This illustrates why your vaccine choice matters to the rest of us

[CatherinaJTV]

one family's vaccine refusal killed one, another child, infected by the same unvaccinated pre-teen is still dying (since 2005):

justthevax.blogspot.com/2011/10/so-predictable-so-sad-natalie-dies-of.html

my understanding is that mumps is now becoming more prevalent in late teens/early 20s, because the vaccine only lasts until then.

Pagwatch, as Catherina has already shown, she only reads what she wants to on the thread. what posters actually write is irrelevant.

pout - 6 pages in 3 hours or so, shopping and dinner in between - give an old woman time to catch up....

Considering the hounding and sock puppeting the anti-vax crew usually do whenever the topic of vaccinations are mentioned on here, I think all the "how very dare you's" are a bit rich.

The amount of times i've read on such threads about Big Pharma and the health profession being callous bastards in it for the money, you lot didn't care about offensiveness then, did you?

Catherina, are you seriously suggesting that because you haven't come across a case of measles in your own personal experience that vaccines must be 100% effective? When the figures for measles outbreaks are released they usually mention the the 'majority' of cases are in unvaccinated or under vaccinated people - not all the cases. The MMR is known not to be 100% effective - particularly after one dose so your own children and other 'vaccinated' children are just as capable of being 'murder weapons' as are any adults wandering around with lapsed immunity. A vaccine isn't 'better than nothing' if it hasn't worked!

Vaccinated kids.

but they have to catch mumps from somewhere... Since the vaccine virus is not transmitted (at least not the Jeryl Lynn strain) wild virus has to come from somewhere and outbreaks (even those more recent ones in fully vaccinated populations) are usually imported from endemic areas.

Catatalie

The op posts regularly on here and I rarely respond. Her opinions are hers, she is entitled to them.

But an op calling my child a 'murder weapon' seems to me to cross a line.
How would you have me respond?

so let me get this right.

A child catches a virus from a vaccinated child who is actually proven to have the virus and the medics must be mistaken because it's unheard of to catch a virus if you've been vaccinated against it.

yet a child catches a virus after an unvaccinated child went into a surgery - a virus which has not been directly linked to that child, and yet the unvaccinated child is a murder weapon?

Tell me

What colour is the sky in your world?

gothannegeddes - would you like to back up your accusation of sock-puppetry? or is this going ot be the start of yet another thread where there are multiple attempts to smear people who do not vaccinate, and many insults flying about, without actually any substance?

Why don't you start by apologising for calling my daughter a 'murder weapon'?

Shall I go and tell her that is what she is from you? She is actually a real person you know.

Tell you what, why don't I do that and then post back her reaction?

Or do you think that would be a cruel, heartless, thoughtless, stupid thing to do?

Goth - I think you need to back up your allegations of sock puppetry. The people who come here and talk about their children are real and deserve some respect.

Catherina, are you seriously suggesting that because you haven't come across a case of measles in your own personal experience that vaccines must be 100% effective?

No, no matter how often someone alleges on this thread that I do believe that, I do not think or claim that vaccines are 100% effective and I have posted that several times here already (sigh).

A vaccine isn't 'better than nothing' if it hasn't worked!

well d'oh, obviously. But if you take 100 people and you vaccinated them all 2xMMR and you take 100 unvaccinated and then you stick them into a room with a child with wild measles, 99 of the vaccinated will come out healthy and 99 of the unvaccinated will come out with measles.

Gothannegeddes
I am not anti vax. I have never 'sock puppet'ed. I have never hounded the op.

I just find this op massively offensive.

Are you going to make any points that are actually true or just stick with general sneering?

Beachcomber - I apologize for calling your daughter a murder weapon. She is clearly no such thing and you would never intend her to be such a thing. Further, your decision not to vaccinate her was based on your own experience, research and thorough risk analysis - it is your decision to make, because she is your daughter. I would never want a child to feel like a thing or instrument.

The young man who was the index case that sparked my OP must feel horrible. I feel for him, too.

Just let me know which you prefer to do - apologise or have me tell my child that you say she is a 'murder weapon'.

I won't tell her, because it would be a pretty sick thing to say to a child. You have said it on here though.

99 of the unvax'd would come out with measles? is that really true, do you think? because i would assume that it would be no different than, for example, chicken pox, or indeed a cold... whereby in a nursery when chicken pox or a cold goes around, some of them get it and some of them don't.

wannaBe - you got all of this wrong.

We clarified the misunderstanding about the transmission.

The chain of transmission to those babies in the medical practice is absolutely undebated and clear. The young boy was in the waiting room when he was most infectious (just before the rash broke out), 6 kids who were from different families but in the waiting room with that boy, came down with measles in the appropriate interval afterwards.

Well Catherina you seem to be denying every possible suggestion that a vaccinated child caught/passed on a disease which they were vaccinated against. Why do that if you are prepared to accept that it is possible? My point about the vaccines not being better than nothing is just to point out to you that unless you actually know the immune status of your child after vaccination then you are in no position to point a finger at non- vaccinated children. A vaccinated, non-immune child can just as easily spread a disease.

X posts.

Thank you for apologising to me. There are other people on this thread who deserve an apology too.

The decision to not vaccinate my daughter was made with our doctor after what happened to her sister. We review the decision every year. The doctor would rather mainline mercury than risk vaccinating her.

Oh and I would love to be able to safely vaccinate my children in a sensible manner that would benefit them.

So I say 'fuck off' to any crap about 'antivaxxxxers'.

yes, measles are very contagious (might be 98) - recently, in the US, transmission occured through a shared ventilation system. The case wasn't even in the same room with the person who contracted measles from them.

A couple of years ago, a musician from a German Steiner school visited an Austrian Steiner school while s/he had measles and 172 of about 300 kids (plus one teacher) came down with measles (all unvaccinated, we don't know how many of the remaining 130odd had been vaccinated or had had measles already or had even interacted with the musician/attended the concert) - pretty impressive.

So the six kids who caught measles had all been vaccinated?

Ok, so now it's ok to have a 'murder weapon' for a child as long as it was a well thought out decision? Who exactly were you targeting your OP at exactly? Would you have posted if the child in the waiting room was a sibling of a vaccine damaged child whose parents were advised not to vaccinate? Or a child who can't be vaccinated for medical reasons? Is it excusable if they pass on the disease?

I'm not anti-vac, I'm anti bigot!

I have skipped huge chunks of this thread (I'm sorry) but wanted to tell my tale.

I had the MMR, fully vaxed and thought it had worked as when i had my rubella immunity status checked when pregnant it came back as immune both times.

Then i had my immunity checked recently by occupational health, just because i didnt have my MMR cert on the day. I am not immune to either Measles or Mumps. So i have to have another MMR.....they will then assume I am immune as I will have a cert and never screen me again .

Several colleagues seem to have got no TB immunity despite having had BCGs.

It worries me that we rely on vaccines, assume you must be immune if you are vaccinated, and it is only unvacinated people who are spreading diesease. All (4) children I know who have had measles had been vaccinated, which was why it wasn't recognised straight away.

For Fuck's sake

Well Catherina you seem to be denying every possible suggestion that a vaccinated child caught/passed on a disease which they were vaccinated against.

NO I DON'T - that was a misunderstanding, which has been clarified, at least I thought so. Going to bed now...