Thread 22 Covid Cohort - Creeping towards the Future - Personal Statements and Interviews

[OrangeCinnamonCocktail]

This is a thread for supporting all young people post GCSEs 2020, regardless of their educational setting. It is respectfully requested that all are supportive and helpful to each other. If you want to start a debate, e.g state vs private, please don't within this thread. Please also be sensitive when responding to threads about grades.

Some of us have been here since first thread back in yr10, some will be new. Everyone has been friendly and helpful in the past. Everyone is welcome. It is hoped this will continue.

Our DS/DD may go down various paths (such as employment, apprenticeships, higher ed) We have decided for anyone interested they will most likely find us within the Further Ed board.

Previous thread
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/further_education/4370509-Thread-21-Corona-Cohort-Nervous-waiting-so-frustrating
Role Call below
@20newnames / DS / Engineering
@Alsoplayspiccolo / DD / English + Film
@AnneofCleavage / DD / gap year? Primary Education
@BlueMarigold / DD / Biology
@crazycrofter / DD / Child (?) + Mental Health Nursing
@Decorhate / DS / Economics + Politics
@Delphigirl / DS / Oceanography
@DoggerelBank / DS / tbc sciencey
@ealingwestmum / DD / Middle Eastern and European Studies
@EerilyDisembodied / DS / History or Environmental Management
@estherfrewen / DS / History
@EwwSprouts / DS / Biology
@Fiddlersgreen / DS / Journalism
@Fruitygal / DD / Biology
@Hattifatteners / DD / Vet Med
@Heifer / DD / Biology
@Hopeful201 / DS / Medicine
@Horace123 / DS / Classics
@icanbewhatiwant / DS / History + Philosophy
@Isthisjustnormal / DS / Comp Sci
@KingscoteStaff / DD / Medicine
@mummabear74 / DD / Environmental Science
@mummyinbeds / DS / Law + French Law
@Nard75 / DS / Maths
@NCTDN / DD / Liberal Arts
@Oblomov21 / DS / Accountancy
@OrangeCinnamonCocktail / DD / Music (uni)
@PaddingtonPaddington / DD / Music (cons)
@Piggywaspushed / DS / Social sciences combo
@ProggyMat / DD / Classics
@SandyBayley / DD / Medicine
@Seeline / DD / Liberal Arts
@singingstones / DS / Neuroscience
@Wheresthebeach / DD / gap year? Marine Biology
@whoamitojudge / DD / Cabin crew training
@Zebracat / DD / Liberal Arts or Anthropology
@ZittiEBuoni / DD / applying next year

Regarding online and prerecorded- Warwick biological sciences an issue,courses at UCL, a couple of courses at Leeds …. Some unis using covid as an excuse to save money and cut corners. A live online interactive lecture is acceptable during lockdowns but not now. Prerecorded lectures are never acceptable - for most STEM courses they will be out of date before they launch as Achebe moves quickly and a decent lecturer adapts the lecture in response to his audience reaction and uses uptodate references. Also he/ she clarifies points at he/she goes along to support students. I think students will vote with their feet and unis not providing in person teaching will struggle going forward.

Visited Nottingham today, regretted taking dh as he managed to get into a huge argument with dd over politics. So unnecessary! But despite that she really liked it and it’s leap-frogged over Southampton now into first place.

@whatsnext2 in theory they are all doing lectures on line and small groups F2F, but each dept can choose to do everything on line and some seem to be doing that, particularly in “top” universities like Leeds, Warwick, St Andrews. There is general concern that some universities are heading in that direction, possibly as a permanent post Covid thing, and universities are not being transparent about it.

• science ……..not whatever that crazy word above says!

@crazycrofter glad she loved Nottingham it’s a lovely place! Having a Dad with different political views is probably useful when studying the subject but not the best for it to come out in an open day

@Monkey2001 from our uni visits and chat amongst DCs friends studying etc it appears that some uni courses are fully f2f with mitigation (masks) and ventilation. (often offering the additional option of online live lectures to CEV etc).Exeter Penryn is like this and Oxford for some courses.

Others are mostly f2f except particularly large lectures where several courses in first year do generic modules - Durham is fully f2f for my DC course except for 1 large cell biology lecture per week, Cambridge have courses like this too plus Lancaster and Portsmouth.

Others are live online lectures with labs, tutorials and seminars f2f. York and Sheffield appeared to be this for courses we know about . Leeds reports it is this but we know 3 kids there - 1 has this, 1 kid is not live but prerecorded with 1-2hrs f2f (planning on transferring to another uni next week) 1 has mostly f2f?!

We found lecturers in unis that where the uni has one policy they have decided on another - my DD on hearing a lecturer thought prerecorded was as good as live in person ‘as 50% kids don’t get out of bed to come to the lecture’ decided to remove it from her 5. It was clear he wanted to focus on his research and covid was a great excuse not to teach and avoid undergraduates. I am hoping kids vote with their feet and unis that offer fully f2f thrive. Having experienced all types of teaching f2f in the lecture theatre with a lecturer who interacts with students and peers get a chance to socialise and interact is far superior with added live lecture capture so you can watch back areas you struggle with is the best option.

DCs need f2f interaction and if a cramped seminar room is ok then a large lecture theatre where they face forward and ventilation is often far better is much safer. I think asking questions and asking about covid teaching plans for 2022 are so important. Everywhere is open why not unis?

@crazycrofter is she leaning more towards child or mental health nursing atm?

Someone (possibly @ealingwestmum) asked about the extra information Durham asked for by email. DS has filled in the collage preferences but says that’s all that needs to be done (apparently school said the personal statement is designed for students who could benefit from a second statement if their Durham course was slightly different and the UCAS personal statement not specific enough for the Durham course). No idea if that’s correct. Wondered what other DC are doing?

Looking for some reassurance for my DD… she still hasn’t sent off her application yet. The school will send them off all together in December. She is worried that she won’t get any offers and was crying about it last night. What can I do to reassure her?

Thanks so much @Horace123, that’s how she’s interpreted it but then doubted herself. We weren’t sure why you would need to input all your exam data when it’s in UCAS. Her PS was pretty generic so she’s left that too.

@BlueMarigold I’ve not got any experience but loads of us here are in the same boat and dd says none of her friends (other than Oxbridge/medicine) have sent theirs either. She’ll be fine!

@Fruitygal she’s sure on mental health nursing, but she’s not really thought enough (in my opinion) about the dual option with child nursing too. She just says there’s no harm in applying for it, as it just adds and doesn’t take away! Hopefully we’ll be able to get to the Leicester open day and find out a bit more about child nursing so she can decide whether she actually wants to do both. Nottingham only does single mental health but I think she’d still apply there anyway.

Thanks @Crazycrofter, I think she’s just suddenly got all anxious about it. I don’t know why.

I really don’t understand why schools/colleges hang onto applications once they are ready to go. Obviously if they have had a lot of students doing early entries they need some time to get the references etc done for the other students now.

Not wanting to add to anyone’s anxiety, but Ds’ school has encouraged them to get on with it ASAP & has used the phrase “first come first served” & given that unis may make less offers than in the past due to the problems over the past two years, I think that is wise.

An email or phone call might be in order?

I wonder if there is some anxiety on the schools/college side, given what has happened the last two years. We are experiencing similar here.

I'm just thinking that some places may want to be absolutely certain they give a predicted grade that is realistic for whatever reason. Not saying this is the right approach though!

I have heard "first come, first served" too. DS is about to start extra physics at a little place that does tutoring but also runs lessons during the day for kids who are not in school for whatever reason. The woman there reckoned it would be very tough this year, and they submitted all applications before the Oxbridge deadline. As far as I know though, the official line is still that there's no advantage to applying early and everyone who applies before the January deadline has an equal chance?

@BlueMarigold my DSs went off in late November and December and they got 3 and 4 offers between them. DDs is with school for past 2 weeks but won’t go off until this week. Lots of mums have kids in grammars and private schools who will send Oxbridge and medicine in September/October and then round up their other students to submit in mid October before half term. 6th form colleges are generally November and December. Sending all together is a bit weird - normally sent in batches once per week from November just for practicality. Send her a hug from me - she will get offers.

@ealingwestmum when we went to virtual Durham open day the biological sciences course recommends the second PS if you have applied for medicine and this is your 5 course (which has to be a different subject not medicine) obviously a medicine PS will be different from a biosciences one hence the opportunity to write a Durham specific PS. Hope that makes sense. I assume if you had mixed courses on your ucas for other reasons it could also be useful.

@crazycrofter we liked Leicester for biological sciences - staff engaged and organised with strong links to businesses for placements and to the local hospital (not helpful for DD as she’s biological rather than biomedical but would be great for your DD). We had been there for DS 5 years or more ago and loads of fab new buildings redesigned student Union and new accommodation. Also peeked into Law which looked fab too!

General comment Re business school ( not relevant to your DD but might be helpful for some in this thread. We also looked at business school for economics (as in June she was not set on biological sciences) but the lecturers were few and far between and all did not seem well not a good atmosphere - clearly issues.

Makes perfect sense Fruitgal, thank you.

@Fruitygal it is true that where on line lectures have been available, some students have chosen them over F2F for years, prior to Covid. Bristol has an issue that student numbers are so high for core Engineering modules that they were relaying lectures to a second lecture theatre pre-Covid and many students chose to watch when they wanted. DS1 likes it and is not at all bothered that St Andrews is keeping all lectures over 35 on line, but his lectures are live and he gets plenty of other F2F teaching in dissection/labs/seminars. He has never been good at getting up in the morning, so watches in bed or later, but it has not negatively affected his learning as he just got a very high mark for the first proper exam of the year. As others have said, it can be helpful to speed through easy bits and watch tricky bits a few times. I think it is much more of an issue for courses with fewer hours of non-lecture teaching.

I do think universities should be honest about it.

Dd equally frustrated and anxious about UCAS application. School has stressed importance of getting it in early but are now sitting on with no explanation having said it was ready to go. DD is planning to chase on Monday.

We are off to Plymouth on Saturday. Hoping DD likes it.

@Monkey2001 Live lectures are ok as an alternative and recorded lectures were not common place before 5-8 years ago as I supported a campaign for better access to recordings to support those with dyslexia - to be able to review the sessions. DD has applied to York but their total hrs are 25 per week of which lectures are around 1/3 currently mainly online lectures. So like you say with your DS still a great interactive experience with 12-16hrs of seminars, tutorials and lab time in person. In contrast, Friend's DD at Leeds has 12hrs per week with 1 hr in person - was not made clear prior to applying or on offer day.

As for Bristol this appears to be the same issue that Warwick has this year. It is easily remedied - Durham, Leeds and Exeter offered large sums for deferral to attempt to avoid over crowding. Other universities have taken students they have no space to teach or don't want to spend money having two lecture halls and two lecturers employed so do it all online. Pre-recording is the poorest type of lecture.There are cases where unis continue to use videos of lecturers that have left the uni employment 2-3 years ago and one case where the lecturer had died and they were still using his pre-recorded content.

On the flip side 5 of my DS's friends are doing the same course and one module has a very poor lecturer who used old slides from his former employer (logo not even removed of the institution) in a f2f lecture. The previous lecturer who left last year was excellent and due to covid had recorded his live lectures and left them on the university student portal so during an in person lecture they watch the other guys lecture on their laptops with headphones in ! :))

@Fruitygal the Bristol issue of some courses too big for the lecture theatres is not to do with 2021 results, but the massive growth of universities. When I went in the late 80's there were 7,000 students, now there are 22,000.

I think that as long as universities are honest about teaching methods it is fine to have lectures on line, and students who don't want that can choose other courses, but it is NOT fine to do it by stealth so students are not getting what they contracted for.

[quote Monkey2001]@Fruitygal it is true that where on line lectures have been available, some students have chosen them over F2F for years, prior to Covid. Bristol has an issue that student numbers are so high for core Engineering modules that they were relaying lectures to a second lecture theatre pre-Covid and many students chose to watch when they wanted. DS1 likes it and is not at all bothered that St Andrews is keeping all lectures over 35 on line, but his lectures are live and he gets plenty of other F2F teaching in dissection/labs/seminars. He has never been good at getting up in the morning, so watches in bed or later, but it has not negatively affected his learning as he just got a very high mark for the first proper exam of the year. As others have said, it can be helpful to speed through easy bits and watch tricky bits a few times. I think it is much more of an issue for courses with fewer hours of non-lecture teaching.

I do think universities should be honest about it.[/quote]
At Reading, when asked, the lecturer made the point that some students prefer pre-recorded online as they can watch them when they want, but others -because they can watch them when they want- don’t.

He also made the point that they don’t know what next week will bring, let alone next year, so impossible to guarantee all f2f.

However I do agree that universities should be transparent about their ongoing policies, otherwise you are basically paying a fortune for what is in most respects an Open University degree

The problem people have is that many universities are not being transparent, have no written policies plus often f2f versus online varies between courses and many will duck the question with 'some students prefer pre-recorded' , 'lots of students don't attend 9am lectures' or COVID means we can't guarantee. My DD emailed a uni that had two lecturers at the same open day say very different things re lectures. The email received back did not clarify the situation. This uni does not feature on her UCAS form. Recording and posting of lectures online should complement not replace in person teaching.

There are no COVID mitigations in schools, colleges, many workplaces and social spaces like cinemas etc; but unis are different? Why? (I personally mask up but in a world where it's no longer mandated I find strict online policies very odd).

It's a bit like buying tickets to a west end show at £95 per head for a family of four and overnight accommodation in London 2 x rooms at £165 each then the theatre phoning you up once you are at the hotel 2 hrs before the performance on the day to tell you they have sent a link via email and you can watch a pre-recorded performance on your phone or laptop at the hotel. You would ask for a refund ...Unis will not give refunds or any monies back so make sure you know what it is you are buying and are happy with it.