Help protect children from gaming harms.

Take our survey

Please or to access all these features

Genealogy

Can anyone clever help?

30 replies

unclemystery · 02/09/2026 21:01

Because my brain is mush after much searching!
I’m using ancestry. My gran had 2 siblings, a sister and a brother. Her sister popped up instantly via the hints. Nothing for her brother. I’ve searched every which way and confirmed names with family
I have his name but not his DOB, and his wife’s first name
it’s like he never existed but 2 family members have both confirmed he did and his wife’s first name
any other ideas? I’m happy to share names as I have NC!

he doesn’t come up as a son to my grans parents either, I didn’t know he existed until I was told as he’s so absent from the tree Confused

OP posts:
FoundAUserNameDownTheSofa · 02/09/2026 21:06

I think hints tend to come from other people’s family trees, so if no one else has added him to a family tree already that makes it more tricky. And then searching for him may be tricky if he has a common name or went by a name that wasn’t his actually first name.

When was your gran born and was he older or younger?

Notmytelescope · 02/09/2026 21:08

Can you check the census. If you find your grandmother and aunt in the census it should tell you who they were living with and their age. It would help you narrow down a birth year?

unclemystery · 02/09/2026 21:12

FoundAUserNameDownTheSofa · 02/09/2026 21:06

I think hints tend to come from other people’s family trees, so if no one else has added him to a family tree already that makes it more tricky. And then searching for him may be tricky if he has a common name or went by a name that wasn’t his actually first name.

When was your gran born and was he older or younger?

She was born in 1920, my dad thinks he was younger but can’t be sure

this side of the family has already thrown up that my gran had twins and had them adopted so TBH anything could be possible

OP posts:
HighburyHope · 02/09/2026 21:13

PM me if you like and I will have a look.

unclemystery · 02/09/2026 21:13

Notmytelescope · 02/09/2026 21:08

Can you check the census. If you find your grandmother and aunt in the census it should tell you who they were living with and their age. It would help you narrow down a birth year?

Ahh

1921 census my gran is on but he isn’t so he must be younger

OP posts:
HighburyHope · 02/09/2026 21:15

Have you found the family in the 1921 census? 1939 Register?

Have you looked for uncle’s death to find his age/birthdate?

FoundAUserNameDownTheSofa · 02/09/2026 21:16

unclemystery · 02/09/2026 21:13

Ahh

1921 census my gran is on but he isn’t so he must be younger

Not necessarily, my grandma’s younger sister was living with childless aunts when her widowed mother couldn’t cope, in the 1920s.

HighburyHope · 02/09/2026 21:17

Cross posted re 1921 census.

Have you looked on FreeBMD for births with surname X and mother’s maiden name Y?

unclemystery · 02/09/2026 21:22

HighburyHope · 02/09/2026 21:17

Cross posted re 1921 census.

Have you looked on FreeBMD for births with surname X and mother’s maiden name Y?

I may have found him with that… ancestry is throwing up a cloudflare issue so I’m waiting Ito see

OP posts:
ElizaMulvil · 02/09/2026 21:34

Re the census, people can be absent for all sorts of everyday events- staying with a relation eg. Names are not straight forward, many people give a pet name instead of their legal one. Others just lie ( because they don't want to outed (they've lied to their spouse re their age eg ) or the official misunderstands the situation, thinks the grand children are their children etc . Sometimes you may have expected them to eg in London but they've returned to eg Ireland. I've had all of these. Even a mistake on a birth certificate where relative gave her mother in law's name as the mother instead of herself! I used to naively believe official documents - not anymore .

unclemystery · 02/09/2026 21:44

ElizaMulvil · 02/09/2026 21:34

Re the census, people can be absent for all sorts of everyday events- staying with a relation eg. Names are not straight forward, many people give a pet name instead of their legal one. Others just lie ( because they don't want to outed (they've lied to their spouse re their age eg ) or the official misunderstands the situation, thinks the grand children are their children etc . Sometimes you may have expected them to eg in London but they've returned to eg Ireland. I've had all of these. Even a mistake on a birth certificate where relative gave her mother in law's name as the mother instead of herself! I used to naively believe official documents - not anymore .

I’ve found a birth in 1935 which I think is him. No marriage records that I can see but I don’t know if he WAS married to her or someone else and she was a second partner etc

my new relative is having a nightmare finding any info for his adopted dad. It was only me doing my DNA that we found out my gran gave him up for adoption at birth

OP posts:
ExOptimist · 02/09/2026 21:56

Look on the 1939 Register to see if he is on there with parents of the same names as your grandma and her sister. You can search the General Register office digital indexes and get a digital copy of a birth certificate for £3. That will show mother's maiden name too.
If you're being serious about research then you should be aware that most of the trees people put on ancestry have errors which get perpetuated when other people include them in their trees.
Don't assume anything is true until you've seen evidence to back it up.

unclemystery · 02/09/2026 22:29

ExOptimist · 02/09/2026 21:56

Look on the 1939 Register to see if he is on there with parents of the same names as your grandma and her sister. You can search the General Register office digital indexes and get a digital copy of a birth certificate for £3. That will show mother's maiden name too.
If you're being serious about research then you should be aware that most of the trees people put on ancestry have errors which get perpetuated when other people include them in their trees.
Don't assume anything is true until you've seen evidence to back it up.

Nothing. I’m giving myself a headache now searching
argh!
I have his name, I have his mothers maiden name matching a birth and that’s it
cant find a marriage records, anything connecting him to the 2 sisters or indeed the father

OP posts:
TheSquareMile · 02/09/2026 23:53

unclemystery · 02/09/2026 21:44

I’ve found a birth in 1935 which I think is him. No marriage records that I can see but I don’t know if he WAS married to her or someone else and she was a second partner etc

my new relative is having a nightmare finding any info for his adopted dad. It was only me doing my DNA that we found out my gran gave him up for adoption at birth

@unclemystery

OP, when you say "my new relative is having a nightmare finding any info for his adopted dad", do you mean that there is a family member who needs help with finding out about his own adoption?

Another2Cats · 03/09/2026 07:04

unclemystery · 02/09/2026 22:29

Nothing. I’m giving myself a headache now searching
argh!
I have his name, I have his mothers maiden name matching a birth and that’s it
cant find a marriage records, anything connecting him to the 2 sisters or indeed the father

"I’ve found a birth in 1935 which I think is him."

You can order a birth certificate from the General Register Office to confirm this. @ExOptimist mentioned that a digital image is £3 but that is only available for birth certificates up to 1926. For any birth from 1927 onwards you need to pay £12.50 for a paper certificate.

"...anything connecting him to the 2 sisters or indeed the father"

I would suggest, instead of looking for him in the 1939 Register, have a look for the mother.

Many records of people on that Register born in the 1930s are still redacted. If you have a look at the actual register on Ancestry you will see that the entry has been edited out and says "This record is officially closed".

Records are only unredacted after they reach the age of 100 or there is notification of a person's death. In can be a bit hit and miss though. For example, I have a relative who was born in 1937 and died in 2011 and their name is viewable on the Register. However, they had a brother who was born in 1936 and died in 2023 and his name is still redacted.

So, rather than looking for the brother on the 1939 Register, have a look for the mother. Then have a look at the actual entry on the Register and see if there are any redacted entries under the mother.

If there are then that will very likely be the brother. You can't be absolutely certain but it is evidence that the mother had another child living with her at that address.

"No marriage records that I can see "

Do be aware that even if you click on Location and select "Exact to country" that doesn't work at the level of the UK but it is separately for England and Wales and Ancestry doesn't have Scottish records at all.

Could it be that he married in Wales or Scotland? In this situation it would be best not to include location and/or also look on the Scotlands People website.

If he was born in 1935 then typically he would be getting married for the first time anywhere from 1953 to 1975. It may be that the name you have been given for his wife may have been a nickname or her middle name or similar and so it won't show up on the records.

You may have to just look for his name and location.

Alternatively, it may be that they never actually married. I had this with the relative I mentioned above who was born in 1937 and died in 2011.

I was aware from speaking to family that he had married twice and had five children in total. Two with his first wife and three with his second.

I could find his second marriage but there was no record of his first marriage. I knew the names of the children and their rough ages so I was able to find their birth certificates. From there I was able to get the surname of his first 'wife'.

Even with that though, I still cannot find a marriage certificate. This is odd as it was very rare indeed for couples not to marry in the 1960s and 1970s when they had children.

unclemystery · 03/09/2026 07:59

TheSquareMile · 02/09/2026 23:53

@unclemystery

OP, when you say "my new relative is having a nightmare finding any info for his adopted dad", do you mean that there is a family member who needs help with finding out about his own adoption?

Nearly - I was contacted by a man who is carrying on researching his dads adoption after his dad died
it turns out his dads mum was my gran. I did an ancestry DNA which threw up the connection between me and this guys son
There’s a rumour in my family that it was twins she gave up for adoption. No father on the birth certificate

OP posts:
TheSquareMile · 03/09/2026 09:41

unclemystery · 03/09/2026 07:59

Nearly - I was contacted by a man who is carrying on researching his dads adoption after his dad died
it turns out his dads mum was my gran. I did an ancestry DNA which threw up the connection between me and this guys son
There’s a rumour in my family that it was twins she gave up for adoption. No father on the birth certificate

In that case, it might be helpful for him to speak to PAC UK's FamilyConnect Advice line, to see what they might advise.

https://www.familyconnect.org.uk/familyconnect-advice-line/

FamilyConnect Advice Line - FamilyConnect

Our specialist telephone advice line is here for you, whatever stage of your journey you are at. We can provide information, support and guidance about tracing your family origins, what services are available and whether you are able to access funding....

https://www.familyconnect.org.uk/familyconnect-advice-line

unclemystery · 03/09/2026 10:06

TheSquareMile · 03/09/2026 09:41

In that case, it might be helpful for him to speak to PAC UK's FamilyConnect Advice line, to see what they might advise.

https://www.familyconnect.org.uk/familyconnect-advice-line/

Thank you, I’ll pass that over
he is waiting on some records but there’s an asbestos issue(!) and records have been moved
its just how to find out if his dad was a twin, if the twin is still alive and also who the father was. Believed possibly a soldier

OP posts:
TheSquareMile · 03/09/2026 10:16

OP, have you looked at the original page of the GRO Register for the entry for his father?

If he were a twin, there would be two almost identical entries close together on the page.

I mean something like

Collins Michael Steven

Collins Richard Alfred

Cotopaxi · 03/09/2026 10:18

Agree with a pp who mentions that you cannot always rely on information on Ancestry (or any other genealogy site) if it has been uploaded by other individuals posting their family tree research. People make mistakes, and once they are online they can be perpetuated by others using the data to fill in their own trees. You need to confirm everything by finding the original source documents - census, BMD records, parish registers, wills, apprenticeship papers, passenger lists and so on.

Also bear in mind that transcriptions of original records can have spelling mistakes in them, particulary if the work was done digitally or was carried out elsewhere in the world. One of my ancestors is shown as being from Taffenham. If the record had been transcribed by people familiar with the London area, they would have known it was Tottenham!

TheSquareMile · 03/09/2026 10:24

TheSquareMile · 03/09/2026 10:16

OP, have you looked at the original page of the GRO Register for the entry for his father?

If he were a twin, there would be two almost identical entries close together on the page.

I mean something like

Collins Michael Steven

Collins Richard Alfred

The page will look like this.

Can anyone clever help?
unclemystery · 03/09/2026 11:50

TheSquareMile · 03/09/2026 10:16

OP, have you looked at the original page of the GRO Register for the entry for his father?

If he were a twin, there would be two almost identical entries close together on the page.

I mean something like

Collins Michael Steven

Collins Richard Alfred

I haven’t - his son had to order his birth certificate and it took ages for some reason
there doesn’t seem to have been much paperwork done, his adoptive mum was in hospital following a baby loss and was simply handed another baby

OP posts:
unclemystery · 03/09/2026 11:56

I’ve just found the page and no, doesn’t seem to be anything. My auntie is adamant my gran had twins (she’s the only one in the family that knew anything) but…

OP posts:
TheSquareMile · 03/09/2026 11:59

unclemystery · 03/09/2026 11:56

I’ve just found the page and no, doesn’t seem to be anything. My auntie is adamant my gran had twins (she’s the only one in the family that knew anything) but…

@unclemystery

In which year would the twins have been born?

unclemystery · 03/09/2026 12:34

TheSquareMile · 03/09/2026 11:59

@unclemystery

In which year would the twins have been born?

Dec 1944

OP posts:
Swipe left for the next trending thread