Visit to abbotoir before veg. child allowed to be meat eater?

[poppynic]

My dp is a ultra-committed vego and decreed that if he had children they would have to be vego. Being desperate and clueless at the time I said, sure, whatever. We have now got through 4 years of vego child.

I asked dp when child could decide for himself. He said 5. Now child (4) is saying he wants to be a meat eater when turns 5. Dp wants child to visit abbatoir first . I'm a big softy and don't think it's fair to put ds through that horror - virtual child abuse. But I want him to be able to be a meat eater if he wants.

What do you think - is an abbatoir visit reasonable for a 5 year old?

no, I would say not reasonable. I wouldn't want to see it & I'm 37 ! I can't bear the cruelty to animals & I'm haunted by things I saw years ago.

ALso, by the time your DS is 5, he might have changed his mind ?

FOr the record, I am veggie but buy organic meat (from local farm) for my DD to eat.

Do you think your DP is calling your bluff ? I would be inclined to (pretend) to go along with it.

Pruni, do you feel comfortable about 'forcing' other moral values on your child, eg not stealing, not hitting others etc?

For many if not most vegetarians, eating meat is a moral decision similar to those issues. It's not some sort of lifestyle choice, its about ethics.

I disagree that 5 years old is old enough to have a proper understanding of the issues involved. Having said that, poppynic, if you have said to ds that he can choose to have meat when he is 5, I think you are going to have to go through with it, even if you just let him try it or something.

Blimey. I wouldn't even watch an abattoir on TV and I'm an adult!

Making a 5 year old go is nasty. Shooting and eating a pigeon or rabbit is a bit more realistic although not something I would want my child to do at 5 particularly.

Let him eat meat if he wants to, you won't be able to stop him once he is at school in any case. He might come back to vegetarianism later on.

WigWamBam - I think it would be better to stay veggie than visit an abbatoir.

I also think that if dp has very strong views, then his discomfort with his son's meat-eating will show, and I'm not sure that's a good thing.

And I don't really have a problem with making choices for my 5 year old.

an abbatoir wouldn't let anyone visit. My mum used to work for MAFF inspecting them and due to health and safety I believe security/admittance restrictions is akin to an operating theatre.

My dh is strict vegi and dd was until about 2 - but she got quite poorly and lost a lot of weight/was off her food. I put my foot down and cooked her some sausages.

I think that kids should know where food comes from and also be aware that meat should be sourced from a reputable place - even if its just getting free range eggs rather than battery, and farm assured meat.

Strikes me your dp might want to make sure that your poor 5 year old never wants to eat meat ever again by traumatising him for good. Complete and utter madness.
Of course it's imperative that as adults, we understand where our meat comes from, what kind of lives the animals have led and how thay are slaughtered but a 5 year old is far too young to make this kind of judgement. Please don't give in to this.

Seeing that might be like watching a certificate 18 horror movie to a child, it make make the child have nightmares and be upset for a very long time , or it might not , but why risk it?

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we are veggie as is dd and we always said we'd let her choose, she tried meat once at nursery (staff error) and asked where meat came from (she was about 4) we told her in non graphic terms and she decided she did n't want to eat it again I would never take her to an abbotoir but believe she had a right to know what meat is

Yes, I think it is akin to a religion in many ways and I don't think your point was crap, even though I am not sure if I totally agree

I find that most people have less respect for vegetarian beliefs than they would for religious beliefs

I don't always find my opinions on things fit in with those of society's, but still hope to bring ds up with values close to my own. I can only speak for myself, but for me, you can't compare stealing with the murder of an animal. Stealing is about objects, eating meat is about living creatures being killed.

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I agree with Franny people take vegetarian beliefs far less seriously than religion but strangely enough if someone is vegie for religious reasons they seem to get a far better response

I don't have any problem with committed vegetarians enrocing vegetarianism on their children. We all impose our social and moral preferences on our children in a million different ways. It would be impossible to bring them up in a natural, honest and genuinely intimate way if we didn't.

I think the proposed trip to the slaughterhouse is an horrendous and offensive idea though, I'm afraid. I suspect the dp in question is hoping the very idea of putting a 5yo through that will bully his wife into surrendering. Which is pretty low IMO.

Whatever the finer points of debate, how are you going to feel as parents, if you do take him, and he is then is traumatised by it, eg nightmares or other problems.
My ds1 who is only a year younger, is frightened by Smarteenies for god sake. Don't risk it.

enforcing

am spun out about this damn meetup tomorrow

It's all cultural, Pruni, it staggers me what we can be brought up to think is acceptable when it is condoned by our culture

I wish I was a happy meat eater in some ways and then ds would not have to struggle with all this - I can already see the confusion it causes him.

Oh Greeny

breathe deeply into this lovely lentil filled paper bag

Oh, thanks Franny

You left the bloody lentils in there, you dozy mare!!!

I said it was lentil filled

you daft besom

It is not fair to expect a child of 5 to make a decision which runs so counter to the moral standpoint of one of his parents. It risks damaging their relationship IMO. I would keep him veggie. I have a ds of 5, and he is not daft, but he could not possibly weigh up all the consequences of a decision like this. Wait until he is older.

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Honestly, you will be the death of me

Anyway, get back to yer worthy discussion about vegetables, you twisty-faced moo

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