Middle class biological women prepare to be relegated to being second class citizens by the end of the week

[Mycatsmudge]

The Labour Party is expected to win a huge majority in the GE on Thursday. My fears are their stance on trans rights which are being prioritised over those of biological women and this will risk our safety, opportunities and dignity. I also work in the NHS and read what is happening to the nurses in Darlington with horror.

My other concern is they have not been transparent on their plans on how to raise money for their spending pledges other than say they will invest and reap the benefit of green technology. This is not going to happen in the foreseeable future. I can only conclude we will be taxed even more but stealthy.

Then I read this in their manifesto:
‘Expansion of the Equality Act 2010Labour will implement the socioeconomic protected characteristic of the Equality Act, also the socioeconomic duty under Section 1 of the Equality Act and ensure equality impact assessments of government policy are conducted.5 Jun 2024’
To me this means richer areas will get less money from government for public services than poorer areas. I live in an area which is very boringly middle class but our public services are already cut to the bone(bin collections fortnightly, potholes left for months, all adult evening classes gone) but we still pay a hefty amount of council tax.

So under a Labour government I as a biological woman, working in the NHS on the frontline and will be expected to share our women’s changing rooms with any man with a GRC. I will probably be taxed more as a higher rate taxpayer because the tax bands have stayed static for years and I will expect less public services because I live in the suburbs but my council taxes will most likely increase just to sustain what we already have

Well how mean would it be to describe someone who’s had full gender reassignment surgery, has lived ‘as a woman’ for years, as a man? Transwoman maybe.
Hate to say it but this just sounds like spite and a deliberate decision to offend someone just for the sake of it.

That is not entirely true actually.

If a trans person is convicted of a sex offence for instance in our courts, then it will be weighed up case by case where they are sentenced to custody. Most will go to a male prison now under the conservatives, if they are biologically male. It is now considered unsafe to send sex offenders to female prisons.

I think Labour are likely to reverse that decision personally.

I would question why the tories haven't clarified the equality act before now if it's such a high priority for them.

They've had 14 years to sort this out and they haven't. Why believe that they will do anything about it now?

What have labour said that will indicate that they're going to start putting more males into female prisons?

The flipside of that, is there is nothing currently stopping the likes of rapist Isla Bryson getting released from prison and using women's toilets and changing rooms.

Well if that vile piece of scum was appropriately sentenced for their crime we wouldn't need to worry about them re-entering society would we? Which is why me and many other women are voting women for their Rape Courts policy.

I don't personally trust the Tories to leave the EA alone excluding the Trans part. They've shown time and time again so much contempt for Women how can i believe now they care about me? Their actions show the opposite. If it was a political party who were proven to be more fair it would probably be different for me.

A person that has had 'full reassignment' will still have the biology of a male, but they won't have the physical appearance of a male technically speaking.

For that tiny percentage of the population, without the ability to rape due to full reassignment then it is likely they will be put in a female prison, but only that tiny percentage. Anyone with a penis regardless of how they identify should in most cases go to a male prison.

It is not hate, it is fact. I don't hate trans people at all, and wish them well, but I do not support the use of men with penises in women's spaces. No.

Alarming if so. Any evidence to back that up?

This gets asked a lot.

Until I would say about five years ago, it was a very niche issue that only a few feminists seemed to know or care about.
Those feminists campaigned to get politicians from every party to listen, very few did. They were called bigots, dinosaurs etc by politicians from most parties, but especially the supposedly progressive ones. Nicola Sturgeon casually tossed in that "many of them are also racist" with absolutely no justification.

A few MPs have "got it" notably Labour's Rosie Duffield, but only in the last couple of years have any front bench MPs with any influence really understood this issue. Until last year there were court cases pending which could have clarified the legal picture in women's favour, I think this needed to be resolved before legislation was the right approach.

But to go back to your original question, I don't think it is "such a high priority" for Conservatives. I think it is an area they have made progress on (instigating the cass report, blocking Scottish Self ID, issueing School's guidance) but obviously there is more to do. But I would rather a party does the right thing slowly than the wrong thing quickly.

That is one of the exceptions, and is a good thing. We obviously shouldn't be locking Women up with convicted rapists? Where is your evidence to bring you to the conclusion of moving rapists into female prisons?

No, not the Tories, as I have repeatedly said. Not Reform either.

@Alwaystired94 Well if that vile piece of scum was appropriately sentenced for their crime we wouldn't need to worry about them re-entering society would we? Which is why me and many other women are voting women for their Rape Courts policy.

We're never going to have a criminal justice system where rapists are given whole life sentences. If that's what you want to campaign for I suggest that's more of a right wing position than a left wing one, but that's up to you.

The point remains that for those who think that excluding all males from all single sex spaces is too extreme, they have no way of stopping current or potential sex offenders getting GRCs and using women's spaces.

We have no flipping idea how lucky we women are in this country. The gender apartheid in areas if the Middle East and the treatment of women under the Taliban. The enforced hijab, even in the home. Honour killings, FGM.

If this treatment was being given to any population that included men, we'd call it a modern type of slavery and Ed Sheeran & co would be raising awareness.

Women's rights are hard fought but so easily taken. It's taken me years to accept this, and we're treading a fine line even in this country. I think the GRA needs repealing and I don't think women and young girls should be in any situation where potentially a man could use their space.

There's nothing that is worth that quite frankly & I'd prefer the Tories.

They aren't going to do it. They're using it as a vote winner for disillusioned women, and for those who hate LGBTQ+ people. They don't care how they get the votes, as long as they do.

The tories have made things so much worse for women over the last 14 years in a million different ways. Vaguely promising to look at the EA doesn't stack up against all the other harm they have done, and they will continue to do if re-elected.

I'm a gender critical woman. I believe in biological sex and sex segregated spaces and I don't like the thought of males in female spaces any more than the rest of you but we are where we are because of the tories. i do believe that labour have the best shot of improving life for women - not just middle class ones.

What concerns me is Sir Keir's refusal to acknowledge women do not have penises. Given he is so pro trans and is up to his neck in the activism and the donors, we have no idea what he has promised them, we know for sure however that he refuses to protect biological women.

With this in mind, it would not be difficult to water down our current arrangements and insist we see everyone as a woman, and therefore the right to female prisons/hospital wards etc. We have seen this in Scotland repeatedly. We have also seen cases in England. It has had dire consequences.

Starmer is not going to come out in an election and say he intends to make life much easier for trans sex offenders, but by definition, refusing to protect or even recognise biological women we risk losing the small gains we have made in the last few years.

Well how mean would it be to describe someone who’s had full gender reassignment surgery, has lived ‘as a woman’ for years, as a man? Transwoman maybe.

The only way to live as a woman is to be born female and survive to adulthood.

Legally, as it stands, some women do have penises. It's a fact. That's why he said it.

Oh do give over. It does not legally 'stand' at all.

So... Nobody born male holds a GRC then?

We're never going to have a criminal justice system where rapists are given whole life sentences. If that's what you want to campaign for I suggest that's more of a right wing position than a left wing one, but that's up to you.

I'm aware of that don't worry. But i'd also settle for more rapists being brought to justice in general with harsher sentences than they receive currently. Not having any males in female single sex spaces won't make the massive impact some believe it will on the amount of women being raped and assaulted. Statistically 5 in 6 ae attacked by a man they know and within that, 50% are by a current or ex-partner.

I just hate how this is the 'womens issue' that has dominated this election cycle and most others have not had nearly enough light shed on them. I want the parties to be put to account on their maternity leave policies, female healthcare, how the cost of living crisis disproportionately effects women and how lack of affordable housing traps women with their abusers. Its just a shame that the wider discussions aren't highlighted.

The GRA is a legal fiction. Male people are not actual women. Women are female. You could make a law that dogs are people and have the same rights and responsibilities as humans. But they'd still be dogs, not human beings.

Yes but that does not give them a free pass to all female prisons. Nor does it change who they are biologically.

Males with a GRC are not exactly the same legal status as women. There are exceptions to both the GRA and EA.

KS is not 'pro trans' he's just not anti-trans, it's not an either or option.

Considering KS previous career and his care for our justice system and the fact he has specifically said about female only spaces. You don't want to believe that? Who are you voting for in that case who will protect all biological women? Because Labour are protecting us in regards to tackling the massive rape crisis we have going on, wanting to tackle the misogyny ingrained in society and being fed to our teenage boys.

You are deluded if you think Labour will even dent this statistic. There is far more to it than simply numbers on a sheet. We would need a whole sale culture change, for the courts to completely change the way hearings are held etc etc. The biggest hurdle is for the shame and stigma to be removed. Starmer just uses it as something to wave at women, knowing full well nothing will change. He does not care about women at all.

Nice analogy there. The GRA was written to encompass the rights given to Trans people under the ECHR. It does mean that legally you change sex. At the time it was written, the issue hadn't exploded to the levels they are now. The Tories haven't said they'll repeal it.