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Original poster

Abortion rate highest ever - I'm sorry I just don't buy the reason suggested for this...

875 replies

CountessDracula · 08/02/2007 11:39

"But pregnancy advice groups said the figures probably reflected poor access to contraceptive services"

What utter tosh

You can buy condoms in many loos in clubs and pubs. In any chemist or 24hour shop.

You have access to family planning clinics and doctors with free contraception

You can buy the morning after pill over the counter ffs

Shouldn't people take a bit more responsibility and get themselves to these places and get some bloody contraception?

OP posts:
3LoveHeartsAndNoMore · 11/02/2007 12:54

how could you do that though, Paula, without taking the right of choices away from women?

NappiesGalore · 11/02/2007 12:56

i will engae with that point monkeytrousers. well, i'll agree with it anyway!

have only been skimming this thread since my last post, but someone also makes the point that getting so uptight about this issue, while not doing all one can about millions, millions of babies and children - who unaguably ARE alive and real and suffering and precious - dying in the third world or anywhere else for that matter of utterly preventable causes, every single day... well its more than ridiculous... (in fact i could say its downright narrowminded bullshit. but i wont in acse anyone thinks i am attacking them personally. i am not, but i stand by the point.)

paulaplumpbottom · 11/02/2007 13:00

I don't know the answer to that. I also believe that these choices are important. I just know that killing your baby shouldn't be an option for people.

NappiesGalore · 11/02/2007 13:03

no. you know that killing your unborn baby from the moment of conception shouldnt be an option for you. you do not have the right to decide what other people do or feel or believe.

lulumama · 11/02/2007 13:06

nappies..you have hit the nail on the head

we , as adult living members of the human race, do,by our very nature, i beleive, take precedence over the putative rights of the unborn.

edam · 11/02/2007 13:07

Killing babies isn't an option, it's agains the law. Ending a pregnancy isn't killing a baby. When you have wanted pregnancy, of course you identify with your unborn baby. But you can't judge someone else's pregnancy on that basis. It isn't your pregnancy and it isn't your life and it isn't your decision.

People aren't people until they are born. If fetuses were treated as people with the same rights as actual human beings, women would be sub-human with fewer rights over their own bodies than men. You don't celebrate the day you were conceived, do you, you celebrate your birthay.

lulumama · 11/02/2007 13:08

please can you stop referring to it as 'killing your baby' it is uneccesary

and emotive and does not help your argument in the least

a baby is not ,IMO, an embryo of a few weeks gestation, it has the potential to become a baby, and in around 20 % of cases, will not become a baby, but will be miscarried for some reason...

NappiesGalore · 11/02/2007 13:09

absolutely lulu. and i think that should be the meaning of the cynically chosen term 'pro-life'. (pro life indeed, go and save some people who want saving if youre that pro life.)

paulaplumpbottom · 11/02/2007 13:11

I disagree with you Edam. I think people look at it that way to legitimise abortion. It is a baby. Its a life and it wrong to take it. We as a society dictate to others what is right and wrong all the time. We don't let people beat their children for instance.

NappiesGalore · 11/02/2007 13:11

x posts btw. i meant that in answer to lulus last but 1 post...

NappiesGalore · 11/02/2007 13:14

PPB. its is a potential life. and it is inside a real live person who has rights and circumstances and many complex reasons for living how they do.

feotuses have a date where they are medically referred to as 'viable' and it is not from the moment of conception. there is a reason for this.

paulaplumpbottom · 11/02/2007 13:16

disagree, its a life that can't survive on its own but a life none the less. The term viable only means that it could live outside the womb. It doesn't mean that before this point its not a life.

edam · 11/02/2007 13:16

Instead of rushing to judge others for not living up to your rules, maybe you should just thank your lucky stars that you have never been in the situation of having to think about ending a pregnancy.

paulaplumpbottom · 11/02/2007 13:19

It doesn't matter that I have never been in that situation. You probably haven't been in a situation where you felt like beating your child but you still know its wrong.

lulumama · 11/02/2007 13:20

i think that the foetus, before it is viable, is a potential life, it cannot live by itself, so it is not technically alive, so how can it be considered a life, with its rights taking precedence over the rights of the living woman??

i am sorry, paula, i admire your termination, but your views are so at odds with what i personally believe....

Caligula · 11/02/2007 13:22

I don't care if it's a life tbf.

The life of a full-grown woman is more important than that of a foetus.

NappiesGalore · 11/02/2007 13:23

PPB is absolutely not listening to anyone on this. its her right i suppose. i only hope se is never able to foist her unreasonable and potentially harmful, and certainly hurtful views on anyone in a sensitive and vulnerable position at any time. thats all a person needs at a time of such important and life-changing decision making; irrational, overly emotive ideals about things which are nothing to do with her.
peoples bodies are their own, PPB, with or without accidental or wanted pregnancies inside them.

edam · 11/02/2007 13:23

LOL, my ds is 3.5 so I wouldn't bet on that! Of course I wouldn't beat him, however irritating he is, because he's a living being who can feel pain and deserves respect. A fetus doesn't have the same status.

paulaplumpbottom · 11/02/2007 13:24

"I don't care if it's a life"

Thats the problem with a lot of people who are pro-abortion. You've hit the nail on the head.

VioletBaudelaire · 11/02/2007 13:24

Lulumama, did you mean 'determination'?
If so, that was some freudian slip!

lulumama · 11/02/2007 13:24

i think your lack of apparent empathy and ability to put yourself in the shoes of a woman needing to consider termination, is what is troubling me most, TBH, Paula...where i have seen on other threads, you are a really kind person

NappiesGalore · 11/02/2007 13:24

succictly put, caligula

paulaplumpbottom · 11/02/2007 13:27

I do empathise. I help people in this sort of situation all the time. I have opened my home to them. I also see what abortion does to a lot of women. I just don't think abortion is the answer to the problem.

VioletBaudelaire · 11/02/2007 13:27

It's very easy to have immovable and blinkered views on subjects that are purely academic. Self righteousness is an unpleasant and ultimately destructive trait, IME.
Those who have been faced with difficult and sometimes heart-breaking decisions often find themselves able to empathise with the views of others.

NappiesGalore · 11/02/2007 13:28

indeed VB - life is black and white. until you grow up, that is.