but will gps tske me seriously if I do mention this as a concern?

OP posts:
MissConductUS · 19/12/2017 22:43

OP, of course you're worried. Mums worry all the time. It's what we do.

I've worked with many doctors. Some are condescending jerks. Most are very bright people who genuinely want the best for their patients. Give your pediatrician a chance before you write off whatever they're going to say.

Good luck with the pregnancy.

Flowers
itsallrelative2017 · 19/12/2017 22:43

@usedtogotomars

We took our DS for the vaccinations done individually at a private clinic - I wasn't comfortable (like you for personal reasons) with him having the MMR jab but at the time I believe (for reasons posted up thread re:herd immunity/immune compromised people etc) that everyone should be vaccinated.

I would advise you to look into it and if you can afford to, start saving for it

X

usedtogotomars · 19/12/2017 22:45

I was leaning toward the single measles jab but not sure now.

OP posts:
MrsTerryPratchett · 19/12/2017 22:49

Being a parent is ALL about making imperfect decisions so you'll have to get used to that. Discipline them and you're a meanie, don't and you're soft. Reins and you think they're a dog, none and you don't care about their safety. Sleep train and you're abusing them, don't and you're a martyr. BF and you're a weird hippy, don't and you're hurting their health.

You will spend the next few years being told you're doing it wrong. So you'll need to have the courage of your convictions and make good decisions for your child.

What does the father think about all this?

usedtogotomars · 19/12/2017 22:51

Couldn’t care less really. And I do understand what you mean and I’m not trying to be difficult but the stakes aren’t as potentially high in the other examples.

OP posts:
itsallrelative2017 · 19/12/2017 22:55

@usedtogotomars I guess it depends what your personal experience is - for us it was a two blood relatives who "claim" their DCs were not autistic prior to receiving the MMR jab.

I'm not saying we believed that (before I get flamed!) just that we decided we weren't prepared to take the risk so went with what we saw as the "least risky option".

But if your personal experience is for example allergy related, you might need to look into ingredients/component parts in the two and compare......

JoyN2016 · 19/12/2017 23:01

Don't worry yourself over it, usedtogotomars. You need a thick skin to approach this subject here.

To those lovely people on here who care about herd immunity so much, and being pro vaccine myself - you are likely to not be immune to mmr, whooping cough, chicken pox or some such as adults. For example adults spread whooping cough without knowing as for them it can be just a cold. So before you pounce on people who have concerns about vaccinating children, go vaccinate yourself first. Immunity wears off so you may be responsible yourself for inflicting diseases on others without even knowing, how do you like this. And go read up on Valentino Bocco and others like him, just so you understand that life is not as simplefor some as it may seem.

Sassenach85 · 19/12/2017 23:05

Can anyone shed any info about the booster jabs they get around 3/4years old?

My DD hasn't had hers yet and I'm undecided. I read somewhere that the booster is actually only "needed" by 5% of kids who didn't take to it on first go? Anybody with some facts around this? Thanks in advance!

bruffin · 19/12/2017 23:21

Joy, the Valentino Bocco case is irrelevant. The ruling was successfully overturned.

laudanum · 19/12/2017 23:22

Vaccinate your kids. Otherwise you best keep them away from immunocompromised people since it's them you're putting at risk as well as the health of your own child.

Anyone challenging you about not doing it is absolutely 100% right, it's hugely irresponsible not to do so.

thundernlightning · 19/12/2017 23:33

Something that perhaps hasn’t been considered is what it means to not get jabs but wind up in A and E with a sick kid. I’ve been three times with DS (he’s prone to febrile seizures) and every time I can say he’s vaccinated I see the relief on their faces. Being vaccinated is good for plenty of things, but it also helps doctors make a diagnosis in a speedy way.

JoyN2016 · 20/12/2017 00:03

Bruffin, you are making strange assumptions from me mentioning poor Valentino. His case is relevant to the discussion as it illustrates the confusion and difference of opinions that exists. There are others, for example Politico states "in a separate case in 2014, a court in Milan ordered the health ministry to pay a life long reimbursement to another autistic child". On the other hand no one has overruled Hannah Poling case yet and some others. We just have to accept that not everything is in black and white and the best part of science for me is that progress and discoveries often happen through doubt and research.

EasterRobin · 20/12/2017 00:04

My friend's baby can't have these vaccinations for medical reasons. If your child can have them, please do it. Otherwise you are risking making your child (or someone else's child who genuinely can't have the vaccinations) disabled or worse.

JoyN2016 · 20/12/2017 00:06

Laudanum, I agree. But have you vaccinated yourself or do you stay away from immunocompromised people? Do you take time off work with colds and viruses too to not infect people like my friend who has had treatment for cancer, asthma and other illnesses and had to commute to work?

Smitff · 20/12/2017 00:26

Responding to your last post in response to mine: I’m confused. Earlier up you said to Eagle “IF [causation] is as black and white as that, which it isn’t...”. I can well believe that it isn’t that black and white - in fact I’d be wary of anyone saying that there is a definitive, indisputable link.

In reply to me, you say you DO know the vaccinations caused your relative’s suffering (caused as opposed to eg correlated with).

How do you know?

Elsewhere again you said you’d be wary of anyone who told you anything definitively. I’d say that to you again. How do you know?

Whatever the answer, this isn’t really the point, is it. Ultimately, you (the mother of the child in question) will never know with certainty what happened. You can have a gut feel, but that’s not proof.

As such, yes, you are stuck between the devil and the deep blue sea. And yes you are alone (is the father involved and on your side?). Many, many parenting (and life) decisions are like this. Admittedly the stakes are normally not as high as a child’s life. But still.

This isn’t about pushback from HCPs when you go in with a request they don’t want to grant but are obliged to, or about hating confrontation. This is about you having the courage of your convictions. My advice would be to inform yourself fully of the facts from all sources. You can only go by what’s out there, else you’ll drive yourself mad, dizzying yourself in a world of conjecture. It’s the best you can do. You will have many, many “what if’s” as you raise your child.

Facts. Just stick to the facts. And they will lead you to the conclusion everyone is suggesting here.

Watching your child go under anesthetic, knowing there’s a chance (however small) that they may never come out, is terrifying. But on balance, it’s for their own good, even if you know a child who never made it. You know this. It’s why you’re struggling.

bruffin · 20/12/2017 00:55

There was no ruling on Hannah Poling. She was going to be included on the omnibus cases but the parents dropped out at the last minute. They were paid out on a table injury, which a list of symptoms that are known side affects of vaccinations, which does not include autism.

Bocco case was overuled because there was no evidence that mmr caused this childs autism.

Mustang27 · 20/12/2017 01:15

They actually for some reason thought I'd declined and nobody even had a conversation with me. It was after waiting for my babies first immunisation date to come through which was late obviously that I phoned my HV in a panic and they apologised profusely and squeezed us in as soon as they could.

Why would they waste their breath trying to convince you? If you have decided against?

FWIW I was on the fence until I read about Roald Dahls daughter. Il take my chances with the immunisations any day after reading that.

xxxyyyxxx · 20/12/2017 01:25

In my case there were 2 reasons I didn't vaccinate
DC1 caught measles at 5 months and then went on to have mumps at a year old.
So I really couldn't see the point. She had German measles when she was about 7.

Also a friends child had a dreadful reaction to the MMR.

A few years later in A&E the nurse reported me to SS because I had not had dc vaccinated and also I home ed another child which apparently are 2 red flags and so merit being reported. Dc were put on the at risk register.
Both dc were over 16 at the time. Eldest already drove a car and held down 3 jobs.

Mustang27 · 20/12/2017 01:26

@usedtogotomars I'm sorry about your experience with vaccines that sounds absolutely horrible. I realise my post will seem insensitive now.

I can't imagine what that's like to live with that and question if they hadn't had the adverse reaction what their life would be like. It must be very sad.

Good luck with whatever decision you make and it really is your decision. Don't feel forced into anything with your baby.

laudanum · 20/12/2017 01:36

@JoyN2016

Yes and yes.

I'm immunocompromised.

laudanum · 20/12/2017 02:06

@JoyN2016 I also meant to say - I'm self employed and work from home, so i am quite fortunate that i don't have as much contact with people as commuters and the like.

JoyN2016 · 20/12/2017 06:34

Laudanum, that is great and ditto here. However not everyone does I bet among posters on the forum and causing an already a sick adult with serious pneumonia is no better that giving measles to a child. Even people in his office who know about his plight do not try to stay away. I am annoyed by those who preach vaccinations but are themselves potential health harmers.

Bruffin, I never once said that mmr causes autism and pointed the cases as they are ilustrative of the confusing opinions. That you explained each case in brief here is very nice, though Iam sure everyone is capable of doingvtheir own research to reach an opinion. I do not have information to say whether it does or not so keep an.open mind, for all I know it is not impossible as science is developing and one day may be able to confirm or refute the claim. However it is not relevant to the OP asking about responses to refusing vaccinations, and it would be great if the thread actually stuck to that espevially as OP is pregnant and repeatedly stated it was an emotional subject to her. Yet she was pushed into explaining on and on and on the receiving end of typical mumsnet opinionated advice givers, who do not always respect others and their pain. Old woman rant over, bye and merry christmas to all.

ememem84 · 20/12/2017 06:52

I’ve took ds for his vaccinations (12 weeks) yesterday. When I was pregnant they asked me about vaccinations and whether we would be doing this. Did I have any concerns etc. I don’t so said no. I did ask what would have happened if I’d said yes I have concerns about vaccinations. The midwife said they’d arrange for someone to speak to me to discuss concerns and it would be put on record that I’d chosen not to vaccinate. The nursery we’ve chosen for ds needs to see vaccination records (or be told that he hasn’t been vaccinated) as do schools.